RTNM / UOP compatability...

[imrightyourleft]

Okay, total noob to this.

Got everything set up the way I should.

But how do I get the Really Textured Normal Maps mod to be compatible with the Unofficial Oblivion Patch?

Using OBMM, it says that there are conflicts when I try to activate both these.

So, how are you running RTNM and UOP at the same time?

[Striker879]

The UOP is designed and intended to "lose" in case of mod conflicts. The tools used to achieve this are install order and load order. In cases where a mod will overwrite files that the UOP has also altered then install order is used. In cases where a mod's changes via ESP will change the same thing as the UOP (let's say for example a particular vanilla NPC's AI package schedule) then load order is used (the game loads ESP files from the top of the load order to the bottom, so the last mod ESP in your load order "wins" any conflicts with ESPs above it).

 

Bottom line ... install the UOP and then install your other mods. If a conflict is reported, as in this case, you want the mod changes to "win" over the UOP so install them after installing the UOP and then make sure any ESP files that came with the mod are lower in your load order than the UOP ESPs (note RTNM likely doesn't come with an ESP, as it's a replacer ... install order is the key).

[imrightyourleft]

The UOP is designed and intended to "lose" in case of mod conflicts. The tools used to achieve this are install order and load order. In cases where a mod will overwrite files that the UOP has also altered then install order is used. In cases where a mod's changes via ESP will change the same thing as the UOP (let's say for example a particular vanilla NPC's AI package schedule) then load order is used (the game loads ESP files from the top of the load order to the bottom, so the last mod ESP in your load order "wins" any conflicts with ESPs above it).

 

Bottom line ... install the UOP and then install your other mods. If a conflict is reported, as in this case, you want the mod changes to "win" over the UOP so install them after installing the UOP and then make sure any ESP files that came with the mod are lower in your load order than the UOP ESPs (note RTNM likely doesn't come with an ESP, as it's a replacer ... install order is the key).

Ok I get it, thanks for that, but in terms of load order, how do I use OBMM to ensure all mods are loaded correctly, or does it do this automatically?

 

Also if one mod asks if I should overwrite certain files contained within another mod, should I do so?

[Jasmer]

 

The UOP is designed and intended to "lose" in case of mod conflicts. The tools used to achieve this are install order and load order. In cases where a mod will overwrite files that the UOP has also altered then install order is used. In cases where a mod's changes via ESP will change the same thing as the UOP (let's say for example a particular vanilla NPC's AI package schedule) then load order is used (the game loads ESP files from the top of the load order to the bottom, so the last mod ESP in your load order "wins" any conflicts with ESPs above it).

 

Bottom line ... install the UOP and then install your other mods. If a conflict is reported, as in this case, you want the mod changes to "win" over the UOP so install them after installing the UOP and then make sure any ESP files that came with the mod are lower in your load order than the UOP ESPs (note RTNM likely doesn't come with an ESP, as it's a replacer ... install order is the key).

Ok I get it, thanks for that, but in terms of load order, how do I use OBMM to ensure all mods are loaded correctly, or does it do this automatically?

 

Also if one mod asks if I should overwrite certain files contained within another mod, should I do so?

 

 

1.) You have to install the mods in the correct order. When I used OBMM/Tes Mod Manager I had a series of custom categories to ensure I installed everything in order, i.e. OBSE/utilities, unofficial patches, overhauls, new items, environmental mods, interface mods, textures, body replacers, sound/audio, mod patches. You want things to overwrite one another in the data folder kind of sort of in order so the things you want to see most show up in-game (i.e. I overwrite QTP3 with Lougian, Discovery1, Elbethien, and Tes Diesel stuff by installing them after QTP3). As for plugin load order, BOSS will sort that out. OBMM doesn't automagically refresh the load order unless you close and re open it, or deactivate/activate a plugin, but it will nonetheless remember BOSS's load order.

 

2.) If you're installing everything in order and you're installing, say, a texture replacer you want to see in-game even though it will overwrite files from the UOP or another texture replacer you already have installed, you shift+click "yes" to overwrite all in OBMM.

 

3.) Some unsolicited advice because this is something I learned recently, but I strongly recommend installing mods through Wrye Bash because if you set up your load order the way you want it in the bash installers tab WB pretty much does all of this conflict tracking and conflict losers/winners automagically. If you have time to convert your omods to bash installers and/or download the BAIN versions I highly recommend it. I don't use Tes Mod Manager for anything other than storing old mods I don't want to get rid of but don't really use (I swear I'm not a hoarder, I can quit when I want, I just don't want to) and BSA extraction. Also for the record if omod is what you want I found I liked Tes Mod Manager much better than OBMM, as it's pretty much just a new and improved OBMM. If you go the OBMM/TesMM route then take advantage of the mod categories feature.

[Striker879]

In OBMM (the left hand panel showing a list of all your mods if I recall correctly) you can click/hold and drag to move mods (or maybe you click to highlight and then click Move Up or Move Down buttons ... been a long time since I've used OBMM for anything like load order).

 

If you're looking for an automatic way to get the correct load order for all but the most obscure mods I suggest BOSS (a utility that sorts your load order). All the game uses for load order is file date and timestamps (so the only change BOSS makes to your ESPs is change their dates and times so that the game loads them in the correct order). If you do run into a mod that isn't recognized by BOSS you can use User Rules to set where BOSS will sort that mod when it runs (and if you report that mod here it can be added to the master list ... include the ESP file name and a link to the mod if possible).

 

Wrye Bash definitely has the most robust installer utility you will find for Oblivion.

 

If you use the manual method of installing it's up to you to figure out how to roll back overwrites if you decide to uninstall a replacer (with the exception of the case where the "overwrite" was only replacing files found in the vanilla game's BSA files ... e.g Oblivion - Meshes.bsa and Oblivion - Textures - Compressed.bsa ... those don't actually get overwritten just replaced in-game by using BSA Redirection, which is a method of archive invalidation used to get the game to use replacement textures instead of those found in the BSA files).

 

If you use OBMM to overwrite (as Jasmer mentions in point #2) it won't be able to bring back the overwritten files if you uninstall later (except of course in the replacing BSA files case as above).

 

With Wrye Bash's installer (called BAIN) the precedence of overwrites is controlled by the order that is found in the Installers tab list, and WB keeps track of which mod has overwritten which file so when you uninstall it can restore files that were overwritten (a process it calls "anneal").

 

Yes WB takes more effort to learn than OBMM but it is worth it in the long run. Chances are eventually to get around conflicts between mods you will need a bashed patch. That is a Wrye Bash exclusive feature that resolves conflicts and puts all the resolved conflicts into a single ESP named Bashed Patch, 0.esp that is placed at the end of your load order (so that all of those resolved conflicts get loaded by the game and not overridden by any other ESPs).

 

Most everything you need to know about using Wrye Bash is found in the two readme files, Wrye Bash General Readme.html and Wrye Bash Advanced Readme.html (both found in the Mopy\Docs folder).