Moraelin Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 This. the whole scene just struck me as weird considering the last game starts off with a headshot and does several good revenge stories while this one has baby napping and a murder and all you do is fight kellogg before joining apple. why would kellogg a trained super cyborg who knows they need them alive just shoot someone? thats like boba fett just braining han solo and going meh, screw the bounty i just like shooting people. and even if you say the institute didn't tell him they needed the parents alive, one would question why a bunch of geniuses would allow a psychopathic murder machine to do anything but stand at the door after the all clear. they had death robots by this point. 8 of them with orders to only shoot when told would have been more than enough. then theres the fact that they couldn't, as previously stated, explain the situation, are they're no parents amongst the institute? You are mistaken. Murderizing everyone, including one parent, was NOT Kellogg's idea. In fact, in the memory sequence, Kellogg distinctively says that he never understood why they couldn't just refreeze everyone and let them live. But he assumes that that was the "Old Man's" way of tying up loose ends. Presumably, the old man is the previous director of the Institute. Basically that wasn't Kellogg going nuts and trigger happy. Kellogg was under orders to murderize everyone except for the baby and one parent to be left as backup. If he could refreeze your spouse instead of shooting them, then that would have been the backup, and he would have disconnected YOUR life support. Kellogg is a self-professed heartless bastard, but he just does what he's paid. He doesn't kill for fun (and in the memory he states that he hates killing children in any case), but he doesn't just flip out and kill people for free. But yeah, his orders were to return with one baby, and leave one frozen parent as the backup. He did make a quick judgment call in changing which parent had to die, and which gets refrozen, but in the end he still did just what he was paid to do: retrieve one baby, freeze one parent, murderize the other parent and everyone else. If they left him at the entrance, well, the result would still have been the same. Except maybe they'd have shot Nate/Nora in the next room, if they can't get them back in the freezer. But the outcome wouldn't have changed, because that WAS the desired outcome ordered by the Institute leadership: one retrieved baby, one frozen parent, everyone else dead. Now, mind you, I'll agree with you and Dante that it was a bit unnecessarily stupid. But it wasn't by Kellogg's initiative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemunkey79 Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 The third specimen (especially when by good reasons hostile) was already again expendable from a scientific point of view. Which is the stupid part. No proper scientific research group is going to reject a perfectly viable source material subject just because they already have one or two already. 1. Primary sample: Infant Shaun2. Secondary sample: Player (backup)3. Tertiary sample: Spouse - (diversity and alternate backup) Not to mention an entire vault full of viable subjects for other non-synth related research. Honestly I would have preferred having the character wake up and simply be alone in a vault full of neighborsicles and have the spouse and Codsworth simply be "guests" of the Institute. No sense of time or what happened would have made a lot better story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboUK Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 Spending a bit more time pre-war might have been a better intro - get to know the neighbours, take a trip into Lexington for something at the super-duper mart. Maybe check Codsworth in for that checkup that's spoken about, stuff like that.Then have the news break out about the bombs dropping and have you try and fight your way back home during the ensuing riot. This is why I found myself not caring about the story at all, I had no attachment to the spouse or the odd looking baby, it's made worse if you select a female character, you spend most of that pre-war time in chargen where you have this guy standing in your personal space making the sort of creepy comments that would make you want to get a restraining order, after that it's a couple of lines of dialogue, a peek in the cot at this pink blob and then the bombs fall. For me this led to a disconnect from the player character right at the start of the game proper, she's all "Oh noes they stole my baby" while I couldn't care less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moraelin Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 This. Plus, I'm telling you, the baby I got... ye elder gods. Now that sure made it easy to not feel very attached. No way that that... thing was even mine. Hell, judging by how it had the narrowest, thickest and poutiest duck-face possible, I think Nora was sleeping around with Donald Duck :wink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboUK Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 This. Plus, I'm telling you, the baby I got... ye elder gods. Now that sure made it easy to not feel very attached. No way that that... thing was even mine. Hell, judging by how it had the narrowest, thickest and poutiest duck-face possible, I think Nora was sleeping around with Donald Duck :wink: I think Nora gets around a bit https://steamcommunity.com/app/377160/discussions/0/496881121380170234/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paton Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 (edited) She isn't dead :wink: www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3wA9B8B-xc Refrozen straight away I'd say. But Shaun's notes say that they took here a few days before Nate, and did what they could for her. Edited January 16, 2017 by Paton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattlerx5150 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 The thing that I dont get about the intro is that the soul survivor just walks away from the spouse.There should have been something where the survivor buries the spouse outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caedenech Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Spending a bit more time pre-war might have been a better intro - get to know the neighbours, take a trip into Lexington for something at the super-duper mart. Maybe check Codsworth in for that checkup that's spoken about, stuff like that.Then have the news break out about the bombs dropping and have you try and fight your way back home during the ensuing riot. Totally agree with that. If this is a movie that has time limit, I may understand. But this is a game, and one can spend 100 hours before even getting to Reunion (like myself). It would be so nice to see more of the pre-war world. I agree, I would've loved to see the vertibird crashing into the top of the Museum of History, while the curator runs out the front door. There are so many things eluded to in holotapes and terminal entries that could have made a really big connection to the player if we had seen them and felt them up close and personal. I understand that from a play-time stand point, these things could easily have been achieved, and from a modding standpoint, someone could potentially do this. But Bethesda's employees and designers had to operate based on a release date, which sucks, but they had to spend the time they had making the main game, even if that cost our connection to the personal life of our character. And, tbh with how much this game panders to the modern younger age of Minecraft players and FPS games, it's not surprising that that's how it played out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGadget1945 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Well this thread is back from the dead ! :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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