Lack of Criticism due to Commenting System Terms

[drhead]

From the moment I joined this site I have noticed that the terms and conditions for leaving comments make it nearly impossible for anyone to provide ANY negative feedback, even constructive criticism. There are a number of flaws in this website that cause this, I am listing them below:

 

1. "I won't endorse this file, here's why..." is broken. You can select an option, but you can't click "submit". I had to use Chrome's developer tools (basically same thing as Firebug for Firefox) to submit my reason for not endorsing a file.

2. If you download a file, play it, and then decide that it fails across the board, you are not allowed to comment on the file saying that it fails across the board. If nobody can say that they dislike a file in general, then how do other people know that people dislike a file in general? Also, what if the description is written poorly with lots of spelling and grammar mistakes?

3. Some developers have been spoiled by this system. When I commented on the "Yangtze Bunker" mod for FNV and left a negative rating after downloading and playing the mod because of the unbalanced gameplay, the developer left a nasty comment about how "people should know ahead of time that this mod is overpowered just by reading the description" (the description does not suggest this in any way) and my comment has been thumbed down 3 times. If people can do that for me providing my opinion, then I should be able to thumb down any comment I want. I don't blame the developer though, since with the previous two problems, pretty much everyone who provides feedback for anything is forced to be a yes man and cannot disagree with anyone.

 

I did not violate the terms of service in any way in this post. This is not intended to be threatening, offensive, attacking, or insulting in any way, and I have also provided solutions for the problems.

[amullinix]

Some would argue, if you didn't like it (even if you just didn't like it in general, and don't have a specific reason why, which is PERFECTLY acceptable), then why cast a vote to 'not endorse' it, if there isn't a specific reason why (using your 'general' example).

 

That's what 'some' would argue. As far as the issues with not being able to submit a negative endorsement, I would personally want to know if the other browsers were giving you problems as well (I don't endorse a file unless it has become a 'needed' mod, instead of a wanted mod, for my gameplay experience; my reason why I wouldn't be able to identify with your 'not working' issue).

 

I don't see a violation in your post either (but I am not a moderator), and you did provide subtle means of correction. It would seem the Descriptions aren't as descriptive as they could be in a lot of these mods. Might be something that needs to be looked into. I've also seen the same kind of issue you described, with no one seemingly capable of tactfully responding to criticism (also done tactfully). I'll watch this thread to see what responses it generates.

[bben46]

Your criticism was not reported as a violation.

You were not banned, given strikes or even a warning.

 

You criticized a mod, the modder replied to the criticism. It did not escalate into a flame war. You were each able to express your opinion with NO interference from an overzealous staff.

 

Now - what is your beef?

All too often, criticism on game sites is not helpful or polite. It is spiteful and meaningless. - Example: "I don't like your mod, it suks." Not polite or constructive, instead it's trolling and inviting a retaliatory comment that can lead to a flame war. That is what the rules are intended to stop.

 

Bben46, Moderator

[DarkeWolf]

Its all in the way that it's worded.

I've let plenty or reports go, with nothing done, when the post was a legitimate complaint. Tho, in some cases, I've left a message saying "Maybe this could have been worded differently?" Or talked to the poster in question via PM.

 

Stating problems that cause a mod not to work the way it's supposed to is part of the reasons WHY the comment section is there. BUT... its the same as in the other sections of the board. People can't sit there and trash talk each other, or talk down to each other, or insult each other.

And one thing that a lot of people on here forget is that we don't all speak the same language. English is the official site language, but not everybody here speaks it. Or speaks it fluently. A LOT of misunderstanding can happen due to misinterpretation.

 

One thing to keep in mind tho. How long has the mod been up? Is it a new release? How long has the author had, to be able to work on bugs with it? Keep in mind that not everybody has a whole lot of free time on their hands. And that for most of the modders here on the sites, this is not their job. They get to stuff when they have the free time to do it.

Giving a thumbs down, or an endorsement not to DL, without giving somebody a chance to fix something is seriously unfair to that person.

 

And, if the problem is incompatibility with another mod, you can't always expect a modder to be able to see that happening in advance. What? Should a modder play their mod with EVERY OTHER MOD that is on the site, to check for compatibility?

 

No. There is not any problems with speaking out about problems that are with a mod. The problem is in how the people making the posts say them.

 

As for the problem with not being able to post a don't endorse, I dunno. Maybe Robin has something going on there, or maybe it's a bug.

 

DarkeWolf, Nexus Staff

[buddah]

Enough this ends now.

 

Buddah

 

You had your say over and over and now it is personal attacks in pm's.

 

IT ENDS NOW !

[KDStudios]

Wow I read this when it was first created and at the start I kinda felt like I understood where he's coming from.

But to be honest I never use the negative endorsement. All mods can be helped out and improved one way or another.

So it's just best to pm the author or leave a comment suggesting improvements.

If people don't like it, you're not forced to reply to them.

 

Now that the moderators and admin have had their input, I have to agree 100% with Darkewolf.

You have to be careful in the way your word your sentences. Otherwise people will get the wrong end of the stick.

[Thandal]

...You have to be careful in the way your word your sentences. Otherwise people will get the wrong end of the stick.

;D Or give you the wrong end of it!

 

But seriously, read the discussion here: "Difference between constructive criticism and trolling", and you'll have a very good understanding of how to provide acceptable negative feedback, rather than the unacceptable flaming or trolling that too often occurs when someone doesn't happen to like a particular mod. :thumbsup:

[amullinix]

Enough this ends now. BuddahYou had your say over and over and now it is personal attacks in pm's.IT ENDS NOW !

 

Prime example why people who bring this sort of thing up, are never usually the ones that know how to do it tactfully and maturely. Unfortunate.

Edited May 23, 2011 by amullinix

[Vagrant0]

Enough this ends now. BuddahYou had your say over and over and now it is personal attacks in pm's.IT ENDS NOW !

 

Prime example why people who bring this sort of thing up, are never usually the ones that know how to do it tactfully and maturely. Unfortunate.

Which is usually why the system grates against them enough to speak up. For a site with over 2 million members, the majority have no problem leaving useful feedback, positive or negative. The user's inability to submit feedback probably has more to do with their browser (MANY sites that have custom scripting have issues with Chrome) or their connection between chair and keyboard than anything designed on the site. If I recall, the non-endorsement system doesn't allow commenting purely because the non-endorsement categories are usually fitting for what the "problem" was and anything after the fact can be left in a separate comment. But that's beside the point.

 

The point is that the system which currently exists, exists because for countless months old systems were abused and so were mod authors. Authors of mods provide those mods willingly for YOUR benefit. Harassing an author because they didn't explain something in a description, or because something about the mod wasn't to your taste only results in more work for staff, and a modder who is less inclined toward sharing their works. At one point there were groups of people purposely targeting authors and flaming them for personal grudges or mere entertainment. The system we have not isn't perfect, but it's the best system we have been able to come up with that allows ANY sort of negative feedback. You don't even need to endorse a mod to leave a comment... It is the decision of the user to non-endorse a functional mod just because they dislike it, just as it is their decision to rant in thread or PM about what they don't like, then complain that the system is flawed because they were banned for acting like a *censored*.

[antonkr]

I still do not understand how saying this: "I don't like this mod, textures are done way too sloppy and the voice acting sounds very bad and unfitting" would be considered flaming.