Fallout 4 Survival Mode Beta

[Eruadur]

In response to post #36264185. #36272420, #36280400, #36281620, #36294745, #36295480, #36307360, #36313620, #36340025, #36344490, #36347635, #36348020, #36368590, #36372830, #36372990, #36373850, #36382245, #36384055, #36384285, #36385985, #36391440, #36414355, #36422860, #36433295, #36440545 are all replies on the same post.

MagnaBob wrote: I have zero interest in survival mode. When it alphas all our systems via Steam, are we going to have disable it somehow or will it be an opt-in type option? (I eagerly await the Wasteland Workshop.)

Eruadur wrote: Seriously....?

ApolloUp wrote: It's a legit question... No need to be prickly, just answer it.

Starke wrote: It's an optional difficulty mode.

That said, I've got no idea if this new mod lockdown is just a function of them trying to keep the beta clean or a sign of things to come.

Eruadur wrote: @ApolloUp

I'm not obligated to answer stupid questions.

popcorn71 wrote: What...? Why are you posting a commenting saying that you won't answer the question? Why not just ignore it and move on? There is no point being nasty about it.

Snowskeeper wrote: Bob, as stated--repeatedly--in the above post, Survival Mode is an optional game-mode, which is currently in beta. If you have not opted into betas via the Properties menu on Steam, you will not have access to Survival Mode at all until it is completed and released. Not sure what the Wasteland Workshop has to do with anything.

Eruadur wrote: @popcorn71

I was simply conmenting on someone who thinks he can tell me what to say or what to do.
Just like you are doing right now ....

It's called freedom of speech. As long as I don't break any of Nexus' rule I can comment on any post directed at me or answer ( or not ) any question as I see fit.
And there's nothing you can do about it popcorn71.

I suggest you ignore people's posts in here because commenting on other people seems to make you irritable....?
:)

MokChaoticran wrote: This isn't a democratic nation it's a website. Flaunting your "freedom of speech" is useless and saying that you can say something just because it's legally allowed doesn't make it either valid or worthwhile. Your comment was neither, by the way. You're being belligerent.

Eruadur wrote: Like I care ?
:)

jbMnemonic wrote: My "Beta" setting was automatically changed by steam to not opt in for the survival beta. Thanks steam, you saved me a lot of trouble.

I wish anyway that gamebreaking exercises like this is not released as "Betas" as it is not, it is "Alpha" at best.

EbokianKnight wrote: ... Its definitely Beta. An Alpha test is an in-house test, non-public. Beta test means it worked enough that they need to extend their data set. Also you will always default to opt out with steam unless you actively opt in, and you can just opt out if you try it and get tired of it. There's nothing weird about this, and certainly nothing invasive. Bethesda didn't disable mods for everyone, just those in the test, which is reasonable. So there is nothing to support the idea that they're going to "turn off your mods" when the system is actually launched. Relax.

Obituary wrote: What everybody fails to mention is that while it is an optional difficulty mode, you probably will be forced to use Very Hard max if you don't want anything the new Survival difficulty brings.

popcorn71 wrote: If you don't want every thing that comes in the survival mode package then just wait for the geck to be released and mod in the features you like. The greatest feature of any (modern) Bethesda games is not the game its self, but the ability to tweak it the way you see fit.

Kronos7714 wrote: Yeah, I believe the question was more like, "Do you have to use the new Survival Mode versus the old Survival Mode, or are you forced to use the new Survival Mode, period?".

I am also interested in the answer to this.

Also, Eruadur, it's not a "stupid question", if you can understand the English language.
You also appear quite child-like, with your "Like I care?", and "I say what I want" nonsense.

I literally haven't heard, or seen, the phrase, "Like I care?", since I was probably.. 14 or so.

popcorn71 wrote: Supposedly the new survival mod will remain optional. No idea about the old survival mode though. Not that it will matter once the geck comes out. There will be plenty of overhaul mods for the hard core gamer out there and in my opinion that exactly the way it should be. Bethesda should have never gated the new hunger/thirst/sleep mechanics behind higher difficultly setting.

Options, Beth, Options. Ditch the current 'difficultly' settings and just change it to a 'damage' setting then make the hunger/thirst/sleep/save-on-sleep mechanics have there own options.

Crimsonhawk87 wrote: One word popcorn....consoles! I have a feeling that this update was made as it was for the console versions, as they will probably not have access to the sheer amount of mods that are/will be available to the PC modding community (pure speculation, mind you, but I'm willing to bet that this is the case). Most likely quite a few of these "issues" that people are having will be modded by the community post-GECK.

Eruadur wrote: @Kronos7714

I can read and understand English ( not my native language but still ).

Though I really think you are trying to read more into his question than what is really there...
And all because it's exactly the same thing you wanted to ask....
Very convenient isn't it?

But seriously: I couldn't care less about when you heard that phrase for the last time.
:)

Eruadur wrote: @Kronos7714 :2

Ok, read this then ....
"I have zero interest in survival mode."

Here he states he doesn't want to use survival mode... Not "a survival mode" but "survival mode" he doesn't want options he just doesn't want survival mode.

"When it alphas all our systems via Steam, are we going to have disable it somehow or will it be an opt-in type option?"

What's 'stupid' about that question is that you are free to choose your own difficulty.
And as he clearly stated before he doesn't want 'survival' mode anyway....so why ask a stupid question about if something can be avoided if you have a choice of selecting it yourself or skipping it altogether ?

Now leave me alone :)

jomoe18 wrote: then dont. simple as that. but yet u still feel the need to comment

xdustsmile wrote: Seriously....?

Yes. Seriously.

TheGhostface1973 wrote: @Eruadur
You talk about "Freedom of Speech"? So the OP has no "Freedom of Speech"??? He can ask question as he likes, even stupid questions, as you called it. You have the right to NOT reply to his comment. It's that simple. And besides that: There are no stupid questions, only stupid answers, like yours.

CMoth wrote: Despite the comments on "voluntarily opting in" I had to go in and opt out of it. I made no "voluntary" step to do anything, I was automatically opted in, possibly due to my season's pass.

But, it was simple enough to go in and correct the issue.

popcorn71 wrote: Steam remembers your beta opt in setting. If you had opted in to the previous betas you will stay opted in until you manually change the setting and opt out.

SVRGN wrote: Do you feel so alone, right, Eruadur?

@SVRGN

Nope, happily married, daughter, two dogs, cat, about 5 real close friends, crappy job....
Nah, I don't feel alone, I meet lots of people during the day....but thanks for caring!

You?
:)

[Eruadur]

In response to post #36408520. #36414110 is also a reply to the same post.

Shadow of Serenity wrote: Hopefully there'll be an option (or a mod) to separate the survival aspect from the difficulty aspect, Hard hits a sweet spot for me and I have very little interest in slogging through anything higher.

TheGhostface1973 wrote: I second this. It would be a shame if we could only play the survival aspect in Survival mode. Why not also put the eat, drink, sleep in the hard and/or very hard difficulty. It is totally unfair for players who don't want to play survival mode, but who want the "iNeed" aspect.

@TheGhostface1973

"Seriously?" :)
Juuuuuust kidding bro

But uhm, stop nagging.
"It's totally unfair to blahblahblah...."

You 'totally' lost when you threw in that 'wèèèeee! It's so unfaiiiiir'. <--- read that with a Eric Cartman voice :biggrin:

1) use Survival Mode like it's meant to be played: the highest difficulty.
2) wait for a 'iNeed' mod

Simple solution, right Ghostface ? :)

[dikr]

I have been testing the survival beta for two days on a new game and I am thoroughly enjoying it. Apart from some minor tweaks that are needed here and there it really makes this game shine.

 

FO4 isn't about chasing progress anymore and rushing through quest lines. It completely lost its slightly themeparkish, dumbed down character and is much more immersive now, as it forces you to live an actual LIFE. To think about resources, planning your journeys, avoiding encounters which are too risky and staging your assaults carefully.

 

A lot of things are suddenly much more important now; from SPECIAL and perk choices to bag space, beds, empty bottles, chemistry, cooking and wild Radstags (nom!). Another big game changer: you don't build a settlement just to sustain your puppet settlers anymore, you build it first and foremost to sustain yourself!

 

Additionally, the world feels more 'whole' without fast travel, while you roam around and live off the land, you discover all kinds of little hideaways. Filler content that was just fluff in vanilla but now has real value. Also the amount of random world encounters I experienced is much higher now that I actually use the world to travel, rather than the map.

 

Died three times so far (lvl 8 now); one-shotted by the Death Claw in Concord the first time I took a go at him, acid-showered to death in two seconds by an elite Bloatfly and once in a random encounter which was hilarious but I won't spoil it. If you scout out beds before you attempt dangerous things, the time lost isn't so bad. I see how it can be annoying but yeah, the whole saving mechanic makes the game much more exciting.

 

Compared to this, New Vegas' Hardcore mode was a stroll in the park and its exactly what the franchise needed: an actual challenge for experienced gamers in a game that is suddenly way more complex and interesting.

 

Only things that are missing in my mind, are portable bedrolls and backpacks. Also the console should definitely be enabled in the release version for stuff like debugging and to set the timescale to a more realistic value.

 

I applaud the folks at Bethesda who are responsible for advocating this game mode internally. <3

Edited April 9, 2016 by dikr

[Agammamon]

In response to post #36297220. #36298815, #36299420, #36303765, #36306040, #36307275, #36412135, #36413830, #36430550 are all replies on the same post.

Ethreon wrote:

 

 

 

In response to post #36250120. #36250875, #36253370, #36253890, #36255175, #36255675, #36255830, #36257015, #36257275, #36257890, #36257990, #36258140, #36258155, #36258325, #36258815, #36259625, #36263630, #36264205, #36273425, #36284645, #36285325, #36285380 are all replies on the same post.

Beantins wrote: Really looking forward to the new survival mode - but not the in-bed save system. So if I'm wandering the commonwealth and find a behemoth I need to leave and find a bed then walk back before taking it on or risk dying and losing a lot of progress??

I appreciate what they're trying to do but the glitches, bugs and irreversible player errors are too frequent for a checkpoint style of game-play.

I hope the Nexus community are able to come up with a workaround better than just a droppable bedroll, because real life happens and it's not always convenient to find a bed when you need to stop playing.

printerkop wrote: Exactly, don't take it on if you haven't slept shortly before, or you'll have to do everything again.

I had to replay an hour cause my game crashed, then i had to replay an hour because i stumbled on a brahmin with 5 mines around it, bethesda's little joke on us.

Don't worry, when the Creation kit is released these issues will certainly be adressed.

EDIT: the FOTM list has a mod that let you save now.

Beantins wrote: Case in point, just had a power cut! Hadn't seen a bed since I left my settlement over an hour ago. If you're in the countryside you're screwed haha.

I can see how it would ramp up the tension but the frustration wouldn't make it worth it in my opinion.

Like I said I'm looking forward to the other changes just not that one. Also I hope the console being disabled will only apply to the beta?

Baboo77 wrote: Last night I was taking the castle, I had avoided most of the fights on the way too the castle so my save was an annoying distance away, not super far but still a tedious run back when having to do it repetitively.
I set up a firing line and proceeded to lure the mirelurks out. Well, the stupid effin minutemen kept throwing their unlimited supply of molotov coctails at me instead of the mirelurks. I know it's unlimited cause I pick pocketed them empty on the 3rd try and they still had more to throw and I know it was at me they were throwing cause on the second try I was standing behind them and one turned around and chucked a bottle at me. After the 4th run back to the castle was quite annoyed by this so I got crafty. With some painstaking agro control and precise sprinting burst and a ton of chems to keep me alive I managed to get the minutemen killed by mirelurks and their own molotov coctails before proceeding to take the castle alone with Garvey.

Yeah, save on demand is pretty much a must in a game like this.

Castornebula wrote: I do hope the no save thing is as simple as changing a variable in FO4Edit or whatever they use now because I'd like to try this, but no way can I tolerate this save point idea.

It worries me that Bethesda are so blithely ignorant about how their game works, and the inherent instability of their own engine. At any moment I can get kicked to the desktop, not even an error message. The game will just randomly die.
The worst part about this is that the highest occurence of these CTDs happens when I approach settlements... otherwise known as PLACES WITH BEDS. Essentially guaranteeing I will lose the most amount of playtime in any given crash.

I could never play this game without saving on demand and that's all there is to it.

Scynix wrote: If your crashing was symptomatic across all players, yeah, they'd be stupid. I don't crash. Ever. Unless I install a ton of mods. I can name ten people who haven't crashed once. Maybe you should troubleshoot your computer?

Castornebula wrote: What a stupid thing to say. You don't crash therefore it's okay?
I crash, sometimes. Not always, but enough that saving on demand is better for peace of mind. Plenty of people have problems crashing and always have with Fallout 4, with Skyrim, with all the other Bethesda games running this engine. Mods or no mods.

Case in point: I've never had a single glitch, crash or performance issue with XCOM 2. But I'm not going to sit here and smugly blame other people's computers for the problems they've had to the point XCOM 2 is semi-notorious for it.

Czujny1982 wrote: So, you crash therefore something it's wrong with the game, yes? What a stupid way to think. And if you dont like no save on demand system, don't play survival mode. Simple.

Castornebula wrote: Something has always been wrong with this engine. It's never been known for it's stability. That's a simple fact. Try to actually read what I say before responding.

And let me explain this to you very simply. I want the features of survival mode. Just not this ridiculous save point system. It is nothing but an albatross around the entire mode's neck that is impractical for a myriad of reasons, the potential for crashing being merely one example.

Czujny1982 wrote: New save system is not ridiculous, it's more immersive.

Castornebula wrote: How the hell is it more immersive? Because you say so? Making a bed a save point is immersive? How?
Better yet, if you like it why can't it be an option? Why must this and the console disabling be imposed on all of us along with the features we actually want?

Hey I tell you what's immersive. No saving at all! Not even to quit. So you have to leave the game running. And if you die just once not only is your character erased but Fallout 4 is automatically uninstalled and removed from your Steam account.
How's that for immersive?

Baboo77 wrote:

So, you crash therefore something it's wrong with the game, yes? What a stupid way to think. And if you dont like no save on demand system, don't play survival mode. Simple.

So, deprive yourself of everything else survival mode has to offer because of a dumb save mechanic that doesn't need to be? What a stupid way to think.

How about toggles for save, console, and travel to provide everybody with the play experience they desire? Those looking for a real challenge can just exercise some will power and not turn those options on. Simple.

This isn't a MMO, multiplayer, or competitive game. It's a single player sandbox rpg, people should have the ability to customize their game to the way they like to play.

dikr wrote: Portable bed roll mods are a nice, realistic workaround to me. Being able to save anywhere, anytime to reload and retry indefinitely is in fact a big immersion breaker; the whole point of the survival mode is to create a much more exciting experience with incentives to be much more careful than you'd normally play the game.

Personally I'm for a survival mode with custom options. Where the base 'mode' determines the new difficulty settings + the realistic needs & diseases and the following options:

[x] survival mode

Fast travel preferences:
[ ] fast travel enabled
[x] fast travel only between settlements with supply routes (my pick!)
[ ] fast travel disabled

Saving preferences:

[ ] saving enabled
[x] saving only at beds, settlements & friendly towns
[ ] saving only at beds

Happy to say that the engine-gods are with me on this one though: bought a new system for this game and haven't ctd'd a single time yet.

Castornebula wrote: I would suggest that you exercise some self-control with regards to saving and reloading.
I know I can, and would use saves for peace of mind against crashes, glitches and needing to suddenly leave the game.

And I can't think of anything more unimmersive than using beds as savepoints, even with portable bedrolls. My character does not have narcolepsy.

Granted, options to tweak these "features" would be the best outcome for everybody. Hopefully if Bethesda stubbornly refuse to do so, modders will pick up their slack... as they always do.

printerkop wrote: It's immersively ridiculous.

Czujny1982 wrote: "Being able to save anywhere, anytime to reload and retry indefinitely is in fact a big immersion breaker; the whole point of the survival mode is to create a much more exciting experience with incentives to be much more careful than you'd normally play the game"

basically this...

but i already see that you are too much ignorant to understand this, Castor...

printerkop wrote: so if anyone doesn't agree with your point of view, he's ignorant ?
Think again, and again, till you get it right.

MagnaBob wrote: Remember Far Cry 2?

ShuraShmura wrote: I had an issue like that. It's might related to some .dll files that are missing or corrupted. Updating windows and your graphic card driver eventually will solve your problem. What you also can try is to very your game files.

Beantins wrote: Regarding immersiveness - the in-bed saving is not. The rest of survival mode is.
Dying and coming back to life is a game only concept anyway!
It will affect behavior in unnatural ways. Yes you might fear death a bit more but when death occurs instead of trying again from a point you chose yourself you have to go back to the last bed you were at. If there is something dangerous to do you will be forced to find a bed first then travel back from there.

Checkpoints work well in first person shooters that are well designed with only one path to follow, but not in an open world rpg.

Don't give me that rubbish about 'if you don't like it don't play it'. I do like the changes but not the saving system and I hope that it can be addressed by the modding community.

jbtheclown wrote: I modded in a sleeping bag (don't bother me about ruining the beta its a freakin sleeping bag ) and it works perfectly for me. I still only save rarely as im a fan of the concept but it makes things a lot simpler. Anyways after being in it so long my strategy has been a lot better. Set up safe houses and it works great, until the ck is out and we can customize it to our liking.

jbtheclown wrote: I crash maybe once every 2 weeks and that was because I had a bunch of mods on

You know about Dark Souls? Or, for example, DayZ? Or any game with permadeath? Fear of death makes things a lot more fun. I used to just run through hordes of enemies with my shotgun, now I have to use tactics and think twice before I even pull the trigger. For me saving at beds is just a nice game mechanic. For others it might be a pain in the arse. Mods are definitely going to help with this stuff.

 

 

 

Nope. It only does it for certain people, while certain other people see it as a bad thing and a hassle. I don't enjoy knowing that I can lose hours of playthrough in one second just because I don't have a quick way to save. You like it? Very neat, feel free to keep it. I don't like it and would enjoy having an MCM-like menu where I can customize the settings of the survival mode. I don't expect there to be any, but I can dream.

Brandy_123 wrote: Why don't they fix survival in the game by making your settlers actually defend the place in your absence. Over 400 defense and you still get complaints about 3 ghouls or a single green skin. Yes, there are synth implants. According to the institute, they want a seamless integration. Why does it matter if settlers are synth? They generate a random NON-institute encounter, so it should not matter at all.

Instead, we get more "add on" that will make your sanctuaries less and less a place you want to have a settlement, much less having a settler.

"Excuse me General, After you get over your Diphtheria, Hepatitis, Listeria and Gastroenteritis, go heal your Compound Fractured Tibia and Hip Dysplasia. There's a settlement, completely surrounded by a 10 meter tall concrete wall, with 200 turrets and 25 armed out settlers, that needs your help. It seems there's a ghoul, that lives across the map from them, that needs to be taken care of. I would do it myself, but I'm VERY busy walking in a circle around Sanctuary looking important. You should go find a bed so you can save this game or we may have this conversation again in 3 hours"

mwhenry16 wrote: Lol, spot on my friend, spot on!

printerkop wrote: ROFL !

Vicalliose wrote: @Brandy_123
Pretty much this.

The real problems I see with the mode are actually problems from the default game that are just exacerbated by all the new survival elements. Also that none of the new elements have an affect on anyone else, including all settlers and companions. The only added difficulty I've really had with companions is that they refuse to get their asses up until you jam a stimpak into them, which is probably the best use for stimpaks considering the things practically kill you but have no side-effects for anyone else.

Also, every time I hear someone mention Dark Souls when talking about a Fallout game, I just cringe. Comparing Fallout to any game that actually was properly designed around high difficulty or survival is just stupid.

Snowskeeper wrote: (Also: Dark Souls doesn't have permadeath. In fact, you don't lose any progress if you die--just your currency.)

lux113 wrote: Permadeath..

Closest thing to it I recall would be like 20 odd years ago - Ultima Online

You die - your screen turns black and white, the center of it anyway because now you just see in that part. You are a ghost - your belongings are there at your feet.. that sword you worked months to get - that armor... it will disappear forever in 15 minutes.

You can run to the city.. by foot - or hopefully run into a "wandering healer". The way you figure it, it will take about 5 or 6 minutes to get to town and get resurrected.. then the same time back - that only leaves you about 3 minutes to spare before your hard work at this game vanishes forever.

And even if you make it back in time - anyone could wander up and grab your stuff while you're gone. anyone. Hey, here's a player who looks like he's a Mage, maybe he'll resurrect me? Ahh, hell, I'm just wasting time and my stuff is going to disappear -- and as a ghost when you talk to a player it just says "OoOo OooOOo Ooo" .. so they have no idea what you are saying, but come on man, it's a ghost -- what do you THINK he's saying!

Anyway... that game gave a sense of serious repercussions for dying, and it was the last one that I recall really did before they dumbed down everything cause people whine so much about all the time they invested and it's just not fair losing that progress.

I LOVED the fear that that game with it's sub par graphics could cause in me because there was real risk involved. Now I'm spoiled like everyone else though, and I'm addicted to save points.. and if I have to go back through 10 minutes of gameplay I did before it's like it's the end of the world. What I'm getting at though... we lost something. Back then I would honestly get scared... shaking scared.... when I was 10 levels down in a dungeon and I knew there were no players anywhere around to resurrect me if I died... one screw up and I would lose weeks worth of gameplay. That was fun.

Crimsonhawk87 wrote: @lux....haha, no, permadeath in any incarnation is not fun. Having to re-do weeks, days, hours of game play is redundant and a poor business decision by any gaming company. There is a reason it rarely, if ever, exists in today's games: Consumers HATED it. UO got away with it because it was the first major MMO...once Everquest came along, the permaddeath thing pretty much died. It always amuses me to see people pining for the "good ole days", when sometimes, it is just better to let a sleeping dog lie.

evegrey21 wrote: Yeah Thats why I never ever Join the minutemen xD

I don't know why they *don't* do the MCM-like route - same way Project Nevada did.

Open up *all* the settings - hunger/thirst/sleep, how rare food/chems/ammo/scrap is, damage ratios, everything.

Throw in some presets (Easy/Normal/Hard/Survival) and then let the players tweak the experience to their taste.

Then there's no 'one-size-fits-all and no one is satisfied' problem. Heck - 90% of the reason they're even doing this change is because of the portion of us that wanted this added in.

If they did the above, then the guys who want to run this like an FPS and shoot mutants all day can do that, those of us that want a more 'immersive' experience can get it.

For example - while I like almost all of what they're doing, I *don't* like that they've turned off save anywhere (what, are we back on the Nintendo again? Enough with the checkpoint save), especially when after heavy modding even the best setup is a bit unstable and that's *on top* of the inevitable bugs. No fast travel? Dude, I just don't fast travel - you don't need to turn it off, if we don't want to use it we just don't. But there are times when you simply do not want to slog back to drop off loot.

[Deleted7103646User]

In response to post #36468930.

dikr wrote: I have been testing the survival beta for two days on a new game and I am thoroughly enjoying it. Apart from some minor tweaks that are needed here and there it really makes this game shine.

FO4 isn't about chasing progress anymore and rushing through quest lines. It completely lost its slightly themeparkish, dumbed down character and is much more immersive now, as it forces you to live an actual LIFE. To think about resources, planning your journeys, avoiding encounters which are too risky and staging your assaults carefully.

A lot of things are suddenly much more important now; from SPECIAL and perk choices to bag space, beds, empty bottles, chemistry, cooking and wild Radstags (nom!). Another big game changer: you don't build a settlement just to sustain your puppet settlers anymore, you build it first and foremost to sustain yourself!

Additionally, the world feels more 'whole' without fast travel, while you roam around and live off the land, you discover all kinds of little hideaways. Filler content that was just fluff in vanilla but now has real value. Also the amount of random world encounters I experienced is much higher now that I actually use the world to travel, rather than the map.

Died three times so far (lvl 8 now); one-shotted by the Death Claw in Concord the first time I took a go at him, acid-showered to death in two seconds by an elite Bloatfly and once in a random encounter which was hilarious but I won't spoil it. If you scout out beds before you attempt dangerous things, the time lost isn't so bad. I see how it can be annoying but yeah, the whole saving mechanic makes the game much more exciting.

Compared to this, New Vegas' Hardcore mode was a stroll in the park and its exactly what the franchise needed: an actual challenge for experienced gamers in a game that is suddenly way more complex and interesting.

Only things that are missing in my mind, are portable bedrolls and backpacks. Also the console should definitely be enabled in the release version for stuff like debugging and to set the timescale to a more realistic value.

I applaud the folks at Bethesda who are responsible for advocating this game mode internally. <3

true i must admit, if you've gotten used to it, it's a lot of fun.
Though i wish they would just add a menu to each bed that would simply let you save there without sleeping perse, and maybe lower the adrenaline a bit when you do save.

or atleast think about a way to let us save in some way or another, i could be happy with if you're allowed to save once each hour aside from beds.

And the console is just mandatory in a game that can be unstable at times, i must admit that the game is more stable then other Bethesda games, but sometimes you get stuck, and then we need atleast the TCL command to get out of it, cause if that happens a few times in a row, it might spoil the fun a bit.

[dikr]

In response to post #36468930. #36486615 is also a reply to the same post.

dikr wrote: I have been testing the survival beta for two days on a new game and I am thoroughly enjoying it. Apart from some minor tweaks that are needed here and there it really makes this game shine.

FO4 isn't about chasing progress anymore and rushing through quest lines. It completely lost its slightly themeparkish, dumbed down character and is much more immersive now, as it forces you to live an actual LIFE. To think about resources, planning your journeys, avoiding encounters which are too risky and staging your assaults carefully.

A lot of things are suddenly much more important now; from SPECIAL and perk choices to bag space, beds, empty bottles, chemistry, cooking and wild Radstags (nom!). Another big game changer: you don't build a settlement just to sustain your puppet settlers anymore, you build it first and foremost to sustain yourself!

Additionally, the world feels more 'whole' without fast travel, while you roam around and live off the land, you discover all kinds of little hideaways. Filler content that was just fluff in vanilla but now has real value. Also the amount of random world encounters I experienced is much higher now that I actually use the world to travel, rather than the map.

Died three times so far (lvl 8 now); one-shotted by the Death Claw in Concord the first time I took a go at him, acid-showered to death in two seconds by an elite Bloatfly and once in a random encounter which was hilarious but I won't spoil it. If you scout out beds before you attempt dangerous things, the time lost isn't so bad. I see how it can be annoying but yeah, the whole saving mechanic makes the game much more exciting.

Compared to this, New Vegas' Hardcore mode was a stroll in the park and its exactly what the franchise needed: an actual challenge for experienced gamers in a game that is suddenly way more complex and interesting.

Only things that are missing in my mind, are portable bedrolls and backpacks. Also the console should definitely be enabled in the release version for stuff like debugging and to set the timescale to a more realistic value.

I applaud the folks at Bethesda who are responsible for advocating this game mode internally. <3

printerkop wrote: true i must admit, if you've gotten used to it, it's a lot of fun.
Though i wish they would just add a menu to each bed that would simply let you save there without sleeping perse, and maybe lower the adrenaline a bit when you do save.

or atleast think about a way to let us save in some way or another, i could be happy with if you're allowed to save once each hour aside from beds.

And the console is just mandatory in a game that can be unstable at times, i must admit that the game is more stable then other Bethesda games, but sometimes you get stuck, and then we need atleast the TCL command to get out of it, cause if that happens a few times in a row, it might spoil the fun a bit.

"Though i wish they would just add a menu to each bed that would simply let you save there without sleeping perse"

Great suggestion that, printerkop. I find myself doing 'one hour naps' all the time (while settlement building, for instance, or running out of dungeons to the nearest bed after a couple of successful encounters) and that kinda messes up the flow of the game. Either this or allowing you to save freely in settlements and friendly towns (when they aren't under attack).

[Crimsonhawk87]

In response to post #36468930. #36486615, #36489005 are all replies on the same post.

dikr wrote: I have been testing the survival beta for two days on a new game and I am thoroughly enjoying it. Apart from some minor tweaks that are needed here and there it really makes this game shine.

FO4 isn't about chasing progress anymore and rushing through quest lines. It completely lost its slightly themeparkish, dumbed down character and is much more immersive now, as it forces you to live an actual LIFE. To think about resources, planning your journeys, avoiding encounters which are too risky and staging your assaults carefully.

A lot of things are suddenly much more important now; from SPECIAL and perk choices to bag space, beds, empty bottles, chemistry, cooking and wild Radstags (nom!). Another big game changer: you don't build a settlement just to sustain your puppet settlers anymore, you build it first and foremost to sustain yourself!

Additionally, the world feels more 'whole' without fast travel, while you roam around and live off the land, you discover all kinds of little hideaways. Filler content that was just fluff in vanilla but now has real value. Also the amount of random world encounters I experienced is much higher now that I actually use the world to travel, rather than the map.

Died three times so far (lvl 8 now); one-shotted by the Death Claw in Concord the first time I took a go at him, acid-showered to death in two seconds by an elite Bloatfly and once in a random encounter which was hilarious but I won't spoil it. If you scout out beds before you attempt dangerous things, the time lost isn't so bad. I see how it can be annoying but yeah, the whole saving mechanic makes the game much more exciting.

Compared to this, New Vegas' Hardcore mode was a stroll in the park and its exactly what the franchise needed: an actual challenge for experienced gamers in a game that is suddenly way more complex and interesting.

Only things that are missing in my mind, are portable bedrolls and backpacks. Also the console should definitely be enabled in the release version for stuff like debugging and to set the timescale to a more realistic value.

I applaud the folks at Bethesda who are responsible for advocating this game mode internally. <3

printerkop wrote: true i must admit, if you've gotten used to it, it's a lot of fun.
Though i wish they would just add a menu to each bed that would simply let you save there without sleeping perse, and maybe lower the adrenaline a bit when you do save.

or atleast think about a way to let us save in some way or another, i could be happy with if you're allowed to save once each hour aside from beds.

And the console is just mandatory in a game that can be unstable at times, i must admit that the game is more stable then other Bethesda games, but sometimes you get stuck, and then we need atleast the TCL command to get out of it, cause if that happens a few times in a row, it might spoil the fun a bit.

dikr wrote: "Though i wish they would just add a menu to each bed that would simply let you save there without sleeping perse"

Great suggestion that, printerkop. I find myself doing 'one hour naps' all the time (while settlement building, for instance, or running out of dungeons to the nearest bed after a couple of successful encounters) and that kinda messes up the flow of the game. Either this or allowing you to save freely in settlements and friendly towns (when they aren't under attack).

Firstly, portable bedrolls/sleeping bags for wilderness saving should be available, with the caveat of being unable to do it with enemies close by and would go along way to mollifying many of the arguments against survival mode (and yes, I realize it will be modded in 2 secs after the patch goes live, but it should be a vanilla feature). The second thing is to implement a travel system similar to Skyrim's wagons that travel from settlement to settlement and to designated areas of the map (ie, Diamond City, Goodneighbor, Bunker Hill. etc) AFTER they are discovered via exploration.

The first one is an easy fix and will be in the game, regardless of whether it is intended or not. The second one, not an easy fix, but alot more immersive than fast travel and tons better than having to hoof it all the way across the map every time to need to turn in a quest objective. The settlements can already be linked to share resources, so why not a 5-10 second travel animation with whatever travel system that is appropriate (Vertibird, Armored Bus, horse and buggy, boat) for various locations? Basically it's more "immersive" fast travel, but to only locations that you have previously discovered. It could even be incorporated into the settlement building process (have to build helipad, bus station, stable, boat dock...etc) to really make it immersive. Edited April 10, 2016 by Crimsonhawk87

[Dominque]

I played the survival beta for about 12 hours. here is my recomendations.

Offer the option to select a diffuculty level seperate from your need to eat, sleep, drink, and disease.

Offer the option to fast travel, or not.

Offer the option to be able to save or not.

More options, less "all in one".

Unless you offer "special content" playing it on the full hardcore mode.

The mod community, has created the rest, backpack, tent, and pack-mule

[dikr]

In response to post #36468930. #36486615, #36489005, #36508740 are all replies on the same post.

dikr wrote: I have been testing the survival beta for two days on a new game and I am thoroughly enjoying it. Apart from some minor tweaks that are needed here and there it really makes this game shine.

FO4 isn't about chasing progress anymore and rushing through quest lines. It completely lost its slightly themeparkish, dumbed down character and is much more immersive now, as it forces you to live an actual LIFE. To think about resources, planning your journeys, avoiding encounters which are too risky and staging your assaults carefully.

A lot of things are suddenly much more important now; from SPECIAL and perk choices to bag space, beds, empty bottles, chemistry, cooking and wild Radstags (nom!). Another big game changer: you don't build a settlement just to sustain your puppet settlers anymore, you build it first and foremost to sustain yourself!

Additionally, the world feels more 'whole' without fast travel, while you roam around and live off the land, you discover all kinds of little hideaways. Filler content that was just fluff in vanilla but now has real value. Also the amount of random world encounters I experienced is much higher now that I actually use the world to travel, rather than the map.

Died three times so far (lvl 8 now); one-shotted by the Death Claw in Concord the first time I took a go at him, acid-showered to death in two seconds by an elite Bloatfly and once in a random encounter which was hilarious but I won't spoil it. If you scout out beds before you attempt dangerous things, the time lost isn't so bad. I see how it can be annoying but yeah, the whole saving mechanic makes the game much more exciting.

Compared to this, New Vegas' Hardcore mode was a stroll in the park and its exactly what the franchise needed: an actual challenge for experienced gamers in a game that is suddenly way more complex and interesting.

Only things that are missing in my mind, are portable bedrolls and backpacks. Also the console should definitely be enabled in the release version for stuff like debugging and to set the timescale to a more realistic value.

I applaud the folks at Bethesda who are responsible for advocating this game mode internally. <3

printerkop wrote: true i must admit, if you've gotten used to it, it's a lot of fun.
Though i wish they would just add a menu to each bed that would simply let you save there without sleeping perse, and maybe lower the adrenaline a bit when you do save.

or atleast think about a way to let us save in some way or another, i could be happy with if you're allowed to save once each hour aside from beds.

And the console is just mandatory in a game that can be unstable at times, i must admit that the game is more stable then other Bethesda games, but sometimes you get stuck, and then we need atleast the TCL command to get out of it, cause if that happens a few times in a row, it might spoil the fun a bit.

dikr wrote: "Though i wish they would just add a menu to each bed that would simply let you save there without sleeping perse"

Great suggestion that, printerkop. I find myself doing 'one hour naps' all the time (while settlement building, for instance, or running out of dungeons to the nearest bed after a couple of successful encounters) and that kinda messes up the flow of the game. Either this or allowing you to save freely in settlements and friendly towns (when they aren't under attack).

Crimsonhawk87 wrote: Firstly, portable bedrolls/sleeping bags for wilderness saving should be available, with the caveat of being unable to do it with enemies close by and would go along way to mollifying many of the arguments against survival mode (and yes, I realize it will be modded in 2 secs after the patch goes live, but it should be a vanilla feature). The second thing is to implement a travel system similar to Skyrim's wagons that travel from settlement to settlement and to designated areas of the map (ie, Diamond City, Goodneighbor, Bunker Hill. etc) AFTER they are discovered via exploration.

The first one is an easy fix and will be in the game, regardless of whether it is intended or not. The second one, not an easy fix, but alot more immersive than fast travel and tons better than having to hoof it all the way across the map every time to need to turn in a quest objective. The settlements can already be linked to share resources, so why not a 5-10 second travel animation with whatever travel system that is appropriate (Vertibird, Armored Bus, horse and buggy, boat) for various locations? Basically it's more "immersive" fast travel, but to only locations that you have previously discovered. It could even be incorporated into the settlement building process (have to build helipad, bus station, stable, boat dock...etc) to really make it immersive.

@Crimsonhawk87
I agree. It's a single player game: everyone should be able to fine-tune it to their own preferences.

About your public transport idea: Lore wise it would make the most sense if it would be airships I reckon. The B.o.S. already uses them and it makes sense: they can also be pretty low tech and except for rad storms you are safe from all the dangers of the surface world. (Until super mutants start to use AAA, lol). They should be a lot smaller, more rickety and duck-taped together compared to that monster the B.o.S. is flying though.

Also building an airship-stop at your settlement should be expensive and tied in with perks.

Personally I loved the real-time airship transportation in WoW, back in the days when I played it.

Of course brahmin carts and caravans could be another option: caravans are already in the game. They just need to be fleshed out a bit more. The game needs carts I suppose. But traveling in real-time with carts would be much more tedious, (remember the Skyrim intro?), and would probably require a hard skip / cut scene I suppose.

[TheChampis1]

for those that plan to use this beta dont use the mod 'automatic save' it ruins the whole saving by sleeping only thing and ruins the panic u get when going into a tough battle and there was no beds around