A disturbing realisation about taxation.

[Vindekarr]

Today I went shopping around for a new car.

 

My Range Rover lasted well, a whole year, which isn't bad for me, but while tinkering is fun I needed a machine that wouldn't blow up with me halfway to work. I needed a new car that was actualy new, not a re-conditioned pile of rusted out garbage that is one bit of wqishful thinking away from a total writeoff.

 

And so my first stop was the local Nissan dealership, since I've long been a fan of the NSO and where I live, four wheel drive is an absolute must-have, with terrible roads, frequent ice and Black Ice, and extremely heavy rainfall making rear or front wheel drive cars a risky proposition.

 

I spoke to a fellow about price however, and I was stunned by just what a massive pitfall of hidden price there is on a new car in Australia: Apparently, whenever the cost goes above 57,000 AUD, which doesn't get you much at all these days, you then have to pay 33% of every dollar the car is over 57 grand in tax on top of the base cost, in addition, 10% of the price of the car is then added in GST, and then from next year, a further ??% of value in "carbon tax" even if it's electric or hydrogen(not yet clarified).

 

Now, in the case of the 197,000 GTR which I defnitely cannot afford-that is 123,000 above 57,000. 33% of 123,000 is a lot of money. When I put all that tax together, I'd be owing more than 20,000 in tax, and that's a a lot more than the price of a whole second (used) car. This isn't a good thing, it's a blatant tax grab for starters, but it has the unpleasent aftereffect of confining expensive and performance cars to the truly rich. It doesn't matter how marked-down the vehicle is by the manufacturor, even if you're paying only slightly above costs, the tax will throw the price up significantly.

 

Where it really is the low price margin however. In Australia, nearly all cars are imported, with only a tiny handful of GM models being localy produced, and those done poorly. Fifty-seven thousand dollars was "thew margin between a standard and luxry car" when the tax was introduced in 2001, however the economy has changed, and now 57K is the margin between bargain basement "trades off safety and comfort for cheapness" and "Boring and not a very good car, but better than a Kia". Luxury, brands, such as Lexus, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Range Rover, and Porsche all start out about 115,000 now. What is sad however is that cars designed for people who need them for a job-namely builder's pickup trucks, and minivans all start around 45,000, absolute minimum(to be driveable and liveable, nobody buys a car without a heater down here), and with any sort of option very easily climb above the 57 K deadline into "luxury"

 

Im genuinely offended-I voted inderpendant last election and Im glad I did, when I did some maths, I have no trouble paying tax. However when I'm fleeced for every dollar i have, and when most of the budget is wasted buying fourty year old American army surplus for m,assive markups, I get pretty ticked off. Mind if we borrow some crazy libertarian European politicians for a while guys? even human rights abusing Chinese Leading Party officials are better than these corrupt scum of the earth.

 

ADD-ON:

 

I did some research and the highest tax due of any car available to an Australian is 4.9000,000.00 for a Koenigsegg Trevita, the world's current most expensive car, a sleek, almost organic hypercar of Swedish origin. A Bugatti Veyron braings in about 1,500,000.00, a Mitsubishi Pajero, a stereotypical Australian family car, brings in a whopping 29,000 of tax money this year, and 58,000 next year. There is thereticaly no limit to how much you can fleece someone under the Luxury Car tax law. the most expensive car ever sold would produce a (not comfirmed, estimating low) tax due of 9,000,000,00 under this year's laws, and ??,000,000.00 from next year under theoretical "carbon tax" laws.

Edited June 27, 2011 by Vindekarr

[marharth]

I am not a big fan of the carbon tax, but where do you think the electricity comes from?

 

If your going to start taxing for pollution and screwing up the environment, almost every corporation in the world would be taxed out of businesses.

 

The big issue I have with taxation as a whole, is governments use tax money for really stupid things.

 

I could understand some smaller things, but there is really no justification for bombing attacking countries at once and giving away billions of dollars to certain groups.

[Dicecaster]

I am not a big fan of the carbon tax, but where do you think the electricity comes from?

I'm sorry, but I am genuinely confused; what do you mean by this statement?

[Aurielius]

I am not a big fan of the carbon tax, but where do you think the electricity comes from?

I'm sorry, but I am genuinely confused; what do you mean by this statement?

Though I hate to admit it I think Martharth is referring to the Carbon Tax Credit system where polluting industries can buy carbon credits to offset their lack of carbon emissions compliance. Most electrical generation plants are coal fueled, hence the shortfall in carbon compliance. Even a blind squirrel gathers an acorn or two.

Edited June 27, 2011 by Aurielius

[marharth]

I am not a big fan of the carbon tax, but where do you think the electricity comes from?

I'm sorry, but I am genuinely confused; what do you mean by this statement?

Though I hate to admit it I think Martharth is referring to the Carbon Tax Credit system where polluting industries can buy carbon credits to offset their lack of carbon emissions compliance. Most electrical generation plants are coal fueled, hence the shortfall in carbon compliance. Even a blind squirrel gathers an acorn or two.

You have said that three times I beleive, it seems like I am starting to collect quite a lot of acorns.

 

Perhaps you should reconsider my eyesight?

[Aurielius]

I am not a big fan of the carbon tax, but where do you think the electricity comes from?

I'm sorry, but I am genuinely confused; what do you mean by this statement?

Though I hate to admit it I think Martharth is referring to the Carbon Tax Credit system where polluting industries can buy carbon credits to offset their lack of carbon emissions compliance. Most electrical generation plants are coal fueled, hence the shortfall in carbon compliance. Even a blind squirrel gathers an acorn or two.

You have said that three times I beleive, it seems like I am starting to collect quite a lot of acorns.

 

Perhaps you should reconsider my eyesight?

Three acorns will hardly get a squirrel through one winter. But pointing out that electrical generation plants ( even obscurely) are less than green was insightful.

Edited June 28, 2011 by Aurielius

[Dicecaster]

Today I went shopping around for a new car.

 

My Range Rover lasted well, a whole year, which isn't bad for me, but while tinkering is fun I needed a machine that wouldn't blow up with me halfway to work. I needed a new car that was actualy new, not a re-conditioned pile of rusted out garbage that is one bit of wqishful thinking away from a total writeoff.

 

And so my first stop was the local Nissan dealership, since I've long been a fan of the NSO and where I live, four wheel drive is an absolute must-have, with terrible roads, frequent ice and Black Ice, and extremely heavy rainfall making rear or front wheel drive cars a risky proposition.

 

I spoke to a fellow about price however, and I was stunned by just what a massive pitfall of hidden price there is on a new car in Australia: Apparently, whenever the cost goes above 57,000 AUD, which doesn't get you much at all these days, you then have to pay 33% of every dollar the car is over 57 grand in tax on top of the base cost, in addition, 10% of the price of the car is then added in GST, and then from next year, a further ??% of value in "carbon tax" even if it's electric or hydrogen(not yet clarified).

 

Now, in the case of the 197,000 GTR which I defnitely cannot afford-that is 123,000 above 57,000. 33% of 123,000 is a lot of money. When I put all that tax together, I'd be owing more than 20,000 in tax, and that's a a lot more than the price of a whole second (used) car. This isn't a good thing, it's a blatant tax grab for starters, but it has the unpleasent aftereffect of confining expensive and performance cars to the truly rich. It doesn't matter how marked-down the vehicle is by the manufacturor, even if you're paying only slightly above costs, the tax will throw the price up significantly.

 

Where it really is the low price margin however. In Australia, nearly all cars are imported, with only a tiny handful of GM models being localy produced, and those done poorly. Fifty-seven thousand dollars was "thew margin between a standard and luxry car" when the tax was introduced in 2001, however the economy has changed, and now 57K is the margin between bargain basement "trades off safety and comfort for cheapness" and "Boring and not a very good car, but better than a Kia". Luxury, brands, such as Lexus, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Range Rover, and Porsche all start out about 115,000 now. What is sad however is that cars designed for people who need them for a job-namely builder's pickup trucks, and minivans all start around 45,000, absolute minimum(to be driveable and liveable, nobody buys a car without a heater down here), and with any sort of option very easily climb above the 57 K deadline into "luxury"

 

Im genuinely offended-I voted inderpendant last election and Im glad I did, when I did some maths, I have no trouble paying tax. However when I'm fleeced for every dollar i have, and when most of the budget is wasted buying fourty year old American army surplus for m,assive markups, I get pretty ticked off. Mind if we borrow some crazy libertarian European politicians for a while guys? even human rights abusing Chinese Leading Party officials are better than these corrupt scum of the earth.

 

ADD-ON:

 

I did some research and the highest tax due of any car available to an Australian is 4.9000,000.00 for a Koenigsegg Trevita, the world's current most expensive car, a sleek, almost organic hypercar of Swedish origin. A Bugatti Veyron braings in about 1,500,000.00, a Mitsubishi Pajero, a stereotypical Australian family car, brings in a whopping 29,000 of tax money this year, and 58,000 next year. There is thereticaly no limit to how much you can fleece someone under the Luxury Car tax law. the most expensive car ever sold would produce a (not comfirmed, estimating low) tax due of 9,000,000,00 under this year's laws, and ??,000,000.00 from next year under theoretical "carbon tax" laws.

Try to get your hands on the book Whatever Happened to Justice, by Richard J. Maybury. Once you're finished with it, this behaviour will seem to be nothing at all out of the ordinary.

Edited June 28, 2011 by Dicecaster