Mod Picker: The Fearsome Juggernaut

[JUNKdeLUXE]

 

Mod 'user' wants such and such a game in such and such a way --> Mod Picker says 'hey look at all these mods that are easy for you to use' --> 'User' cannot be bothered to read 50 page tutorials on how to make things work properly --> Modder is then forced to endlessly work to provide for an increasingly clueless user base.

 

I'm not sure how this is any different than from how it is now? Also I believe I've read in the document that Mator released yesterday that they would heavily moderate the comments and that support questions etc. (aimed at the mod authors) are not to take place on Mod Picker.

 

Secondly, the way I understand MPs review (and reputation system) is that some user coming in from the street, can't give a mod a rating of zero (expecting a rating system from 0 to 10) because they have no reputation. A user with reputation, has that reputation because they've shown to be knowledgeable about how mods work individually and together.

 

Hopefully Mod Picker will make all our lives easier - users and authors alike... Will it? I don't know, but I guess I'm a glass half full kinda guy where you are the opposite.

[roro330]

 

 

Now, for a question of my own. Which part of 1984 did you find most appealing? I'd just like to know who I'm debating with.

probably the part where they go antique shopping. I think that it serves as a quaint contrast to the (artificial) bleakness of the rest of the story.

 

Kind of like this conversation in the bleakness of the internet <3

 

But your reference to 1984 brings up a good point. A major trope in the book was it's establishment of government oversight bringing stability, safety, and a general increase in the quality of life to the citizens of the country. They spent their entire lives in fear of Eastasia. They spent their lives cowering from the Eastasian menace. But their government protected them. Their government provided that stability, that protection, in a way that individuals simply wouldn't have been able to.

 

In a similar way, Mod Picker is looking to do the same thing. Without Mod Picker, we have no one acting to keep us informed of important changes in mods and the modding community in a collected and concise form (think of how different the society in 1984 would be if their government didn't keep them informed of the smallest changes. For example: the chocolate rations scene). Without that kind of information distribution being handled by a large group above the common people, there is no good way that people could be easily informed. That kind of organization allows for easy, concise, and efficient distribution of information from a central authority to those in need of it.

 

Great... the discussion has turned into a bookclub...

<3

 

 

Wow. I'm shocked. You would be blind to all of the injustices/ atrocities committed by the government/ Mod Picker, in the interest of protection from Eastasia/ Eurasia (mod authors, who, just like the two superpowers in the book, aren't really that bad), when the entire theme of the book was about freedom from oppressive, overbearing scrutiny, and breaking the web of lies and illusions perpetuated by those who claim to be in power/ experts (the Party/ Mod Picker Users).

 

Seriously. Mod authors are fundamentally no different than mod users; in fact, the two roles are so similar that they might as well be indistinguishable. After all, we're all here to indulge in a hobby, be it modding games or making mods. Sometimes, we even do both, at the same time!

 

Thus, when Mod Picker defies the rights of MAs, they're hurting the entire community as a whole, and not just the MAs, or the users. We're all in this together.

 

 

did you even read 1984? In fact, with how ignorant you are being, have you even read the Fountainhead?

 

I would think that you have not. If you had read either of those two works of art, you would understand the importance of a strong central authority helps the common people (mod users) establish a healthy relationship with outside forces (modders). If you had read 1984, then you would understand how important it is for the common people to follow (or in this case, use) their central authority (mod picker) so that their interactions with outside forces (modders) are optimal and healthy.

 

But you haven't read 1984, and so you don't understand.

[sunshinenbrick]

 

My car's manual is 50+ pages and I didn't even have to read my way all the way through it…

I'm not willing to read 50+ pages…

I'm seeing a pattern here. You think that people should have your level of expertise before they receive any benefits that you didn't have. You've read 50 pages of off-topic discussion, so I should read 50 pages of off-topic discussion before I can comment on the matter. You've read 50 pages of installation manuals, so you think all users should have to read 50 pages of instruction manuals. You've read the initial press release/advertisement and had your opinion of Mod Picker formed by it, so you think I should also form my opinion around this initial release even though I never had those misconceptions.

 

 

You do realise that modders are not paid right? The people at PCParts Amazon etc etc are.

 

You have yet to demonstrate the relevance of this. So what? We're still people offering goods and services. We're just offering them for free and with no guaranteed support.

 

As for the other comment, I'm afraid I just don't understand what you are saying. :confused:

That's because you're tired. Trust me, that paragraph was complete nonsense.

 

 

I'm not entriely sure how you define benefits, but as this conversation seems to be coming down to how people define things, then to be quite honest I do have better things to do.

 

The support is being further guaranteed through this system, I am at a loss if you fail to see this. I am very sorry.

 

Meh...

[sunshinenbrick]

 

 

Mod 'user' wants such and such a game in such and such a way --> Mod Picker says 'hey look at all these mods that are easy for you to use' --> 'User' cannot be bothered to read 50 page tutorials on how to make things work properly --> Modder is then forced to endlessly work to provide for an increasingly clueless user base.

 

I'm not sure how this is any different than from how it is now? Also I believe I've read in the document that Mator released yesterday that they would heavily moderate the comments and that support questions etc. (aimed at the mod authors) are not to take place on Mod Picker.

 

Secondly, the way I understand MPs review (and reputation system) is that some user coming in from the street, can't give a mod a rating of zero (expecting a rating system from 0 to 10) because they have no reputation. A user with reputation, has that reputation because they've shown to be knowledgeable about how mods work individually and together.

 

Hopefully Mod Picker will make all our lives easier - users and authors alike... Will it? I don't know, but I guess I'm a glass half full kinda guy where you are the opposite.

 

 

I would agree with you that there IS a gap that needs to be bridged from 'user' to 'author'. How we do it exactly is important, if not vital.

 

I am glad to see some of the things on that document too and there was a lot of discussion put forth to get that far. I think there are still many discussions going on everywhere about what things need to be addressed and how. I think the Mod Picker team themselves are pretty exhausted too and things need to develop with time.

 

I too hope that Mod Picker, the authors, the Nexus, and the 'users' can find a way to make all this fit together. I am optimistic as I have faith in the ingenuity and creativity of the community as long as everybody keeps talking and thinks of the collective as well as the individual.

[lofgren]

The support is being further guaranteed through this system, I am at a loss if you fail to see this. I am very sorry.

 

Meh...

I don't see it. I do expect that if you want me to see the world your way then you should have to explain yourself. HOW is Mod Picker guaranteeing support. For god's sake, this seems so obvious to you that you ought to be able to at least attempt to explain it. So far every single one of your "concerns" has boiled down to an assertion that Mod Picker will make the worst members of our community worse. This seems improbable to me and you have yet to demonstrate a causal mechanism.

Edited April 25, 2016 by lofgren

[DavidJCobb]

The only reference to more serious concerns was somebody saying ominously that there were discussions going on over features that we don't even know about. Well that's pretty shady but if you're not going to tell me what those features are and what that discussion is about I see no reason to take it seriously.

There was an alpha video of a feature where mods could be uploaded to the Mod Picker servers to be analyzed, which would produce a "dump" containing such things as the file paths in BSAs and a list of vanilla and DLC records overridden in the ESP; uploaded files would be deleted after this process was done, and never redistributed. Though this dump is simply a factual description of a work (and thus isn't something mod authors own or have any right to own), some people were concerned about the upload because... I dunno, reasons. I'm sure they had actual good reasons and weren't just blindly panicking.

 

Some important context: even that feature was intended to be temporary; the Mod Picker team wanted to do the analysis in-browser, such that files would never leave a user's hard drive. That temporary plan has been scrapped been scrapped after some good discussion and a whole lot of other "discussion;" now, they'll just have the user download and run the analysis program themselves.

 

Though the original temporary plan was a legal hazard for Mod Picker, there was nothing morally unreasonable about it. The reaction was just some of the typical mass panic about change that is endemic to the Nexus's private forums. Even with the plan having changed and there being no uploads, some people are still crying over the analysis feature because apparently, it's abhorrent to collect factual data on mods for compatibility's sake?

Edited April 25, 2016 by DavidJCobb

[lofgren]

That temporary plan has been scrapped; now, they'll just have the user download and run the analysis program themselves.

So similar to the concerns over the initial press release/advertisement description, these fears been allayed and everybody has moved on?

[sunshinenbrick]

 

The support is being further guaranteed through this system, I am at a loss if you fail to see this. I am very sorry.

 

Meh...

I don't see it. I do expect that if you want me to see the world your way then you should have to explain yourself. HOW is Mod Picker guaranteeing support. For god's sake, this seems so obvious to you that you ought to be able to at least attempt to explain it. So far every single one of your "conerns" have boiled down to assertions that Mod Picker will make the worst members of our community worse. This seems improbable to me and you have yet to demonstrate a causal mechanism.

 

 

OK, I'll try again.

 

Becasue the author is automatically opted in, it means a second 'affiliate page' is created providing 'official' reviews and support for the mod even though the author might not know about it, or want to support the mod outside the place they uploaded it.

 

It's fine to make the service, but just don't link it through to the author's page unless they choose to do so themselves. Even the Nexus itself allows authors to not embed the use of Nexus Mod Manager with their mods.

[DavidJCobb]

 

That temporary plan has been scrapped; now, they'll just have the user download and run the analysis program themselves.

So similar to the concerns over the initial press release/advertisement description, these fears been allayed and everybody has moved on?

No. Don't know if you saw my edit, but now people are whining about the analysis itself and looking for legal solutions to stop it.

 

If these authors had their way, they'd sue people for mentioning so much as the file size of a mod, unless those people happened to be our Lord and Savior Robin. Funnily enough, that'd be exactly the same in principle as what they're doing now.

[lofgren]

Becasue the author is automatically opted in, it means a second 'affiliate page' is created providing 'official' reviews and support for the mod even though the author might not know about it, or want to support the mod outside the place they uploaded it.

 

It fine to make the service, but just don't link it through to the author's page unless they choose to do so themselves.

I'd like to see pics of the Mod Picker UI saying "Official" and "Affiliate Page." Because I agree that would be straight-up dishonest. Especially since the prime attraction of Mod Picker is the unofficial, peer-to-peer support it provides. I would be surprised if Mod Picker would risk their reputation by labeling their reviews "official" and modders they have no connection as "affiliates" when neither appellation really improves their product.

 

Yeah, Web 3.0 has been going on for a long time now. I'm pretty sure most users will recognize the difference between a review/aggregator site and an actual product site. Those that don't, so what? So morons who aren't willing to learn how to install their mods properly will never figure out that Mod Picker's review page is not the mod author's page and you never see their comment saying "You broke my game!" We hate those people anyway! Another layer of insulation from them would be just dandy.

 

And seriously, "don't like to the author's page?" From a page about their mod? You have got to be joking. If you don't want people to link to your mod, don't post it to the Web. That is your only option. Nobody needs your permission to link to your page.

Edited April 25, 2016 by lofgren