Invisible horses, Wig Woes, and one confused modder.

[Namea]

Hello! Recently after pouring far too many hours into skyrim and leaving FO4 neglected (The poor modding community there is already dead as they wait for the GECK) I decided to reinstall and mod Oblivion. I got my game running fine and looking quite good to boot but there are a couple of minor but annoying issues that I can't seem to figure out.

 

If it helps I have the Oblivion GOTY edition delux via Steam. I have the most recent version of OBSE steam version as well.

 

Issue One: Invisible Horses!

All of the horses in the game are invisible! I can see their tack clearly and ride them even but the horses themselves are completely invisible.

 

Steps taken to try and solve already:

-Re-installation of all mods that might affect horses

-Re-installation of Quarl's texture pack III

-Archive re-direction via OBMM

-Archive invalidation via NMM

-Load order sorting with LOOT, BOSS, and Manually

 

 

Solution that worked:

To be edited in if I figure it out, just in case someone else comes looking for help and finds this via Google.

 

 

Issue Two: Chakaru's Mods crash my game!

Chakaru's Wig pack V2 (with the Northern Star fix) just won't work. The only wig that shows up is the White version of the Traveler wig. That one shows up perfectly and works just fine. The rest all have strange mesh issues or LOD issues (Hair is completely black and makes huge angular shapes that just stretch when I move). Then some of them crash my game altogether if I attempt to equip them. Oddly enough her armour mods (the two I've tried thus far) both crashed my game immediately upon attempting to equip them.

 

Steps taken to try and solve already:

-Re-installation of the mods completely.

-Load order sorting with LOOT, BOSS, and Manually

 

Solution that worked:

To be edited in if I figure it out, just in case someone else comes looking for help and finds this via Google.

 

Issue Three: Loot seems to think I'm playing a game that doesn't exist.

LOOT has been my go-to load order sorter since I began playing Skyrim. Yes, I was a late Bethesda bloomer and Skyrim was the first Beth game I played. I've heard that BOSS is better for Oblivion and it's not out-of-date any longer so I've been using that instead because of this issue.

 

Anyway, the issue is that every time I attempt to use LOOT it tells me that Oblivion.esm isn't present or that it's not active despite the fact that not only is it on the list but I'm playing the game so clearly it's active! This is a pretty minor issue since I use BOSS anyway now but it's annoying nonetheless.

 

Steps taken to try and solve already:

-Re-installed LOOT

 

Solution that worked:

To be edited in if I figure it out, just in case someone else comes looking for help and finds this via Google.

 

And of course you'll be needing my load order:

GameMode=Oblivion

Oblivion.esm=1

Cobl Main.esm=1

Ulrim's Horses.esm=1

Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm=1

Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp=1

UOP Vampire Aging & Face Fix.esp=1

Oblivion Citadel Door Fix.esp=1

DLCShiveringIsles.esp=1

Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp=1

Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp=1

PTAutumnTrees.esp=1

PCSoundAnnah.esp=1

IlluminationWithin.esp=1

Circling Ravens.esp=1

personality_idles4.esp=1

Reznod_Mannequin.esp=1

VA_BetterGold.esp=1

moDem's City Life.esp=1

OblivionReloaded.esp=1

OblivionReloadedArenaCombat.esp=1

Streamline 3.1.esp=1

DLCHorseArmor.esp=1

DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

DLCOrrery.esp=1

DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

DLCVileLair.esp=1

DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

DLCMehrunesRazor.esp=1

DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

DLCSpellTomes.esp=1

DLCSpellTomes - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

EVE_StockEquipmentReplacer.esp=1

00 chakaru wigs.esp=1

1AzuSeraphimSet.esp=1

1SB_RavenousEleganceOutfit.esp=1

1SBLethalMajestyWeapons.esp=1

Darkgreen Glass Armour.esp=1

EY_AoD.esp=1

FemaleImperialDragonCuirass.esp=1

Immersive Weapons.esp=1

Iron Maiden Set.esp=1

Iron Maiden - Jo's Rest.esp=1

JBlades!.esp=1

JBlades!1.1.esp=1

JBladesVol2.esp=1

JCapes!20.esp=1

JCapesBonus.esp=1

KDCirclets.esp=1

KDClothCirclets.esp=1

nu_dwarven_f_cuirass.esp=1

Shdw_Armor pack01.esp=1

Shdw_Armor Set_Sotonhorian.esp=1

Simple leather armor.esp=1

Weapon Improvement Project.esp=1

AdventurerPlateArmor.esp=1

CB Rogue Armor.esp=1

R18PN - Eisen Platte Armor.esp=1

RogueLeather.esp=1

Sack of Pants.esp=1

Triss Armor Retextured.esp=1

UFF_CrimsonMidnight.esp=1

Slof's Horses Base.esp=1

Slof's Extra Horses.esp=1

Slof's Black Unicorn.esp=1

Zira's Horse Modpack - My Horses.esp=1

Zira's Horse Modpack - Heavy Legion Horses.esp=1

Zira's Horse Modpack - Friesian Horses.esp=1

Zira's Horse Modpack - Shadowmere.esp=1

Zira's Horse Modpack - Extra Horses.esp=1

Zira's Horse Modpack - More Horses.esp=1

Zira's Horse Modpack - Armored Legion Horses.esp=1

DLCThievesDen.esp=1

DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch - SSSB.esp=1

Cobl Glue.esp=1

Cobl Si.esp=1

Cobl Tweaks.esp=1

Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp=1

OOO-Water_Weeds.esp=1

OOOCreatureAddons.esp=1

OOOEquipmentAddon.esp=1

OOO 1.32-Cobl.esp=1

Cobl Tweaks - OOO Mergeable.esp=1

KDCircletsOOOOptimized - Loot Only.esp=1

EVE_StockEquipmentReplacer for OOO.esp=1

Plate Armor Plus - OOO_FCOM_version.esp=1

Benirus Manor Remade.esp=1

Kvatch Rebuilt.esp=1

Kvatch Rebuilt Fixes.esp=1

Kvatch Rebuilt - No More Burned Ground.esp=1

Apachii_Wigs_MaleFemale.esp=1

DLCBattlehornCastle.esp=1

DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

DLCFrostcrag.esp=1

DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

Ulrim's Horses.esp=1

Knights.esp=1

Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp=1

EVE_KnightsoftheNine.esp=1

Ulrim's Horses - Knights patch.esp=1

Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul - Knights of Nine.esp=1

JungleHasMoreGroundcover.esp=1

xuldarkforest.esp=1

xulStendarrValley.esp=1

xulTheHeath.esp=1

xulEntiusGorge.esp=1

xulFallenleafEverglade.esp=1

xulColovianHighlands_EV.esp=1

xulChorrolHinterland.esp=1

xulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.esp=1

xulBravilBarrowfields.esp=1

xulLushWoodlands.esp=1

xulAncientYews.esp=1

xulAncientRedwoods.esp=1

xulCloudtopMountains.esp=1

xulArriusCreek.esp=1

xulPatch_AY_AC.esp=1

xulRollingHills_EV.esp=1

xulPantherRiver.esp=1

xulRiverEthe.esp=1

xulBrenaRiverRavine.esp=1

xulImperialIsle.esp=1

xulBlackwoodForest.esp=1

xulCheydinhalFalls.esp=1

xulAspenWood.esp=1

xulSkingradOutskirts.esp=1

xulSnowdale.esp=1

xulCliffsOfAnvil.esp=1

xulSilverfishRiverValley.esp=1

xulJerallGlacier.esp=1

xulTheEasternPeaks.esp=1

Salmo the Baker, Cobl.esp=1

Natural_Vegetation_by_Max_Tael.esp=1

Real Lava 1.3.esp=1

EVE_ShiveringIslesEasterEggs.esp=1

Grass Overhaul.esp=1

Improved Fires and Flames - Increased Sound.esp=1

Slof's Epona.esp=1

Steel_Cuirass_Female_by_rTw.esp=1

RefScope.esp=1

Cobl Races.esp=1

EVE_KhajiitFix.esp=1

Oblivion_Character_Overhaul.esp=1

OCO v2 Balanced - Cobl.esp=1

OOOShiveringIsles.esp=1

Cobl Races - Balanced.esp=1

Alternate Start Revamped.esp=1

OOO-Magic_Script_Effect_Fix.esp=1

Cobl Filter Late MERGE ONLY.esp=0

LandMagicPatch.esp=1

ICNPC.esp=1

UFF Ves and Triss.esp=1

DarkSunArmor.esp=1

kdBraidedWig.esp=1

00 chakaru amulets.esp=1

ElvenPrincessCollection.esp=1

Blade Witch.esp=1

TW3 dresses.esp=1

ChantrySeeker.esp=1

SebastianVaelArmor.esp=1

00 Ouroboros amulet.esp=1

Cobl Variations.esp=1

Cobl Variation - OOO Patch.esp=1

SlowerRun.esp=1

Claytons Bigger Streetlights v1.esp=1

Bashed Patch, 0.esp=1

Maskar's Oblivion Overhaul.esp=1

I've mostly used OBmm or Manual installations. A couple have been installed via NMM when they specifically said it was preferable.

I'm flummoxed. Does anyone have any ideas on how to fix these glitches? I'll pay you in love and hugs and cookies. <3

Edited May 2, 2016 by Namea

[Namea]

Anyone? Also updated my load order after removing some of the mods that tend to have a reputation for compatibility issues.

[Striker879]

Well according to my Drakes_Tips text file (a compilation of questions that Drake the Dragon has answered over the years I've been here) black or invisible is the game telling you that it's missing normal maps that have been assigned to the NIF.

 

My guess would be you've improperly installed the Slof and/or Zira horse stuff (but it's just that ... a guess).

[wren10]

Sounds like Texture issues with the hair. Possibly with the horses, but I can't be sure, definitely with the hair imo, whenever hair does that in a "Beth" game, it's a texture you need that did not get installed, or even that the texture file is a duplicate of another or improperly named. I would extract the mods manually and manually put the textures into your textures folder. Chances are you have manual install instructions in the readme of those mods. Try manually installing the horse mods, possibly ALL Oblivion mods since the game predated NMM, and even OBMM came out later than the game and might have had it's own issues with some mods. It could be the mod has sub-folders that are going into the main folders they are supposed too, but the game is not recognizing the files inside those subfolders.

 

The LOOT issue to me is sort of like this..use BOSS, it's what we all used when that game was still newish. LOOT was released years later, so I can see how retrofitting it for an old game could cause issues with it not working properly.

[Namea]

Sounds like Texture issues with the hair. Possibly with the horses, but I can't be sure, definitely with the hair imo, whenever hair does that in a "Beth" game, it's a texture you need that did not get installed, or even that the texture file is a duplicate of another or improperly named. I would extract the mods manually and manually put the textures into your textures folder. Chances are you have manual install instructions in the readme of those mods. Try manually installing the horse mods, possibly ALL Oblivion mods since the game predated NMM, and even OBMM came out later than the game and might have had it's own issues with some mods. It could be the mod has sub-folders that are going into the main folders they are supposed too, but the game is not recognizing the files inside those subfolders.

 

The LOOT issue to me is sort of like this..use BOSS, it's what we all used when that game was still newish. LOOT was released years later, so I can see how retrofitting it for an old game could cause issues with it not working properly.

 

I've been using Boss instead. I just worry because it doesn't even put my Bashed Patch last...I worry what else it's getting wrong ya know?

As for the texture issue with the hair, I installed those manually from her website and tried looking at all of the files to see. It LOOKS like they're all there and I know they're in the right place but is it possible they were packaged incorrectly? I tried re-downloading in case of a corrupted DL but that didn't work either sadly.

 

I figured the horses were texture too so I again made sure that the mods were manually installed correctly but still no dice.

[Namea]

Well according to my Drakes_Tips text file (a compilation of questions that Drake the Dragon has answered over the years I've been here) black or invisible is the game telling you that it's missing normal maps that have been assigned to the NIF.

 

My guess would be you've improperly installed the Slof and/or Zira horse stuff (but it's just that ... a guess).

I tried reinstalling both (they were both manual installs to begin with) and I verified the file structure to make sure I wasn't installing them incorrectly. I tried playing around with the order of install and the load order for those and Quarls to see if perhaps QTP was interfering but thus far no dice.

I did uninstall both Slof's and Zira's to see if it would help but the horses remained invisible.

[Striker879]

All I can suggest is use NifSkope to see what texture paths are defined for the meshes and confirm that the required files are in the correct file paths. I'm not a hair guy and the vanilla horses look great to me, so beyond that I'm not much help.

 

What version of BOSS are you using and you can use the masterlists from here to manually get and use the most recent list if BOSS isn't automatically updating.

 

- Edit - Invariably it seems my method for installing mods proves the quickest. Install one mod and then test thoroughly. If all is OK move onto the next mod ... rinse and repeat until your load order is complete. When you install one mod to a load order that is working flawlessly and then you start having problems it's a pretty trivial matter to figure out where to start your troubleshooting.

Edited May 2, 2016 by Striker879

[Namea]

All I can suggest is use NifSkope to see what texture paths are defined for the meshes and confirm that the required files are in the correct file paths. I'm not a hair guy and the vanilla horses look great to me, so beyond that I'm not much help.

 

What version of BOSS are you using and you can use the masterlists from here to manually get and use the most recent list if BOSS isn't automatically updating.

 

- Edit - Invariably it seems my method for installing mods proves the quickest. Install one mod and then test thoroughly. If all is OK move onto the next mod ... rinse and repeat until your load order is complete. When you install one mod to a load order that is working flawlessly and then you start having problems it's a pretty trivial matter to figure out where to start your troubleshooting.

Man your method is right. That's how I used to do it but of course I had to get cocky this time. *PHALE NAMEA* I tried Nifscope but it just points to the vanilla horses. I uninstalled the texture mods and all horse related mods and they were still invisible for some reason. I also tried to validate the files via Steam to see if it was vanilla files missing but nothin'.

 

I'm almost thinking something is going wrong with my archive invalidation or something. That's one aspect I know nothing about since no other game I've modded uses it. I've been using OBMM's tool since from what I've read it's the most modern and currently efficient method but perhaps it's incompatible with one of my mods?

 

Are any of my mods incompatible that you can tell?

Thank you guys so much for taking the time out to try and help.

 

Let's see...BOSS version is 2.3.2 according to the page. It says 0 errors when I run it but there are 15 unrecognized files. It is updated with the newest masterlist though. I just assumed that there were some files that were either too new or perhaps not ones that the creators knew of yet.

Edited May 2, 2016 by Namea

[DrakeTheDragon]

Speaking of Steam and Archive Invalidation, there's also a few more things to check.

 

First off, is your game installed in the default location, somewhere inside program files (Steam's default, too, from all I know) and are you on a later Windows OS, Vista, Win 7/8 or higher? If so, chances are the UAC is tricking you into "believing" the files actually were where you put them, but in reality they went into some Virtual Store folder, or what it's named, inside your User folders instead. Using your Windows Explorer to check for them inside program files will fail, because it will effectively "lie" to you, showing you files where there are none, but the game can't be tricked by that and won't find them. If however you can find them inside the other folder I mentioned, then it's guaranteed they're not inside program files at all.

 

That's why it's usually advised to install your game at a different location than the default, safely outside Windows' and the UAC's clutches. This can even be done with Steam's game directory as well, moving it out of harm's way that is.

 

Bben has a very useful complete uninstall/reinstall/move guide for these cases, complete with keeping all your mod files and save games intact, somewhere on here: http://s1.zetaboards.com/bbenlibrary/topic/4751769/1/#new

 

Next, Archive Invalidation comes in many different solutions, starting with the outdated and discouraged use of the "Archive Invalidation.txt" file containing the list of Vanilla game files to not be used anymore, whether created by yourself manually or automatically via a mod manager tool, continuing across another discouraged solution called BSA Alteration, modifying the game's BSA files themselves and replacing Vanilla files to replace inside these directly (very easy to mess your game up beyond repair that way, especially if not keeping backups), and finally ending on the only sanely advisable approach nowadays, BSA Redirection, putting an empty dummy BSA file into your Data folder and altering your Oblivion.ini so this file gets loaded at the position of the only BSA requiring invalidation under normal circumstances, effectively eliminating the very need for Archive Invalidation itself entirely once and for all.

 

But there's a thing that needs to be taken especial care of when applying BSA Redirection to your game. By all means get rid of any and all left-over files labeled "Archive Invalidation.txt" irrespective of where inside your game folders they might be hidden. Having even one of these persist will lead to the game being instructed to use external file X over internal file X from inside the "now-empty" dummy BSA, and this is known to cause multiple random texture issues inside your game.

 

And last but not least let's not forget you're on Steam, which means the BSA files served by Steam will be dated far too recently for any replacer-type mods to ever stand a chance, and even Archive Invalidation will be trumped and thus ignored by that. So make sure you first "re-date" your BSA files back to a date around where Oblivion's disc version was officially released, somewhere around 2006, if I'm not mistaken, which in case of already using OBMM can easily be done in the same Archive Invalidation dialog just by clicking "Reset BSA timestamps" once before applying BSA Redirection afterwards.

 

I hope some of this helps tracking down your issue.

[Surilindur]

Also, about the load order you posted. You mentioned it being odd for BOSS to place to files after your Bashed Patch, but Maskar (the author of Maskar's Oblivion Overhaul) has specifically stated that his mod must be placed after the Bashed Patch for it to work correctly. Unless my memory fails me, I think it was because he has empty leveled lists in the mod, that are populated in-game via scripts, and Wrye Bash can do something to those leveled lists when building Bashed Patch. Or that is what I think there was behind it.

 

Whatever the reason is/was, Maskar's Oblivion Overhaul needs to be after Bashed Patch, so that is not an error. Hopefully you can find the reason behind the horse issues. Happy hunting!