Why is Britain Burning ?

[ginnyfizz]

And Ginny, there were riots during the great depression: Timeline of the great depression.

 

I wasn't talking about the USA. I was talking about the UK. We had a notorious riot in Cable Street in 1936 but that was to do with Fascists vs Communists vs the Metropolitan Police. It was not related to the deprivation issue.

 

Time for less handwringing, less excuses, and more boot up the backside. They are thinking of bringing in Bill Bratton - good job!

[SpellAndShield]

Love the pic. :D

 

And again, this sounds REALLY familiar........ You could be describing the United States in each and every one of those statements...... although, I think your welfare system is even more overboard than ours.....

 

Our welfare system is beyond ridiculous, it actively discourages people from seeking employment and taking responsibility for themselves. In fact our whole system is completely wrong, we punish those who work hard by taxing the hell out of them while rewarding failure with free houses and money. A society that punishes success and rewards failure shouldn't be surprised when it finds itself with a large group of people unwilling to make any contribution towards it.

 

@grannywils Thank you for your kind words. The vast majority of people in this country are hard working and decent, the problem is that those at both the top and bottom of our society live a moral vacuum. Business leaders have no social conscience, our politicians are dishonest to the point of being criminal and the less said about our senior police and the media the better.

 

If gun ownership were legal in the UK the riots likely would have never happened; looter A goes into shop, shop owner pulls out shotgun, blows his head off, looters go home. The riots continued because the animals did not fear any consequences. What did you get instead aluminum bat sales going up 5,000% in the course of 2 days. The police sit there and do nothing; total nanny state. Nevermind the fact that you can go to jail for defending your property in the UK, as when a burglar breaks in and you defend your home, you can be punished for self-defence. You need guns to be legalised here...

[JimboUK]

Love the pic. :D

 

And again, this sounds REALLY familiar........ You could be describing the United States in each and every one of those statements...... although, I think your welfare system is even more overboard than ours.....

 

Our welfare system is beyond ridiculous, it actively discourages people from seeking employment and taking responsibility for themselves. In fact our whole system is completely wrong, we punish those who work hard by taxing the hell out of them while rewarding failure with free houses and money. A society that punishes success and rewards failure shouldn't be surprised when it finds itself with a large group of people unwilling to make any contribution towards it.

 

@grannywils Thank you for your kind words. The vast majority of people in this country are hard working and decent, the problem is that those at both the top and bottom of our society live a moral vacuum. Business leaders have no social conscience, our politicians are dishonest to the point of being criminal and the less said about our senior police and the media the better.

 

If gun ownership were legal in the UK the riots likely would have never happened; looter A goes into shop, shop owner pulls out shotgun, blows his head off, looters go home. The riots continued because the animals did not fear any consequences. What did you get instead aluminum bat sales going up 5,000% in the course of 2 days. The police sit there and do nothing; total nanny state. Nevermind the fact that you can go to jail for defending your property in the UK, as when a burglar breaks in and you defend your home, you can be punished for self-defence. You need guns to be legalised here...

 

You make a good point, these people are cowards and will only attack those weaker than them and then only in groups. In London at the height of the riot on Tuesday Turkish areas went untouched, the reason for that is that the Turks organised themselves and were prepared to fight back. I don't think the police ended it by putting huge numbers on the street either, by Wednesday local communities has got together and those looters knew that instead of getting a few weeks in jail for their crimes they faced a long spell in hospital if the locals got hold of them.

[SpellAndShield]

Love the pic. :D

 

And again, this sounds REALLY familiar........ You could be describing the United States in each and every one of those statements...... although, I think your welfare system is even more overboard than ours.....

 

Our welfare system is beyond ridiculous, it actively discourages people from seeking employment and taking responsibility for themselves. In fact our whole system is completely wrong, we punish those who work hard by taxing the hell out of them while rewarding failure with free houses and money. A society that punishes success and rewards failure shouldn't be surprised when it finds itself with a large group of people unwilling to make any contribution towards it.

 

@grannywils Thank you for your kind words. The vast majority of people in this country are hard working and decent, the problem is that those at both the top and bottom of our society live a moral vacuum. Business leaders have no social conscience, our politicians are dishonest to the point of being criminal and the less said about our senior police and the media the better.

 

If gun ownership were legal in the UK the riots likely would have never happened; looter A goes into shop, shop owner pulls out shotgun, blows his head off, looters go home. The riots continued because the animals did not fear any consequences. What did you get instead aluminum bat sales going up 5,000% in the course of 2 days. The police sit there and do nothing; total nanny state. Nevermind the fact that you can go to jail for defending your property in the UK, as when a burglar breaks in and you defend your home, you can be punished for self-defence. You need guns to be legalised here...

 

You make a good point, these people are cowards and will only attack those weaker than them and then only in groups. In London at the height of the riot on Tuesday Turkish areas went untouched, the reason for that is that the Turks organised themselves and were prepared to fight back. I don't think the police ended it by putting huge numbers on the street either, by Wednesday local communities has got together and those looters knew that instead of getting a few weeks in jail for their crimes they faced a long spell in hospital if the locals got hold of them.

 

The UK is in a sad state of affairs for this very reason. The police are ineffective and people are not allowed to defend themselves. Something has to give but what does Cemeron do? he announced possible measures that would lead to more nanny/police statehood. I was considering staying in London for work but after what happened I am heading for greener pastures; overpriced, stressful and now fairly dangerous and unstable.

[JimboUK]

 

 

The UK is in a sad state of affairs for this very reason. The police are ineffective and people are not allowed to defend themselves. Something has to give but what does Cemeron do? he announced possible measures that would lead to more nanny/police statehood. I was considering staying in London for work but after what happened I am heading for greener pastures; overpriced, stressful and now fairly dangerous and unstable.

 

Cameron hasn't got a clue, so far his suggestions are either unworkable (turning off Twitter) or plain bloody stupid (Naming rioting kids and giving them their 15 minutes of fame). It's no good expecting the opposition to do any better, it's their policies that made this mess. Honestly I can't see how a political class that is as morally bankrupt as the looters will fix this, if I didn't have commitments here I'd be off.

[Sepherose]

And Ginny, there were riots during the great depression: Timeline of the great depression.

 

I wasn't talking about the USA. I was talking about the UK. We had a notorious riot in Cable Street in 1936 but that was to do with Fascists vs Communists vs the Metropolitan Police. It was not related to the deprivation issue.

 

Time for less handwringing, less excuses, and more boot up the backside. They are thinking of bringing in Bill Bratton - good job!

 

Hey fair point, probably shouldn't post when I have a migraine otherwise I (would like to think) would have thought about the connecting threads there. XD

So sorry about that, still part of what i had posted still rings true: Back then people had more faith in their governments in many ways, and people now, especially younger generations, are disillusioned about governments. Again, I'd like to point out that I don't think the blame is square on either side of this, both sides had their part in it.

[marharth]

Well someone brought up gun rights, and that is one of the few right wing polices I strongly agree with.

 

You need to have something to defend yourself for one. Its also a good idea to have a civilian militant for multiple reasons. People will say taking away guns will stop crime, but that's false. I think in Ireland (could be wrong on the country) handguns are illegal. Murder still happens just as much, the most common murder weapon just changed to a knife.

 

That being said, I agree that if owners had a gun people would fear looting a lot more. Probably would die down without police help at all.

[ginnyfizz]

Handguns are illegal all over the UK unless you are a member of the police or armed services, or a member of the only other categories of persons allowed to carry handguns aka side arms, ie those who might conceivably be called upon to slaughter large animals - veterinary surgeons and licensed slaughtermen (including hunt staff). These will carry a pistol for horses and a captive bolt gun for other farm stock. (Deer would tend to be shot at longer range with a rifle and thus the handgun element doesn't apply to them, unless they are found as casualties.)

 

Result - our world class pistol shooting team has to train in France. The criminals, on the other hand, use ILLEGAL hand guns with impunity.