Transcending the Catch 22 in all RPGs

[CalibanX]

In every RPG you start out with a weak character and endeavor to make that character more powerful via leveling up, getting better gear, more powerful spells, etc. But, in doing so, you always run the risk of becoming so powerful that the quests and challenges of the game become too easy and boring. That's the catch 22. The more powerful your character becomes, the greater the risk that the game becomes too easy & boring.

 

My last Oblivion character was intentionally gimped in various ways (Luck was her main Attribute focus) but after becoming an Expert in Alchemy and acquiring sweet loot items I was able to walk through the realm of Oblivion without breaking a sweat. That was a bit of a letdown. And yes, I'm aware of the Difficulty bar slider. But, for some odd reason, it feels wrong to me to have to adjust the game difficulty as I play in order to keep it challenging.

 

I wonder if the developers of these kinds of games wrestle with issues like this when designing them? One way I was able to escape this situation in Oblivion was spending my money & resources on buying Houses and elaborately decorating them with pretty, interesting items just for the fun of it. What other ways do players spend their character's time & resources that don't involve min/maxing or becoming more powerful? I hope Skyrim provides outlets for these kinds of things.

[Jermungand]

I think if an RPG's gameplay provided more approaches/strategies to overcoming enemies, and different enemies were more/less susceptible to different strategies, the line between too easy and too hard would dissolve some.

 

But as for your question... yeah I do that sort of thing. I indulge in chasing after the amenities, maybe train a little in my house, blow off steam, buy some stuff, and do a little light questing before I apply myself to getting over another obstacle to my progress in the game. Hey, it's exactly like taking a vacation in real life. Damn, I love TES.

[Fatalmasterpiece]

For Fallout 3 I found making the game as difficult as possible with mods like FOWE helped with this. In Oblivion it was difficult to -not-the wind up being god like. I didn't use mods like Midas because the last thing I needed was more power.

 

This is one reason I find the whole Dragon Shouts thing to be unattractive. I don't need some fancy, exclusive power. I want to just feel like my character is part of the world, not some star in an amusement park.

[JimboUK]

Level scaling if done properly can overcome a lot of problems, Morrowind got it right up until a certain level but then you turned into god, Oblivion got it wrong and you lost all sense of achievement and advancement. Take Morrowinds model and extend it to higher levels would be my answer, I just hope they don't tackle the problem with level capping.

[Jermungand]

Level scaling if done properly can overcome a lot of problems, Morrowind got it right up until a certain level but then you turned into god, Oblivion got it wrong and you lost all sense of achievement and advancement. Take Morrowinds model and extend it to higher levels would be my answer, I just hope they don't tackle the problem with level capping.

 

Too right. When it was disclosed that there would be level scaling in Skyrim, everyone got pissed because they assumed we're going to get Oblivion all over again. Level scaling wasn't anything new to Oblivion, just misapplied, like you said. It's SO easy to forget that.

 

 

@ Fatalmasterpiece:

Yeah, I hear that. I hope it won't feel that way.

Edited October 14, 2011 by Jermungand

[Corakus]

Level-scaling was crap in DF, I remember clearing out a dungeon full of rats, walking outside and leveling up, and when I walked back in all the rats were replaced with skeletons.Big "WTF" moment, right there.

[Jermungand]

DF?

[Violentguy]

DaggerFall, I'm assuming. Or he could be talking about DragonForce. It's really a toss up. Edited October 14, 2011 by Violentguy

[Corakus]

Daggerfall, DF was often the acronym used for it, some people would just call it Dagger.Yeah I hated daggerfall's level-scaling, it was almost impossible to play as a pure mage in the game, even if you trained all your magic skills to 100. Edited October 14, 2011 by Corakus

[JimboUK]

Level scaling if done properly can overcome a lot of problems, Morrowind got it right up until a certain level but then you turned into god, Oblivion got it wrong and you lost all sense of achievement and advancement. Take Morrowinds model and extend it to higher levels would be my answer, I just hope they don't tackle the problem with level capping.

 

Too right. When it was disclosed that there would be level scaling in Skyrim, everyone got pissed because they assumed we're going to get Oblivion all over again. Level scaling wasn't anything new to Oblivion, just misapplied, like you said. It's SO easy to forget that.

 

 

@ Fatalmasterpiece:

Yeah, I hear that. I hope it won't feel that way.

 

I don't see what the fuss is about, there is scaling in nearly every RPG, it's also present in shooters and even racing games. Altering the standard of the opposition to keep things interesting for the player is pretty much standard, as you unlock better weapons in shooters so do the enemy, when you get a better car in a racing game you'll find the opposition upgraded as well. If people really want enemies of all levels there from the start then they'll soon find that their open world suddenly isn't very open and when they do get powerful enough to go everywhere most enemies will provide no challenge at all.

 

 

Daggerfall, DF was often the acronym used for it, some people would just call it Dagger.Yeah I hated daggerfall's level-scaling, it was almost impossible to play as a pure mage in the game, even if you trained all your magic skills to 100.

 

I'd get banned if I repeat what I used to call it, I've never been able to get the thing to work for more than twenty minutes, this on every PC since the games release.