DDP MY MODS ARE DOWN, COMMENCE ATTACK ON BETHESDAS MAIN PLATFORM

[RaffTheSweetling]

@KibaH - I wrote a forum post on one of their Fallout 4 mod "feedback" threads which, I believe, was as articulate, non-attitudinal, and objective as I could be on the subject. Their response was to lock that particular thread immediately afterwards, and of course to give no reply.

[Trykz]

 

 

Seriously..... stop with the whole *but the EULA says......* nonsense. Because that's exactly what it is. Nonsense. EULA = toilet paper. They have the same value where copyright laws are concerned.

 

 

This law office say the opposite: http://www.nyccounsel.com/business-blogs-websites/who-owns-photos-and-videos-posted-on-facebook-or-twitter/

 

They are saying nonsense too?

 

Well if that's really the case, Facebook and all the others would have been condemned to paid million dollars and this is never happened yet.

 

And by the way the License Agreement=The Law it's the basic. A License Agreement have force of Law.

 

 

Yes. Nonsense. Answer this:

 

why do you think Bethesda went with the *file a legal DMCA takedown order* method of reporting stolen mods?

 

Because they know their EULA is SO one sided, it couldn't possibly hold up against a legitimate claim of copyright infringement or DMCA order:

 

A standard form contract (sometimes referred to as a contract of adhesion, a leonine contract, or a take-it-or-leave-it contract) is a contract between two parties, where the terms and conditions of the contract are set by one of the parties, and the other party has little or no ability to negotiate more favorable terms and is thus placed in a "take it or leave it" position.

While these types of contracts are not illegal per se, there exists a very real possibility for unconscionability. In addition, in the event of an ambiguity, such ambiguity will be resolved contra proferentem against the party drafting the contract language.

 

source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_form_contract

 

What is deemed *unconscionable*? Well, lets see:

 

Unconscionability (sometimes known as unconscionable dealing/conduct in Australia) is a doctrine in contract law that describes terms that are so extremely unjust, or overwhelmingly one-sided in favor of the party who has the superior bargaining power, that they are contrary to good conscience. Typically, an unconscionable contract is held to be unenforceable because no reasonable or informed person would otherwise agree to it. The perpetrator of the conduct is not allowed to benefit, because the consideration offered is lacking, or is so obviously inadequate, that to enforce the contract would be unfair to the party seeking to escape the contract.

 

source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unconscionability

 

Reading just the basic law and rulings of completely unrelated case law is not always the best way to prove your point :wink:

 

When you're talking about video game EULAs, you need to extend your knowledge *beyond* just the basic content language of the agreement. You also need to understand the underlying provisions that make them legally binding.

 

Read the EULA. It gives you NO RIGHTS whatsoever. It's so laughably one sided that I'm pretty sure it's more a running joke among Beth/Zeni's legal department, than anything meant to be legal or binding.

[Mythos214]

Some of those comments linked in the video.. ouch. I guess I can kind of see where the irritation comes from, lol.

[dragovianlord9]

I understand your anger, Daren. But this will only make thing worse. Either way, I am against console mod right now after everything that has happened.

[KibaH]

@KibaH - I wrote a forum post on one of their Fallout 4 mod "feedback" threads which, I believe, was as articulate, non-attitudinal, and objective as I could be on the subject. Their response was to lock that particular thread immediately afterwards, and of course to give no reply.

 

Bethesda did that? Damn... regardless that is also the reason that I believe sending an actual email and starting a conversation with them through a more private medium (where not every upset writer can pull claims) and ask for the issue to be forwarded to the legal department or some other part of Bethesda. The reason why I am adamant on the issue being forwarded via email, or phone calls is that it not only seems a more professional approach from Bethesdas point of view, but that it also filters out outside toxic influences like what seemed to hit you, and also me just now as you can see on the post below:

 

 

Not to seem daft, as I totally think ripping off others work without credit is a dick move. But has anyone even tried to actually contact bethesda on the issue? Or are everyone just sitting around writing rants and posting hate videos?

 

Just saying, because Bethesda, as a business dont sit and stroll through youtube for feedback.

 

The only way to make a difference is to go to Bethesda, find a email adress to someone in the company, and write to them en-masse with a "Regards, -your name-" in the end.

 

Best regards

Your neighborhood bore

Blackburn

 

-EDIT-

 

Oh and naturally stay civil, starting a "war" and being toxic wont promote any kind of positive outcome.

If you are truly bothered by this, send Bethesda and actual email, contact them by whatever means and write along the lines of

 

"Dear Bethesda

 

Your community, that is to say the modders, have this and this issue

this bothers me, and a lot of others as you can see -link link- here

please do something about it or otherwise take some kind of official action

towards this.

Regards

John Jackson (or whatever your names are)

"

 

-EDIT 2-

 

And lastly, to clarify. The issue at hand is that users of the bethesda modding community are taking content made by people

here on nexus, and distributing it on the bethesda site without consent of the mod authors, while it is a dick move there are no

legal issues on this matter as your content isnt bound under any kind of copyright.

And since they arent making profit off of your content it moves the entire thing into a grey zone legally.

You dont lose capital from this, you do however see your work distributed by others on a different platform.

Have you tried contacting said persons and asking them (nicely) to credit you for your work on your site?

In the worst case just make sure to refuse support to people who are using your content via bethesdas site?

 

TL:DR

Quick solution: Nicely ask the people releasing your mods on bethesdas site to give you credit on your work

Long solution: Write actual emails, call their support services, and make an effort to contact bethesda and make your

case if you want results. Writing toxic rants and making music videos of comments wont get you what you want.

 

 

Damn kibaH your last part sound like one of those retards in the DD's video, did you actually mod something?

 

As i can see, no you're just asking for free content and you don't care about the guys who does this content for you... nice you're oficially an idiot.

 

Let's pretend a story, you're a writter who have admiration for... let's say Shakespeare, so your editor asks to you to write a preface of Romeo and Juliet to put it in the new edition of the book the company is doing, you do it because you love Shakespeare and you love to write. A week after the release of the book another company takes your text and uses it into another nobel without even asking you saying that you're not losing money because the book you're selling is not your own, you just made a preface... and then a bounch of reader assholes says that you cann't say it's yours because you don't own the English language...

 

So yea that's what they're doing and that's what you're saying so if you're saying that i must say you're an idiot.

 

 

Changing to this reply I have not made any mods since I lack that kind of talent and skill, I totally respect the people behind the content on the nexus but stand firmly on the belief that the content released by modders are released

for the sake of the content, and not the modders that made it, ofcouse I will not claim to speak in the name of every modder out there, in which I apologise to the individual modders that feel their mods content should only deem to promote THEM as people.

 

In terms of your example I cant help but be puzzled as to several points. You speak of a company, editor, writer and readers who copy your content (copycats). In this example you put the writer in the position of a employee , an official with an editor who do something: writing, for a living. This situation cant be related to these situations, modders dont mod, or SHOULD not mod, for money (For several reasons including infringement of fallout 4s EULA(not making money off of their product)) but to improve upon the game, get their creative muscles pumping and do what they LIKE to do (which is the only thing that can relate to your story honestly).

 

I understand and fully support the frustration modders may have of their content being uploaded to another service, and claimed as others work/not being given credit.

 

But to take such actions as campaigning against said service in such an agressive manner as

"declaring war",

ranting,

making comment videos to showcase other peoples trolling behavior,

hiding their mods from the ABSOLUTE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE who sincerely like it,

calling other people idiots because they stay objective to the situation and dont jump on the wagon, but instead try to convince the masses of a more correct way of approaching things (as is done in the real world(trump is not an example, Im not sure he is a human being))

is NOT an answer, but is to take a much more unresolving ,and frankly SELFISH approach to the entire thing.

 

You SHOULD make mods to share content that you have created with the fallout 4 community for the sake of the mods

NOT to promote youself in those manners.

 

And under no circumstances should you take to these toxic behaviors, caving in to your raging anger and behaving in such a spiteful and hateful manner.

Go cool your head, calm down, and lets talk about these things.

 

PS. Calling anyone in any case an idiot for sharing their point of view is not a solution. Ever. Nor does it make anything you say more right.

[CrimsonKingXIII]

Not to seem daft, as I totally think ripping off others work without credit is a dick move. But has anyone even tried to actually contact bethesda on the issue? Or are everyone just sitting around writing rants and posting hate videos?

 

Just saying, because Bethesda, as a business dont sit and stroll through youtube for feedback.

 

The only way to make a difference is to go to Bethesda, find a email adress to someone in the company, and write to them en-masse with a "Regards, -your name-" in the end.

 

Best regards

Your neighborhood bore

Blackburn

 

-EDIT-

 

Oh and naturally stay civil, starting a "war" and being toxic wont promote any kind of positive outcome.

If you are truly bothered by this, send Bethesda and actual email, contact them by whatever means and write along the lines of

 

"Dear Bethesda

 

Your community, that is to say the modders, have this and this issue

this bothers me, and a lot of others as you can see -link link- here

please do something about it or otherwise take some kind of official action

towards this.

Regards

John Jackson (or whatever your names are)

"

 

-EDIT 2-

 

And lastly, to clarify. The issue at hand is that users of the bethesda modding community are taking content made by people

here on nexus, and distributing it on the bethesda site without consent of the mod authors, while it is a dick move there are no

legal issues on this matter as your content isnt bound under any kind of copyright.

And since they arent making profit off of your content it moves the entire thing into a grey zone legally.

You dont lose capital from this, you do however see your work distributed by others on a different platform.

Have you tried contacting said persons and asking them (nicely) to credit you for your work on your site?

In the worst case just make sure to refuse support to people who are using your content via bethesdas site?

 

TL:DR

Quick solution: Nicely ask the people releasing your mods on bethesdas site to give you credit on your work

Long solution: Write actual emails, call their support services, and make an effort to contact bethesda and make your

case if you want results. Writing toxic rants and making music videos of comments wont get you what you want.

 

In response to your second edit, the TOS on Bethesda's site does say the mod author owns their work. Sure Bethesda/Zenimax could probably do whatever they want with the mod, but these thieves and defenders of the thieves are not part of either of those two companies so they can and hopefully will be punished, that is why an official Bethesda representative came forward and encouraged DMCA reports to filed, I hope Bethesda will take a more active role in policing their own site though.

 

This line is found under section 2 entry D of Bethesda.net's TOS found here https://bethesda.net/#en/termsofservice

 

Each Game Mod is owned by the developer of the Game Mod, subject to the licenses granted by the developer to ZeniMax as set forth in the Editor EULA.

[Thaneize]

 

Each Game Mod is owned by the developer of the Game Mod, subject to the licenses granted by the developer to ZeniMax as set forth in the Editor EULA.

This

Copyrights are given too, just check the "permissions" tab when you next download a mod.

 

I was a console player before skyrim myself and i can absolutely understand they want mods too and even if they think they do right because "robin hood", it isn't. Btw. it's not theft, you cant steal a mod that doesnt physically exists, its copyright infringement, simple as that. But lets not get fussed up about the terminology here.

If you have permissions by the original mod Author and you give him proper credit, i don't see the slightest issue, because thats how you do it in a world of civilized people.

Edited June 8, 2016 by Thaneize

[KibaH]

@CrimsonKingXIII

 

Thanks! Thats great! That means the mod authors can make a legal claim to their work much more easily! Neato!

 

Now all that remains is having Beth take charge of the situation and take down mods that have claim by their authors (and havent been properly credited)

 

May I suggest a petition sent to Bethesda?

 

And naturally, its vital to keep it civil and knock off all that name calling and chat ranting that Ive seen both here , on youtube, and on beth. Solves nothing ;)

[MasterMagnus]

The problem is there is no way for the 'end user' to verify that the modder actually got permission from the actual author. Real simple to type that you 'got permission'.

 

Which is exactly what happened with the most high profile thefts.

 

Following the conventions of 'civilized people' only works if everyone is civilized.

[ShinraStrife]

The problem is there is no way for the 'end user' to verify that the modder actually got permission from the actual author. Real simple to type that you 'got permission'.

 

http://66.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m43fmnEFfl1rqfhi2o1_400.gif

 

Yep. It's far too easy to fabricate a screenshot and say "yeah this user gave me permission, here's the screencap" or some BS. The internet is too easy a place to fabricate lies on because of the wall of anonymity you have.