LE Hand To Hand overhaul, The basis of all combat!

[siomasm]

Whatever you or other people do, I hope for plenty of new animations. As it is, you swing like a guy who's trying to get his ass kicked. I don't think anyone at Bethesda has ever seen or been in a fight:p

 

I'm hoping that it might be possible to use the Beast race claw animations for Claw specific weapons at the very least. Ideally there might be a better sort of punch for thrust/wrist blades, though those animations would have to be made from scratch I assume.

 

@AndrewWaltfeld

The idea behind the sprint attack (assuming it is indeed activated while sprinting, not while jogging at someone) is that you will be using a lot of stamina and that it will be very situational. That being the case, I want slamming into someone at full speed to have a lot of force. It shouldn't be usable frequently, but should conversely be a powerful if somewhat difficult move to use.

[RagnaHighArc]

Whatever you or other people do, I hope for plenty of new animations. As it is, you swing like a guy who's trying to get his ass kicked. I don't think anyone at Bethesda has ever seen or been in a fight:p

 

Exactly. IMO The melee combat in skyrim is terrible. With rumors of new consoles coming up next year or something, I would've like to see Bethesda delay the game a year just to incorporate better fighting mechanics into the game. But that's something for a different thread...

 

Anyway, The ideas for h2h are great, but i wanna add a few more ideas to 2 handed fighting.

 

Staggering Jab into:

 

Intestinal Hold: Face to face hold that slowly kills an enemy by grabbing the abdomen while the enemy is staggered and right before inhaling. Only for 1v1.

 

Coding wise, it would be easy to write a loop of loud heavy breathing and have a timer start with each loop. If the player activates the appropriate attack during the appropriate time during the loop the "hold effect" will activate.

 

The main problem is the animation and will be the main problem for any type of h2h overhaul mod.

 

I just write code. So if anyone is willing to do the animation, let me know and we'll start getting ready for the Skyrim Construction Set..

Edited November 28, 2011 by RagnaHighArc

[maboru]

Hand to Hand may be packed somewhere in a bsa but not currently implemented. I got a (random?) loot pair of gloves somewhere that gave some percentage boost to Hand to Hand combat. Why have that if there wasn't a tree planned for it in the first place?

[uruku7]

Hand to Hand may be packed somewhere in a bsa but not currently implemented. I got a (random?) loot pair of gloves somewhere that gave some percentage boost to Hand to Hand combat. Why have that if there wasn't a tree planned for it in the first place?

 

Maybe just to have an edge while brawling? There is a heavy armor perk that does similar.

[AndrewWaltfeld]

 

 

@AndrewWaltfeld

The idea behind the sprint attack (assuming it is indeed activated while sprinting, not while jogging at someone) is that you will be using a lot of stamina and that it will be very situational. That being the case, I want slamming into someone at full speed to have a lot of force. It shouldn't be usable frequently, but should conversely be a powerful if somewhat difficult move to use.

Indeed, what I mean is use the forward power attack to do a weaker version of that attack, that would a lower chance of doing anything. It's not being used for anything else, so it might be a good thing to use it for. *shrugs* just a suggestion.

[siomasm]

 

 

@AndrewWaltfeld

The idea behind the sprint attack (assuming it is indeed activated while sprinting, not while jogging at someone) is that you will be using a lot of stamina and that it will be very situational. That being the case, I want slamming into someone at full speed to have a lot of force. It shouldn't be usable frequently, but should conversely be a powerful if somewhat difficult move to use.

Indeed, what I mean is use the forward power attack to do a weaker version of that attack, that would a lower chance of doing anything. It's not being used for anything else, so it might be a good thing to use it for. *shrugs* just a suggestion.

Considering how useless the back power attack usually is (super short range with h2h, so moving backwards and attacking will often miss unless the target is extremely aggressive) it might be a good idea to remove that and put a special power forward attack as you suggested. Though I would like it to be something more interesting than a weaker version of the sprint attack...

 

@maboru

I don't think so, and I do know the gloves you are talking about (or something like them). There is also the perk that uruku7 mentioned (Fists of steel for heavy armor. Armor rating of gloves is converted to h2h damage) but between the two of them there is not really enough to make h2h viable unless you are a kajit with really good h2h enchants and great gloves. And even then, it only scales to such a point and lacks the bonuses of the 1h and 2h trees.

[Wingarmac]

Hello,

I've tested some of unarmed mods available on nexus, but none was good at all. There is no need to create an all tree for this I think ...

The point is to fight with bare hands using the pairing option already ingame to stagger the enemy, and to have the ability to use the one handed skill tree as well as the blocking skill tree to add unarmed options. This could bring some sense in all those kind of mods for unarmed combat. Also instead of blocking a dodge or take and throw function (aikido, judo) replacing on blocking functions, should be used for immersion.

​The unarmed combat is using fists like a weapon, where normally weapons would be in appliance.

The difference should be in the speed of applying the punches in opposition with the normal one handed weapons. (You don't wear weapons, so you're not so heavy and encumbered)

To apply this fictif and invisible one handed weapons should be auto-mounted, in order to trigger the xp functions and combat functions of the already available one handed tree.

The punches can have elemental adds in to perks, because gloves can't be enchanted for attack.

But this makes it again a use a magi instead of pure combat skill / timing /avoiding abilities and strategy.

Like the correct timing for blocking with normal weapons or shields.

Combining this with shouts is marvelous. They stagger, so you can have some time to throw some punches !!!

But with the mods I tried, there was some pause between the shout and the first punch you can throw.

This should be resolved.

I think two types of one handed combat should be available:

Defensive (dexterity and critical strikes and more martial trow like aikido or judo with light armor to dodge attacks (for Bruce Lee and ninja fans))

Aggressive (heavy armor with knock downs and the ability to be immune to staggering so well as taking and throwing the enemy like a catcher (what could be used to throw him from a mountain border !!!))

Because fist combat is most often used in real without any weapon or shield in the other hand it should be part of the one handed tree next to double weapon perk.

I've also tested the mod dual wielding blocking.

An unarmed perk in the one handed skill tree for dual wielding after activating dual flurry was missing for my part.

It could be related with the ability to block with bare hands and trigger the blocking skill tree. This was also missing.

Example:

Park 1. One handed combat

Perk 2. Dual flury/Martial combat

Perk 3. Dual flury -> Savage ... (also activate for bare hands)

Eventually here can be added some speed or elemental add for unarmed combat in order to balance this type of fighting with other skills.

1. unarmed perk:

2. equipped perk :

Perk 4. Dual flury -> defence:

1. unarmed: blocking ability with both hands should make the enemy receive a kick or punch that makes him stagger without damage if it's on the right moment.

2. equipped with weapons: Not with weapons equipped, where it should only block.

The blocking skill tree should make the moment easier to guess for bare hands combat.

I'm not talented in programming ... And I think I'm some kind of experienced gamer.

I would be happy to see this coming out soon .... (but it's probably dreaming)

I've tested a lot before I contacted you:

Warfare, one handed, combat idles, monk perk trees, separate perks with statues...

Fists to slow

Complicated combined mod installations:

dual wielding/parring, compatibility with fine idles ...

incoherent perk trees in some cases

and lots of bugs with slowing time perks and other adds to unarmed combat ...

I think it can be easier to play without a lot of modification, except for this dual wielding blocking thing and the fact that the one handed perk tree needs to raise when punching with fists.

.... Not my cup of thee.... :wink:

And if it's too easy, you can think about grabbing and throwing eventually ???? No ?