LE Better Cities?

[Drakulux]

Cant wait for this mod, I do 3d modelling so I will be willing to take apart some of the models and remodel them for the new improved cities. I just dont know how to mod so I would just be helping the design aspect. I can texture to an ok degree but I am not a pro,though I use photoshop a lot. Also I have quite a creative eyesight and have lived in africa where I have gone through poor areas and read a lot of fantasy novels.

[havefunwilltravel]

Cant wait for this mod, I do 3d modelling so I will be willing to take apart some of the models and remodel them for the new improved cities. I just dont know how to mod so I would just be helping the design aspect. I can texture to an ok degree but I am not a pro,though I use photoshop a lot. Also I have quite a creative eyesight and have lived in africa where I have gone through poor areas and read a lot of fantasy novels.

 

This should help a bit: http://dgh.wikispaces.com/file/view/wh06msc09hcu011ap.jpg/76599259/wh06msc09hcu011ap.jpg

 

Now no need for THAT many farms as in the pic, just 3-4 more. That's for Whiterun, Windhelm, Riften, but for Solitude, expand the docks on the other side of the warehouse with buildings on the docks like in Riften. Around Markarth? Expanding the little mining town and farm with a few more buildings around them to make it look more complete.

Edited January 13, 2012 by havefunwilltravel

[AssyMcGee]

Cant wait for this mod, I do 3d modelling so I will be willing to take apart some of the models and remodel them for the new improved cities. I just dont know how to mod so I would just be helping the design aspect. I can texture to an ok degree but I am not a pro,though I use photoshop a lot. Also I have quite a creative eyesight and have lived in africa where I have gone through poor areas and read a lot of fantasy novels.

 

This should help a bit: http://dgh.wikispaces.com/file/view/wh06msc09hcu011ap.jpg/76599259/wh06msc09hcu011ap.jpg

 

Now no need for THAT many farms as in the pic, just 3-4 more. That's for Whiterun, Windhelm, Riften, but for Solitude, expand the docks on the other side of the warehouse with buildings on the docks like in Riften. Around Markarth? Expanding the little mining town and farm with a few more buildings around them to make it look more complete.

 

You do 3D modeling!? That'd be great if you could help. I've said it before I'll say it again. I can't model. I'd have no problem using the CK and placing things. I actually enjoy that and get a little to nit picky when things don't align correctly. I've spent hours aligning hallways in Oblivion to avoid any lines.

 

I agree that Solitude should have it's shipping expanded, farming would be more difficult, but with the presence of the East Empire Company we can assume they'd import a lot of food. That in mind, some warehouses with special properties would be in order. One filled with ice, and a light mist for cold goods and one that's dry for dry storage. Also looking at that picture a water mill that grinds flour would be cool. It seems unrealistic that only sawmills use water and flour mills use wind.

[BadMaker]

I was doing a bit of rough number crunching and found out a palce like Morthal only has about 20-25 NPC's if you count the guards. Solitude has around 90 if you count the guards. The city of Anvil from the TES:Oblivion has about 90 as well including guards. The Imperial city seems to have around 250-300 NPCs! Skyrim has 5 major cities, 4 minor cities, 1 large town (riverwood is actually the size of Morthal), some lumber mills, farms and a half dozen villages. We also have 4 orc strongholds which are like small towns. Oblivion has the imperial city, which is huge and practically counts as 2-3 major cities. 7 major cities, not counting Kvatch obviously. 10 villages, a few farms and chapels/isolated inns.

 

So. Do we focus on converting one city in Skyrim into a major city like the imperial city? How could we add 'depth' with quests and things to do?

 

Or should we try focusing on upgrading some smaller cities into major cities, or maybe converting some of the towns/larger villages into cities?

[MajikMoshos]

First off, good research there BadMaker. Amazing to realise that Imperial city alone seems to have a larger population than Skyrim's Cities put together. That's...not quite right. We need to fix that!

 

What Assy presented is more of an effort to improve all the cities, giving them all some more depth. So I suppose the concensus is for a Skyrim-wide City overhaul. I proposed a general plan in my last post, what we start with, how we organise side projects etc.

 

We focus on the easier ones first. The ones that are less hassle, that don't get in the way of too many quests, encounters and whatnot. Whiterun for instance, has lots of usable space. Meanwhile for somewhere like Markath, expanding it would involve altering the terrain, the rocks etc. which would be quite a lot of work. And with Solitude, we've got to deal with that big rock which houses Potema's catacombs. In between that we can fix up the smaller places like a little side project. Of course the final touch of immersion would be putting in hundreds of additonal NPCs, then giving them names, backstories, voices (I doubt we could do worse than some of the vanilla VAs) and little radiant quests. Maybe some fancy sidequests when all's done.

 

I propose making Markarth's (expanded) Warrens the testing ground for quests - keep things centred there, no need to worry about involving dungeons and other cities. It'll be a learning experience, we'll be able to make a whole bunch of NPCs, both minor and major with little interlocking stories and such. Even without quests, the design itself will tell the story of the Warrens, of the daily hell these people go through. It'll prepare us for the road ahead - breathing life into the new space.

[havefunwilltravel]

I was doing a bit of rough number crunching and found out a palce like Morthal only has about 20-25 NPC's if you count the guards. Solitude has around 90 if you count the guards. The city of Anvil from the TES:Oblivion has about 90 as well including guards. The Imperial city seems to have around 250-300 NPCs! Skyrim has 5 major cities, 4 minor cities, 1 large town (riverwood is actually the size of Morthal), some lumber mills, farms and a half dozen villages. We also have 4 orc strongholds which are like small towns. Oblivion has the imperial city, which is huge and practically counts as 2-3 major cities. 7 major cities, not counting Kvatch obviously. 10 villages, a few farms and chapels/isolated inns.

 

So. Do we focus on converting one city in Skyrim into a major city like the imperial city? How could we add 'depth' with quests and things to do?

 

Or should we try focusing on upgrading some smaller cities into major cities, or maybe converting some of the towns/larger villages into cities?

 

Are you including all the guards and peasants on the outside? Most of Oblivion's towns had everything behind the walls, the ones in Skyrim differed in having an outside portion.

[Thedragonemperor]

I have to say that you guys are planning some great things. I agree with a large majority of the ideas that have been put out there and I can't wait for a final product when this many great ideas are all in one thread. I hope you all succeed in this, since it would mean good things for the immersion factor. Keep doing what you guys are doing, since it promises good things.

[BannerFigurezZz]

I think this is a great idea, I also feel the cities are way to small and smaller then in Oblivion.

I also feel they are less alive, thanks to same architecture and spawn delay with people (when you walk the streets there is almost no one but a bit later they are).

Also I think that the idea of it being smaller is contributed to by the lack of details, like the secret castle entrances and the smaller amount of quests (yes unlimited quests but i mean like go in the castle for they are torchering people or the count is a vampire like quests).

The houses themselves are better but feel less.

 

Details I think is the underlying problem here, the lack of them

[BadMaker]

Are you including all the guards and peasants on the outside? Most of Oblivion's towns had everything behind the walls, the ones in Skyrim differed in having an outside portion.

 

That includes a rough number of guards, but it might not include as many NPC's just outside the city.

 

A 'better suburbs' might be another idea for a sub-mod for better cities. I was picturing a new ring wall for Whiterun which would have new urban districts, but a big city like Whiterun also needs more farms around it, especially flanking major roads.

[UkManiak]

Agreed 100%. I am beginning to think Bethesda put this game out the way it was for this reason, to see what modders can do. At least Bethesda puts faith and trust into you guys. EA and Ubisoft are out to make you look like terrorists for sucks fake. I appreciate beyond words what you guys have done for my PC experience with Skyrim. It was one of the two main reasons I bought my first gaming rig last September, Skyrim and Arma 2. Neither side has disappointed yet thanks to modders. There will be city files soon thanks to this post, give them time.