LE Werewolf Overhaul

[Wraithofdoom]

dianacat, i'll copy your signature as my own if its ok, would love this to get some more attention (hopefully modders attention) i would volunteer for writing quests or dialogue but i dont think im very good so dunno :confused:

[WolfScribe]

I would like to add a few things based on what I've read so far (and that I can remember). Good call about being able to pass on lycanthropy to other NPC's, some liking it and some not.. I would say only a few NPCs should have the option available and even fewer willing to accept it.. NPCs that do not want the disease should then follow one of three options. The first being to report you, giving you a bounty in the same manor that transforming and getting caught currently does. The second should be to issue a warning, something along the lines of 'I should have the guards arrest you for this! Though I'm not exactly in good stead with them myself.. Leave.. before I change my mind.' Presumably the NPC (that has spoken this) is also available as a follower, this being the case they should no longer be available as a follower after they have refused and ask the player to 'leave' if they come into contact again. And the third being to along the lines of 'I must decline.. but do not fear, your secret is safe with me' (said politely of course).

 

Spouses should always accept the offer after some conversation about the consequences. Essential NPCs should not have the option until their quest role is fulfilled (to avoid possible glitches) and even then only some should have the option e.g dark brotherhood members and Thieves guild members. Members of the College of Winterhold would be very unlikely to accept as such a gift/curse goes against their nature for the most part.

 

I love the idea of being able to call to other werewovles through the night sky.. I would say this should have the affect of 'asking' them to join you, in effect a random chance of a werewolf follower joining you. If dialogue options were to be implemented here then I would suggest something like the following.

 

Player uses a 'communication howl' - IF a werewolf is in earshot then they will howl back - if the player then howls again this is treated by the NPC werewolf as an invitation to hunt/join the pack.* - If the NPC returns the howl they will shortly arrive as a follower. - *If the NPC werewolf does NOT howl back at this stage then they are not interested or have declined the invite.

 

The chance of the werewolf joining the player should be around 60% initially, this improves gradually over time due to various factors; completion of possible werewolf missions (if they are implemented), days as a werewolf and number of mauls.

 

I would also love to see a Beastblood perk tree. The tree should initially be invisible to non werewolf players as to not spoil the surprise and should (if possible) gain perks available for use separately to the other perks, this avoids spreading perks between too many perk trees. If possible a separate werewolf level could be added (also affects chance of werewolf follower), capped at level 10, this would mean 10 perks on the tree. Importantly though is to keep these perks realistic (if there is such a thing) and not to end up with an invincible werewolf. I envision some of the perks being; Increased speed, better climbing ability, higher chance of one shot kills, increased stealth ability (some of these have already been stated I know), increased pack size (probably capped at 2/3 (initially 1 less than this) werewolf followers gained though aforementioned method + spouse if werewolf or NPC such as Aela)

 

I will post again soon as I am currently falling asleep -.- Zzz

[Wraithofdoom]

I would like to add a few things based on what I've read so far (and that I can remember). Good call about being able to pass on lycanthropy to other NPC's, some liking it and some not.. I would say only a few NPCs should have the option available and even fewer willing to accept it.. NPCs that do not want the disease should then follow one of three options. The first being to report you, giving you a bounty in the same manor that transforming and getting caught currently does. The second should be to issue a warning, something along the lines of 'I should have the guards arrest you for this! Though I'm not exactly in good stead with them myself.. Leave.. before I change my mind.' Presumably the NPC (that has spoken this) is also available as a follower, this being the case they should no longer be available as a follower after they have refused and ask the player to 'leave' if they come into contact again. And the third being to along the lines of 'I must decline.. but do not fear, your secret is safe with me' (said politely of course).

 

But how would the npcs know who you are if you infected them on werewolf form ?

[dianacat777]

Wraith, sure! I'd love for this to get attention.

 

First off, WolfScribe. For the option to infect them... I'd say it either only appears for people you've done favors for, or only works for people you've done favors for. Good idea, but also, I imagine that firstly, if you're infecting them by attacking them as a werewolf, they don't know it's you until they're a werewolf - and when they're a werewolf, they'll be less opposed to werewolves unless they had a strong moral reason against it. Otherwise, you're infecting them by slipping them werewolf blood... but do you honestly outright tell somebody that, or do you just say 'Hey, try this potion! :D", and if they trust you, they're like 'Okay 8D', and after that, it's like o_O, and they can either roll with it if they like you enough (you might have some explaining to do... but that really could get repetitive, with you, the PC, saying the same thing over and over again to all of your confused werewolf spawn), or they can flip out and turn on you (this being rare, because how did you get them to drink the potion if they didn't trust you to begin with? Of course, there's also the people that you infect via attacking, but that's a different story.)

 

For the howling. Howls should always summon werewolves you've turned within earshot, as you infected them, and therefore serve as their 'alpha'; they answer your call because you're the dominant one, even if you're nice about it. Wild werewolves don't necessarily have to join you, but they either probably will, or just plain will (depending on coding feasibility) come up to you for the sake of companionship, curiosity, a good hunt, or just 'Hey, there's another werewolf out tonight! Cool.' The biggest difference I'm seeing here is distance-wise; your subordinates and (daytime) followers will travel further to meet you than a random werewolf, who might hear you but not feel like trekking across a mountain just to reach you. If there's a success chance factor, it'd probably be scaled alongside werewolf quests, but also character level; strength equals respect, and the like. I'd also say that subsequent howls would have less and less chance of success, as you might start to get annoying. But that's pretty complicated, and as I'm not a coder, I don't know how feasible this all is.

 

I do like the idea of the NPC howling back, though. That's a really good idea. Perhaps a message at the corner of your screen (A werewolf)/(Your packmate) has answered your call, in order to distinguish it from an ambient howling werewolf. Perhaps other messages too, like 'Your howl echoes through the night, but recieves no response.' and 'You howl in vain; none of your kind are within earshot.' to further clarify the result, and whether or not you should keep trying.

 

I'd see it similarly. You howl; if they howl back, it means they're coming to join you. Once they've arrived, you have an option of what to do with them, placed in a standard dialogue box; accept as follower, greet (maybe some wolfy animation here or something, really just for flavor), or dismiss.

 

A feature I'd like to see, again, if possible, is an option for the other werewolf to 'take point'; to head off to a nearby fort, cave, or barrow, etc. Again, immersion, but it's basically a 'Well, what do you want to do?' At any point, you can take the lead again and make the werewolf follow you normally.

 

The high chance of success in summoning a werewolf is offset by the rarity of werewolves (if you regularly want to form a pack, you'd better start infecting your own people). Also, werewolf followers are very aggressive (due to everything else being aggressive towards them), and being a werewolf yourself means you have no access to calm spells. So if you want to avoid fights or remain undetected, you may wish to spend your nights solo.

 

Werewolves in the werewolf clans cannot be called by howls unless you belong to their clan, as their loyalty is strictly to their clan. Might be harder to code, though. Hm.

Edited December 19, 2011 by dianacat777

[TheElderInfinity]

Wraith, sure! I'd love for this to get attention.

 

First off, WolfScribe. For the option to infect them... I'd say it either only appears for people you've done favors for, or only works for people you've done favors for. Good idea, but also, I imagine that firstly, if you're infecting them by attacking them as a werewolf, they don't know it's you until they're a werewolf - and when they're a werewolf, they'll be less opposed to werewolves unless they had a strong moral reason against it. Otherwise, you're infecting them by slipping them werewolf blood... but do you honestly outright tell somebody that, or do you just say 'Hey, try this potion! :D", and if they trust you, they're like 'Okay 8D', and after that, it's like o_O, and they can either roll with it if they like you enough (you might have some explaining to do... but that really could get repetitive, with you, the PC, saying the same thing over and over again to all of your confused werewolf spawn), or they can flip out and turn on you (this being rare, because how did you get them to drink the potion if they didn't trust you to begin with? Of course, there's also the people that you infect via attacking, but that's a different story.)

 

For the howling. Howls should always summon werewolves you've turned within earshot, as you infected them, and therefore serve as their 'alpha'; they answer your call because you're the dominant one, even if you're nice about it. Wild werewolves don't necessarily have to join you, but they either probably will, or just plain will (depending on coding feasibility) come up to you for the sake of companionship, curiosity, a good hunt, or just 'Hey, there's another werewolf out tonight! Cool.' The biggest difference I'm seeing here is distance-wise; your subordinates and (daytime) followers will travel further to meet you than a random werewolf, who might hear you but not feel like trekking across a mountain just to reach you. If there's a success chance factor, it'd probably be scaled alongside werewolf quests, but also character level; strength equals respect, and the like. I'd also say that subsequent howls would have less and less chance of success, as you might start to get annoying. But that's pretty complicated, and as I'm not a coder, I don't know how feasible this all is.

 

I do like the idea of the NPC howling back, though. That's a really good idea. Perhaps a message at the corner of your screen (A werewolf)/(Your packmate) has answered your call, in order to distinguish it from an ambient howling werewolf. Perhaps other messages too, like 'Your howl echoes through the night, but recieves no response.' and 'You howl in vain; none of your kind are within earshot.' to further clarify the result, and whether or not you should keep trying.

 

I'd see it similarly. You howl; if they howl back, it means they're coming to join you. Once they've arrived, you have an option of what to do with them, placed in a standard dialogue box; accept as follower, greet (maybe some wolfy animation here or something, really just for flavor), or dismiss.

 

A feature I'd like to see, again, if possible, is an option for the other werewolf to 'take point'; to head off to a nearby fort, cave, or barrow, etc. Again, immersion, but it's basically a 'Well, what do you want to do?' At any point, you can take the lead again and make the werewolf follow you normally.

 

The high chance of success in summoning a werewolf is offset by the rarity of werewolves (if you regularly want to form a pack, you'd better start infecting your own people). Also, werewolf followers are very aggressive (due to everything else being aggressive towards them), and being a werewolf yourself means you have no access to calm spells. So if you want to avoid fights or remain undetected, you may wish to spend your nights solo.

 

Werewolves in the werewolf clans cannot be called by howls unless you belong to their clan, as their loyalty is strictly to their clan. Might be harder to code, though. Hm.

 

Not really, regarding the clan based summons. Since you're obviously going to be adding the player to a faction in order to make them part of a clan, you could give them a technically different howl for each clan (though it naturally has the same name and other such stuff), which summons different types of werewolves.

[TheElderInfinity]

Hmm, do you think its time that this thread be retired and a new one made in Mod Talk? It looks as if we're doing this for real once CK comes out...So yeah.

[dianacat777]

I don't know - do you have to have a coherent team before starting there? And should I copy over the first post, adding important points that have come up over this thread?

 

Plus, we need some fancy name for it.

[Wraithofdoom]

until you have a team of people committed to doing it (that includes a lot more than voice actors and quest writing) i would suggest to leave it in this section. :whistling:

[dianacat777]

Not to mention, I'm not a leader. You/me/whoever has/have to find somebody who fits that role, because I can't organize, keep up with this, manage... I bounce off ideas, and I write. But I can't keep things in order.

 

Oh, and Infinity, I forgot to mention - or I ever said clearly - I think the main issue I had with what you proposed was that of the three packs, none were a moral grey area.

[TheElderInfinity]

Not to mention, I'm not a leader. You/me/whoever has/have to find somebody who fits that role, because I can't organize, keep up with this, manage... I bounce off ideas, and I write. But I can't keep things in order.

 

Oh, and Infinity, I forgot to mention - or I ever said clearly - I think the main issue I had with what you proposed was that of the three packs, none were a moral grey area.

 

I, I re'd to that. Been on a bit of a 40k lore binge lately, which is probably why everyone is evil.

 

^^ I'm actually rather good at bear bones CS level design, assuming CK works along the same lines, there shouldn't be a problem on my end. Obviously our first priority is to get the werewolves working the way we want and insert them into the gameworld. I'd be up for the rather daunting task of placing werewolf spawn points throughout the world, and the only animation that we need immediately (sneaking) can easily be given a placeholder. All we really need is someone who's good at scripting to get the ball rolling.