The Rights of Native Americans and First Nations

[Lisnpuppy]

Here is my take on this.

 

To begin...I live in the U.S in West Virginia which is "country."

 

Most people here are decendants of Irish, Scots-Irish and my Grandfather (who was born in Kentucky) grew up helping make moonshine. I am in my mind a true example of the melting pot of cultural America as I can claim decendancy from Ireland, England, Scotland, Wales and Seminole American Indian.

 

I have a great-great grandmother who looks like she should be wearing feathers on her head, another that was red headed. I have a direct decendancy from John Adams, John Quincy Adams and Sam Adams (see I come from a long line of trouble makers!)

 

Every branch of my family could claim prejudice and some slight done (and in the case of being from poor Appalachian areas) even still.

 

What of the English treatment of the Irish and Scotish? Prodestant vs Catholic? North vs South? Etc, etc etc....As a great deal of my family also lived in Virginia and fought on the Dixie side in the Civil War who knows what else has been done or was done by my ancestors. As I am not a full-blooded anything I will not claim to completely understand racial prejudice. But reparations can not be made by every government to every people ever slighted...no matter how wrong and horrible it was. It just is not practical and though I may be sad of what was done by or done to my ancestors I can not bear the sins of my fathers.

 

What we can do is try to give everyone alive today the same opportunity as any other. As I have stated in other threads I believe equal access to education is a great way to begin this. No it doesn't solve everything but it is a start. I did not get as good as a education in West Virginia as those in say...Silver SPrings Maryland did. I should have. I could blame a great deal of circumstance on this and it may even be true. So if we level out that field then more opportunity will open.

 

Now I have been to the US West and spent some time in New Mexico, Nevada, etc. We drove through a great deal of Indian Nation (Navajo) Territory. I am not up on all my history and law here but those still living on reservations are kinda...well...there own Nation as I understand it. They are not completely bound by the same laws while on their territory as are US Citizens. I am unsure as to the citizenship status they have (I am sure someone here can tell me) but it is different as a reservation citizen.

 

That being said I dont think it is right for any people to put down another. I am afraid as long as there is something shiny on the otherside one people will want it and go get it regardless. We can not "give back" to a people as I believe it is a waste of time to think that way. Better would be to think forward and try to make the futire more equal than the pass in the ways that matter.

[Marcus Wolfe]

I'm just practicing dodging tomahawks. If the gov doesn't work out something soon...

[Tamujiin]

The reason for alcholism being so high on reservations actually is a genetic problem. White people and black people have had various forms of booze since the dawn of civilization ( 10,000bc-8000bc )over there. With the introduction of alchohol, to the general Native american culture, probably around 1492 when the first whites actually came to america with more than slaughtering everything that moved on there mind, the natives had no defense for booze, absloutly none, they didn't drink.

 

Smaller terms, Old world people drank for thousands of years, New world people only drank for 500 or so years.

 

As my stance on tribal affairs goes, you do have a department of resources do you not? You do have your own tribal goverment do you not? Maybe your own casinos? ( i dont know how canada is about that stuff ) Here in Minnesota, The tribes have soverign rights. Developing your land is probably not what your tribal goverment wants to do. They probably want to keep crying about the past and get free money form the Canadian goverment.

 

My advice to you is Get a job, go to college, run for your tribal chairmen position, and make a change, make a difference. Become involved, because changes dont happen when people dont do anything.

 

In my lifes experiance, there are poor indians and rich white people, and then there are poor white people and rich indians. The rest of it is just animosity for the genocide of the past.

Your tribe sghould have a form of documentation that declares some form of soverign rights, either the reservation itself, or various other things.

 

 

In America i belive the Native Americans have it easier than white people, Alot goes into that opinion, which i wont explain here.

[Carah]

What the Canadian government has done to the First Nations People of Canada is inconceivable. I live in Ontario, and seen first hand how they are dealt a crappy hand. A lot of my friends are Ojibwa, and they're not addicts, or drunks, but in other places in Canada (more remote) the conditions that they have to endure. Augh!! I don't even make any sense. I get so emotional about this, because it's unfair, and I feel like going to Ottawa and blowing-up Parliament. :wallbash:

[Tamujiin]

I live on the leechlake reservation in minnesota, Good ojibwe, Anishinabi, good people thay are, Great with there family values. Good fry bread, excellent wild rice. Just had indian tacos tonight, My wife is native american, White earth reservation, I am a white guy. Grandma lives next door, and we all agree that in Canada, you guys live too far apart. When all you have is a bar and a church in town and the church is only open on sunday where are people gonna go?

 

From somebody who knows Good strong native americans, and poor weak native americans the difference is this.

The good strong ones belive that nobody owes them anything, They go out and do what they have to do, in some cases take what they want to take, go where they want to go, live like the rest of us.

 

The poor weak ones think " goverment" no matter if it is tribal or or fedral, think they are owed something for the past. Which in terms the native americans by all means do. And in my opinion thats would be to live like anybody else and have the same oppertunitys as anybody else, regardless of race or color or religon. Which were i come from isnt happening, Their Casinos sometimes are only hiring Native Americans, Preferably band Members. ( Try that on a black guy at a white owned operation see what can happen ), the problem is the revovlving door scenario, Every three-six months they go through a hell of a hiring phase.

 

Anyways, What i am trying to say is, The indians in canada have toi have it as good if not the better than the indians here, because i dont here no crying down here about it. The problem is i think some native folks need to start living better lives and do what they have to do to survive, Whether it be move to a city or riot. Just stay out of the bottle, stay off drugs, That shtuff you cant blame on anybody except the individual. I know as a white guy i dont owe any native americans anything, and they dont owe me anything.

 

I do know them native boys like to fight though. :closedeyes:

 

But as far as an uprising, Try to get all of the Native americans orginized, thats what it would take, and that could never happen. In all seriousness the population of Native americans is to small. Anywhere. What actually needs to happen is no more reservations, no more tribal goverments, and no more dividing lines, no more free money, and all the rights of that which is promised by a civilian in america, or Canada, regardless of race. If its tribal conservation and land managment, the people will never get it back, and to keep your tribe going your sons and daughters would have to make the simple choice of there companion.

 

I think what native americans are entitled to is what is written out in the constitutions of our goverments, nothing more nothing less.

[Sativarg]

I am a white Anglo Saxon (native American Wantabe)

If I had a choice to be in any time and to believe in any truth I would have been Sioux, Cheyenne, Crow, Blackfeet, Comanche or Pawnee. I hate My peoples inability to be "that that is" as a people. My people are not very different than any other bit of humanity. But we found or were shown certain technologies that put us in charge. But why> I keep asking this. Some would say it was "manifest destiny" ( a result of a covenant between "GOD" And a race of men)

 

BUT; The sovereign "in my opinion" nations of the "new world" Had it right. They were in balance with the environment. When they got out of balance Mother enforced the truth and the nations changed or they died.

 

Now I am a lazy keyboard addict living in a shed outside of the law. I love Mother Nature and I love the One called Jesus and I believe in One True GOD. But I do not trust in Science, capitalistic democracy or religion. I Do Not Fit, How dare I love the Mother and the Son of man... How dare I say Blessed be and Amen.

 

I believe the most valuable earthly resource humans have here in this place is our ethnic and physical diversities. Each separate group of humans has wisdom that has been tested by time. Both in our bodies and in our peoples beliefs. Each group of humans has had to learn how to survive in a place according to the truth. I believe the Father has tested each of the Mothers children with the laws of reality and those who adapt and survive bring beautiful truth with them. I believe that in this modern age the values that allow humanity to overcome and to survive have been devalued by a false reality Based on the abuse of the Mothers resources.

 

Wisdom demands that humanity "see". We must see in a way that go's beyond our comfort. We must "see" into the future with eyes that see clearly that that is and that that will be. I 'see" that the oil is not for our comfort but that it is for emergency. Like the fat we store in our own bodies the oil in the Mother body is for hard times and not for our SUVs.

 

I am sorry to hijack your thread. Once again I got carried away.

 

One more thing:

I hate book burning:

The greatest sins in human history IMHO involve the destruction of a way of life. How dare any race of men destroy the truth between humanity the Mother and the Father. So many times humanity has had to start over because of fear of the truth as seen through another's EYES. Let us preserve and conserve the past truths of all humanity while we learn to respect the disparate truths of our current neighbors.

So Mote it be... Blessed be... Amen.

[dezdimona]

Why do we as a race, the human race, continue to judge others by the color of their skin. Do we not all bleed red,when cut or hurt? Is not our internal organs all in the same locations? Are they not shareable with another?

It's easy for a caucasian person to talk of racism, or saying the indian doesn't have it all that bad. Until you've walked a 'mile in my shoes' don't talk to me about equality of the races or give your jaunticed view of how good or bad another race has it.Why you ask? Because you've never been called a gook or a slant eyed angel. Don't preach to me about how you don't think it is till you've experienced it first hand. And I apologize up front for my terminolgy and my irate tone,but please, common courtousy and politeness go further than racial slurs any day!

[Sativarg]

Why do we as a race, the human race, continue to judge others by the color of their skin. Do we not all bleed red,when cut or hurt? Is not our internal organs all in the same locations? Are they not shareable with another?

It's easy for a Caucasian person to talk of racism, or saying the Indian doesn't have it all that bad. Until you've walked a 'mile in my shoes' don't talk to me about equality of the races or give your jaundiced view of how good or bad another race has it.Why you ask? Because you've never been called a gook or a slant eyed angel. Don't preach to me about how you don't think it is till you've experienced it first hand. And I apologize up front for my terminology and my irate tone,but please, common courteous and politeness go further than racial slurs any day!

I am sorry if I have offended you? In truth I believe what I wrote was if not in agreament then at least parallel to your points.

[dezdimona]

There was nothing in what you wrote that I took offense to. It was a generalized statement aimed at no one in particular. No one understands what it's like unless they experience it first hand. Talking about something of which someone has no experience but think they are qualified to make a biased,uninformed comment on is plainly just as bad as turning a blind eye to it!

[Kendo 2]

I'm not going to write an excruciatingly long essay outlining my point. I will simply say that Native Americans and First Nations of Canada are not treated as equally as everyone thinks or is led to believe. Firstly, we live a small plots of land (called "Reservations", or simply "reserves"), much smaller than what we originally had before Europeans settled here. Most of the time, we can't develop our land the way people can off our reserves, either because the land is unsuitable for any kind of development, or because we live in welfare systems. the welfare system ends up creating what I refer to as "Reserve mentality", since we become so dependant upon the funding we receive through welfare that we simply become lazy to find work. Alcoholism sets in because we can't cope.

 

This creates the problem of "every Indian is just a drunken bum". Our problems are too complicated for even me to explain here. I only want to make this a discussion about what people think of us Natives.

 

I quoted your original post so it would be clear to whom I'm speaking to. It is your topic after all. :smile:

 

I grew up dirt poor. My old man drove a big-rig truck hauling pipe for oil fields. My mother washed other people's nasty clothes and cleaned rich people's houses. When I turned 15 I had to get a job to help out AND remain in school. My father was a drunk and he beat my mom whenever he thought she got out of line and my mother endured it. My father and I got into more than a few fist fights. By the time I was 16, I could almost whup him, ALMOST.

All of the friends I grew up with had the same experiences I did. We roamed our neighborhood like Jolly Green Giants. We would ditch school and go to one of the ship channel ice houses and drink beer and shoot pool instead of going to class. If we thought someone disrespected us we would fight at the drop of a hat. I STILL have scars from that 25 years later. Only a few of us actually had jobs. The rest were thugs, boosting cars, breaking and entering, you name it. IF the cops bothered to cruise through our neighborhood they would get nothing but hard looks. EVERYONE hated them and THEY were the enemy. Instead of 'Protect and Serve' engraved on the badges it should have been 'Beat and Shoot.' The fuzz represented the system that kept us where we were; poor, disenfranchised and hopeless.

Does any of this sound familiar to you, rob_b? Now here's the kicker. I'm white. And because I'm white I never had any of the Social Services offered to minorities. There is no Irish American and Celtic Education, Jobs, and Economic Development, but there is a Native American and Tribal Education, Jobs, and Economic Development program. I would have sold my soul to have the opportunites that program provides.

Every ethnic minority has a beef with 'the white man's world'. But being white, I know what the beef really is. It's about money. If you have it the world is good and if you don't then there is always a reason and rarely is it your fault. (I'm using the collective 'you' and 'your' and not directing them at rob_b.)

The bottom line is this, Ethnicity is not an excuse. Social standing is not an excuse. Poverty is not an excuse. There is no excuse for not pulling yourself up. It all has to do with choices that every individual has the oportunity to make.

Sure the Native Americans got a raw deal at the hand of the white man. Their land was stolen, they were enslaved, they were exposed to diseases intentionally, the Plains Tribes had their primary food source (the American Bison) driven to the edge of extinction, they were robbed of their own culture and had an alien one forced upon them. Yes the Native Americans got screwed. So did the Irish.

Irishmen were driven off their ancestral lands so English Lords could hunt fox and deer. They were confined to tiny areas of land and forced to pay RENT on their own property. They were starved out when the sole crop they could afford to plant had was blighted. They were forbidden to speak Gaelic, sing their songs or practice Irish customs that had been in place since Neolithic times. My grandfather told me stories from his childhood about 'the Red Coats'. Back in the 1880's British Soldiers still wore red tunics. He and his friends would throw rocks and rotten potatos at them and then run. He was a few days short of being 102 when he died. I was just a kid, but he would put his dry old man hand on my cheek and tell me, "Laddy, don't ever let a man tell you what you can and cannot do."

 

When I was at the age to bar fight and shoot pool, one place I used to go to had a sign in the window. It read, 'NO COLOREDS, DOGS, OR IRISHMEN. It was an old sign from the turn of the last century but it was REAL. They had me listed after dogs, dude!

 

Oh yeah, what do people call the vehicle that cops use to haul a lot of people to jail at one time? It's a PADDYWAGON. Paddy = Irishman.

 

So all the talk and banter about how white people just don't get it is just that...TALK. Walk a mile in MY shoes.

 

[This is not an attack on anyone on the forum. It's just my two Punt's worth.]

 

My story does have a happy ending. After my father died my mother remarried to a nice man who owned a cattle ranch. She and I moved there and she died a happy woman well after all of her kids were grown. She got to see all of her grandkids. Her husband left me and my siblings his land and we still live there to this day. My mother could have married another man like my father. She made the choice not to.