LE True Conjuration

[OrphenFire]

First off, I don't actually believe in real magick. I do however, understand and respect "true" magick as an art of the mind. It's basically self-hypnosis, on a very, very deep subconscious level.

 

 

I've studied authentic Magick, and although I don't believe it is real, the practices which sorcerers have used for centuries are real. There's a book series called "The Bartimaeus Trilogy". Very good series for juvenile readers and adults alike. It has the most accurate representation of Magick that I've ever seen, while also keeping it interesting and fantastic. Magick is about summoning Djinni and lesser Demons. So basically, here's how a Magician in these books goes about performing his magick:

 

1) First and foremost, he draws a Circle of Protection. This protects the magician from the Demon, should anything go wrong.

 

2) Next, he draws a summoning circle. This circle confines the Demon inside so he can't escape and wreak havoc. Both of these circles must be geometrically PERFECT, or you risk the Demon exploiting a weakness and annihilating you. Demons hate being summoned, especially by amateurs. Any excuse to kill you, and they won't hesitate to do it.

 

3) After both circles are drawn and proper candles lit, the magician stands in his circle of protection and performs the incantation. He must know all of the proper words with precise pronunciation, as well as the specific Demon's true name. All magicians and all Demons have a true name, and a false name. If you know someone's name, you have power over them (in the case of Demons, to summon and command them). Magicians never reveal their true names unless absolutely necessary.

 

4) After the incantation, if everything went as planned, the Demon should be summoned with the summoning circle. The magician may now speak to the Demon and request things of him. You can enslave a Demon to do your will, and he will oblige, but this is a very dangerous path as Demons will constantly seek ways to turn against you.

 

5) If you wish to banish the Demon back to Hell, you must perform the banishing incantation. After the Demon is banished, you may remove both the summoning circle and the Circle of Protection. Wouldn't want some random noob finding it and unleashing the apocalypse by accident.

 

6) If a Demon has already been summoned and subsequently enslaved, its new "master" may command it at will in any venue. Some Demons are more benevolent than others. Some even become faithful companions to their human summoners, developing close friendships over time. These are the rare exceptions, but it does happen.

 

Here's what I propose for a Skyrim mod.

 

1) Change "demon" to Daedra and Hell to Oblivion.

 

2) Create a set of custom named Daedra in the game that can be summoned by learning their name and summoning rite. These Daedra don't have to look like your average Dremora. In fact, they should vary in appearance. Some male, some female, not all humanoid. Some could appear as animals and beasts. Others could be ethereal.

 

3) Give these Daedra unique abilities in the game. These Daedra would basically be custom companions. Some would attack with fire, some frost, others shock. Give some the ability to shout. Others could be masters of Alteration or Illusion. Some could even summon lesser Daedra, much like vanilla Conjuration.

 

4) As far as summoning goes, you must first know the Daedra's name and incantation. These could be custom spellbooks that must be found or bought. But, to emulate the trickiness and precision of the summoning circles, there should be a success % based on your level in Conjuration. So if Conjuration is at 20, the success rate would be 20% (not very good). A failed attempt results in the newly summoned Daedra immediately attacking you. A message could display saying, "You failed to perform the proper ritual. (Insert Daedra's name) has turned on you." For the higher powered Daedra, their %'s should calculate multiple times, to make up for the increased difficulty in summoning a more advanced Daedra. So the highest level Daedra you could possibly summon would require 4 different success checks. If your conjuration is at level 20, you would have to meet that 20% success rate FOUR times in a row. That actually brings the chance of a successful summoning down to 5% I believe (if my math is correct).

 

5) As far as visuals, when performing a ritual, it could trigger an animation where the player magickally draws the circles on the ground. I imagine the character waving his arms similar to the master spell animation, and then a glowing circle similar to the transmutation circles from Fullmetal Alchemist flashes and appears on the ground. After the success check, the Daedra appears in his circle. A successful ritual triggers a dialogue instance. "Why have you summoned me?" Answers: "I need your help," to which he responds, "You are a gifted Mage... I will help you... for now...". Other answer: "Sorry, I made a mistake." which triggers a 50% chance of either the Daedra returning to Oblivion, or attacking you.

 

 

This I think would greatly improve the Conjuration school in Skyrim, and make the magick more like actual real world practices (at least, what people believe to be real sorcery). One more thing, in "The Bartimaeus Trilogy", only people and creatures with magickal abilities can see Demons and Djinni. So in Skyrim, I think your summoned Daedra companion should be invisible to everyone except Mages, or unless you attack/are attacked by someone.

 

So, what do you think?? (:

Edited December 24, 2011 by OrphenFire

[IxionInc]

As cool as this would be for a necromancy mod or something, I really have to say I hate people who say "Oh, this isn't 'real' magic!".

 

Not only would it be counterproductive gameplay-wise, unless you're going for a really powerful Thrall, but that's just very inconvenient to do unless the circle has some purpose to make up for it being a requirement. It'd have to be like J3X's Necromagic, where you can cast spells from within the circle too.

[OrphenFire]

Maybe I wasn't as clear as I should have been. Yes, summoning the Deadra during every battle would be tedious and inconvenient. So what I propose is that you only summon him once, ideally in a secluded place like your home or somewhere unpopulated. After that, he's a permanent companion that follows you around until he dies. Then you'll have to summon him again (making the success checks all over again).

 

Also, I have no problem with the magick in Elder Scrolls or Skyrim. I love being able to shoot fire from my palms. But having a good knowledge of actual ritual magick, the Conjuration in the game leaves me wanting. It's just a little too boring, and there aren't enough things to conjure. So that's the primary reason I propose a revamped Conjuration school, in the style of more realistic and traditional ritual magick.

[Zenchii]

First off, I don't actually believe in real magick. I do however, understand and respect "true" magick as an art of the mind. It's basically self-hypnosis, on a very, very deep subconscious level.

 

 

I've studied authentic Magick, and although I don't believe it is real, the practices which sorcerers have used for centuries are real. There's a book series called "The Bartimaeus Trilogy". Very good series for juvenile readers and adults alike. It has the most accurate representation of Magick that I've ever seen, while also keeping it interesting and fantastic. Magick is about summoning Djinni and lesser Demons. So basically, here's how a Magician in these books goes about performing his magick:

 

1) First and foremost, he draws a Circle of Protection. This protects the magician from the Demon, should anything go wrong.

 

2) Next, he draws a summoning circle. This circle confines the Demon inside so he can't escape and wreak havoc. Both of these circles must be geometrically PERFECT, or you risk the Demon exploiting a weakness and annihilating you. Demons hate being summoned, especially by amateurs. Any excuse to kill you, and they won't hesitate to do it.

 

3) After both circles are drawn and proper candles lit, the magician stands in his circle of protection and performs the incantation. He must know all of the proper words with precise pronunciation, as well as the specific Demon's true name. All magicians and all Demons have a true name, and a false name. If you know someone's name, you have power over them (in the case of Demons, to summon and command them). Magicians never reveal their true names unless absolutely necessary.

 

4) After the incantation, if everything went as planned, the Demon should be summoned with the summoning circle. The magician may now speak to the Demon and request things of him. You can enslave a Demon to do your will, and he will oblige, but this is a very dangerous path as Demons will constantly seek ways to turn against you.

 

5) If you wish to banish the Demon back to Hell, you must perform the banishing incantation. After the Demon is banished, you may remove both the summoning circle and the Circle of Protection. Wouldn't want some random noob finding it and unleashing the apocalypse by accident.

 

6) If a Demon has already been summoned and subsequently enslaved, its new "master" may command it at will in any venue. Some Demons are more benevolent than others. Some even become faithful companions to their human summoners, developing close friendships over time. These are the rare exceptions, but it does happen.

 

Here's what I propose for a Skyrim mod.

 

1) Change "demon" to Daedra and Hell to Oblivion.

 

2) Create a set of custom named Daedra in the game that can be summoned by learning their name and summoning rite. These Daedra don't have to look like your average Dremora. In fact, they should vary in appearance. Some male, some female, not all humanoid. Some could appear as animals and beasts. Others could be ethereal.

 

3) Give these Daedra unique abilities in the game. These Daedra would basically be custom companions. Some would attack with fire, some frost, others shock. Give some the ability to shout. Others could be masters of Alteration or Illusion. Some could even summon lesser Daedra, much like vanilla Conjuration.

 

4) As far as summoning goes, you must first know the Daedra's name and incantation. These could be custom spellbooks that must be found or bought. But, to emulate the trickiness and precision of the summoning circles, there should be a success % based on your level in Conjuration. So if Conjuration is at 20, the success rate would be 20% (not very good). A failed attempt results in the newly summoned Daedra immediately attacking you. A message could display saying, "You failed to perform the proper ritual. (Insert Daedra's name) has turned on you." For the higher powered Daedra, their %'s should calculate multiple times, to make up for the increased difficulty in summoning a more advanced Daedra. So the highest level Daedra you could possibly summon would require 4 different success checks. If your conjuration is at level 20, you would have to meet that 20% success rate FOUR times in a row. That actually brings the chance of a successful summoning down to 5% I believe (if my math is correct).

 

5) As far as visuals, when performing a ritual, it could trigger an animation where the player magickally draws the circles on the ground. I imagine the character waving his arms similar to the master spell animation, and then a glowing circle similar to the transmutation circles from Fullmetal Alchemist flashes and appears on the ground. After the success check, the Daedra appears in his circle. A successful ritual triggers a dialogue instance. "Why have you summoned me?" Answers: "I need your help," to which he responds, "You are a gifted Mage... I will help you... for now...". Other answer: "Sorry, I made a mistake." which triggers a 50% chance of either the Daedra returning to Oblivion, or attacking you.

 

 

This I think would greatly improve the Conjuration school in Skyrim, and make the magick more like actual real world practices (at least, what people believe to be real sorcery). One more thing, in "The Bartimaeus Trilogy", only people and creatures with magickal abilities can see Demons and Djinni. So in Skyrim, I think your summoned Daedra companion should be invisible to everyone except Mages, or unless you attack/are attacked by someone.

 

So, what do you think?? (:

 

I'd prefer the daedra to stay visible since it's already established that they are, well, visible. Everything else though, yes please! This could be the basis of a daedra expansion mod, giving the mage the ability to summon daedra such as winged twilights, golden saints, dark seducers, etc. Also, consider perhaps replacing spoken incantations with ritual objects. For example, create the summoning circle, then write the specific Dremora's name on a scroll using daedric blood obtained from a daedra's heart, put it in the summoning circle and cast the spell on the scroll to summon him. I ask this because, with the exception of dragon shouts your character is pretty much a mute, and any recorded dialogue would sound weird if it doesn't match up with the clips heard from the dragon shouts. That change would just be a work around that problem.

 

 

Here's hoping someone with scripting experience sees this and gets inspired. :)

[OrphenFire]

I'd prefer the daedra to stay visible since it's already established that they are, well, visible. Everything else though, yes please! This could be the basis of a daedra expansion mod, giving the mage the ability to summon daedra such as winged twilights, golden saints, dark seducers, etc. Also, consider perhaps replacing spoken incantations with ritual objects. For example, create the summoning circle, then write the specific Dremora's name on a scroll using daedric blood obtained from a daedra's heart, put it in the summoning circle and cast the spell on the scroll to summon him. I ask this because, with the exception of dragon shouts your character is pretty much a mute, and any recorded dialogue would sound weird if it doesn't match up with the clips heard from the dragon shouts. That change would just be a work around that problem.

 

 

Here's hoping someone with scripting experience sees this and gets inspired. :)

 

That's a much better idea. You have to have specific objects in order to even try to cast the spell.

 

Also, I don't mean the Daedra is invisible to you. I just wouldn't want townspeople and soldiers to be able to see them unless they reveal themselves through combat.

[Zenchii]

 

That's a much better idea. You have to have specific objects in order to even try to cast the spell.

 

Also, I don't mean the Daedra is invisible to you. I just wouldn't want townspeople and soldiers to be able to see them unless they reveal themselves through combat.

 

That's what I meant, though. I'd prefer them to be visible to others since they're already established as such. That, and it kinda strains the suspension of disbelief, since daedra are also established as very real, and very physical creatures unlike say, ghosts. Take the frost atronach for example. (Since it's Christmas, I'll try and make this an amusing example for the viewers' reading pleasure :happy: )

 

Imagine having a frost thrall with you. You're walking down the streets of whiterun to get to the Inn. Meanwhile your frost thrall, ever the graceful elemental that he is, gives the cold shoulder to almost everyone in his way, pushing and shoving it's way through the crowd. Wind must be strong today. When you finally get to the inn, you spot someone you'd like to talk to near the entrance. You walk over to him. Due to the short distance however, your frost thrall does not. You've now blocked the only exit to the inn for everyone else with an immovable behemoth of icy awesomeness. The people in the inn are now panicking, believing that the apparent invisible force field is there due to the place possibly being haunted. Meanwhile, your frost thrall is still standing there. Not giving a poop.

 

 

Another example would be the flame atronach. You see a flaming daedra leaving an actual trail of fire on the ground, everyone else sees a trail of fire coming from your ass. Obviously, the dragonborn has been eating too much Horker meat. :P

 

I don't think the invisibility thing could work. The closest thing to invisibility I could think of that would work would be something more akin to hiding in plain sight. For example, the dremora could look like a high elf adventurer to the average Joe by magical means.

[OrphenFire]

I see what you mean. Perhaps "hiding in plain sight" is a better approach.

[4Gargoyle4]

Sorry to respond to such an old thread, but I was extremely curious if this mod was ever created? If so, can someone please refer me to it? If not, is there anyone who would like to work on it with me?

[elixxon]

Well... IRL magic is boring and unreliable...

No way to tell if it is the real deal or just the imagination of the "mage/witch/random person with ezotheria as religion" since according to the "current state of SCIENCE" the half of the brain that "detects" the supernatural stuff is the imaginary half of the brain and not the objective so it's pretty easy to mix up.

 

Also "IRL magic" is not about throwing fireballs and electrocuting people with "aaaauuuunnnnnlimited paaaaauuuuuaaaaaaaahhhh!!!!!".

[4Gargoyle4]

Well... IRL magic is boring and unreliable...

No way to tell if it is the real deal or just the imagination of the "mage/witch/random person with ezotheria as religion" since according to the "current state of SCIENCE" the half of the brain that "detects" the supernatural stuff is the imaginary half of the brain and not the objective so it's pretty easy to mix up.

 

Also "IRL magic" is not about throwing fireballs and electrocuting people with "aaaauuuunnnnnlimited paaaaauuuuuaaaaaaaahhhh!!!!!".