antistar Posted November 18, 2017 Author Share Posted November 18, 2017 I've finished changing/replacing the "magical" Legendary effects now - it was very fiddly. Here are the changes copy-pasted from the draft readme: Reveal hidden contents ***Legendary Effects Changes*** Many of the vanilla FO4 Legendary effects would only be possible if literal magic existed in the Fallout universe. Firearms are not magic wands, so WARS removes the overtly "magical" Legendary effects and replaces them with more believable effects. Some effects have also been re-balanced to better fit WARS. Some replacement effects appear more than once; there were a LOT of magical effects to replace. Note that if you don't start a new game after installing WARS (as recommended), some of these changes likely won't be initialised, potentially leaving you with Legendary effect and weapon combinations that don't make sense and were not intended. Changed effects: M4 Carbine (used by December's Child) - Reduced from +25% to +10% Fire Rate and +15% to +10% Reload Speed. Lucky Weapon - Reduced from +100% Critical Damage to +20% Critical Damage. Powerful - Reduced from +25% Damage to +10% Damage. Irradiated - Now also does 5 RAD damage to user on attack. Rapid - Reload speed increase removed. Reduced from +25% to +15% Fire Rate. Effects now for melee/unarmed weapons only: Penetrating Wounding Staggering Kneecapper Furious Crippling Poisoner's Enraging Replaced effects: Defiant -> Accurised: +20% Accuracy. Resolute -> Back-Heavy: +20% Aim Speed. +10% Recoil. Hitman's -> Balanced: +10% Aim Speed. -5% Recoil. Steadfast -> Comfortable: +20% Aim Stability. Deadeye -> Custom: +15% Reload Speed. Resilient -> Ergonomic: +10% Aim Speed. Stalker's -> Front-heavy: -20% Aim Speed. -10% Recoil. Violent -> Heavy (Ranged, Light): -20% Aim Speed. +20% Bash Damage. -10% Recoil. +0.5lb Weight. Explosive -> Heavy (Ranged, Medium): -20% Aim Speed. +20% Bash Damage. -10% Recoil. +2lb Weight. Incendiary -> Heavy (Ranged, Heavy): -20% Aim Speed. +20% Bash Damage. -10% Recoil. +10lb Weight. Nimble -> Light (Ranged, Light): +20% Aim Speed. -20% Bash Damage. +10% Recoil. -0.5lb Weight. Plasma Infused -> Light (Ranged, Medium): +20% Aim Speed. -20% Bash Damage. +10% Recoil. -2lb Weight. Two Shot -> Light (Ranged, Heavy): +20% Aim Speed. -20% Bash Damage. +10% Recoil. -10lb Weight. Never Ending -> Accurised: +20% Accuracy. VATS Enhanced (Ranged) -> Back-Heavy: +20% Aim Speed. +10% Recoil. Freezing -> Rugged: +25% Durability. Junkie's -> Balanced: +10% Aim Speed. -5% Recoil. Instigating -> Comfortable: +20% Aim Stability. Nocturnal -> Custom: +15% Reload Speed. Hunter's -> Ergonomic: +10% Aim Speed. Exterminator's -> Front-heavy: -20% Aim Speed. -10% Recoil. Ghoul Slayer's -> Heavy (Ranged, Light): -20% Aim Speed. +20% Bash Damage. -10% Recoil. +0.5lb Weight. Assassin's -> Heavy (Ranged, Medium): -20% Aim Speed. +20% Bash Damage. -10% Recoil. +2lb Weight. Troubleshooter's -> Heavy (Ranged, Heavy): -20% Aim Speed. +20% Bash Damage. -10% Recoil. +10lb Weight. Mutant Slayer's -> Light (Ranged, Light): +20% Aim Speed. -20% Bash Damage. +10% Recoil. -0.5lb Weight. Quickdraw -> Light (Ranged, Medium): +20% Aim Speed. -20% Bash Damage. +10% Recoil. -2lb Weight. Relentless -> Light (Ranged, Heavy): +20% Aim Speed. -20% Bash Damage. +10% Recoil. -10lb Weight. Blazing -> Heavy (Melee, Light): +15% Damage. +0.3lb Weight. Charged -> Heavy (Melee, Medium): +15% Damage. +2lb Weight. Frigid -> Heavy (Melee, Heavy): +15% Damage. +10lb Weight. Bloodied -> Light (Melee, Light): -15% Damage. -0.3lb Weight. Berserker's -> Light (Melee, Medium): -15% Damage. -2lb Weight. VATS Enhanced (Melee) -> Light (Melee, Heavy): -15% Damage. -10lb Weight. Named weapons with changed effects: Partystarter: Assassin's -> Custom Eddie's Peace: Crippling -> Rapid Wastelander's Friend: Crippling -> Ergonomic The Last Minute: Crippling -> Ergonomic Good Intentions: Enraging -> Comfortable Spray n' Pray: Explosive -> Rapid Kiloton: Explosive -> Powerful Reba II: Exterminator's -> Light The Problem Solver: Furious -> Powerful Splattercannon: Furious -> Powerful Ashmaker: Incendiary -> Front-heavy The Gainer: Incendiary -> Balanced Old Faithful: Instigating -> Rugged Sentinel's Plasmacaster: Instigating -> Balanced Admiral's Friend: Instigating -> Light Sergeant Ash: Kneecapper -> Light Virgil's rifle: Mutant Slayer's -> Irradiated Prototype UP77: Never Ending -> Rapid Wazer Wifle: Never Ending -> Rugged Aeternus: Never Ending -> Rugged Death From Above: Nimble -> Light Radical Conversion: Penetrating -> Heavy Defender's Harpoon Gun: Penetrating -> Back-Heavy Kellogg's pistol: Relentless -> Balanced Butcher's Hook: Relentless -> Wounding Cito's Shiny Slugger: Relentless -> Wounding Skipper's Last Stand: Resilient -> Custom Justice: Staggering -> Heavy Tinker Tom Special: Stalker's -> Accurised General Chao's Revenge: Troubleshooter's -> Crippling Big Boy: Two-Shot -> Back-Heavy Old Reliable: Two-Shot -> Rugged Overseer's Guardian: Two-Shot -> Back-Heavy Deliverer: VATS Enhanced -> Powerful Rockville Slugger: VATS Enhanced -> Heavy The Fish Catcher: VATS Enhanced -> Crippling Le Fusil Terribles: Violent -> Back-Heavy AX90 Fury: Mutant Slayer's -> Rapid On 11/18/2017 at 12:43 AM, Moldy said: Part of me wonders which version of the Lewis Gun you'd spring for,if you've ever implemented it. I recall you saying "No" to that idea,due to time constraints,and the lack of a desirable resource. The thing used .303 British,.30-06 Springfield,and 7.92*57mm Mauser. If I recall,the Lewis implemented by Fallout: Wanderer's Edition used .30-06 Springfield. Oh,and it was also used to wage war on emus in Australia. Did you guys win that war,Antistar? I've heard conflicting reports. Yeah, the Lewis Gun is unlikely, due to those reasons - so this is hypothetical really, but it would probably be in .30-06 since that would also be used by the M1 Garand (asXas' Garand via patch most likely) and the BAR if that ends up happening. Ah yes, the Great Emu War. That's well before my time, but as far as I know the emus won that one. Emus are pretty big! Also, as a "The More You Know" sort of thing, I've heard people not from Australia mispronounce "emu", so; it's pronounced "eem-you" rather than "ee-moo". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moldy Posted November 18, 2017 Share Posted November 18, 2017 Good sodding lord. If I knew how to make models,I'd gladly whip up a set of meshes for a machine gun and an LSW for you. But,I can't,so I shan't. And it's driving me insane. All I can do is be the peanut gallery. Then again,it'd likely be a highly fictional weapon,if I did miraculously pull 3D skills out of my ass,which would fly in the face of the mod's goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meowjar Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 Do you think this will be released by the end of the year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antistar Posted November 20, 2017 Author Share Posted November 20, 2017 I went through and gave all the AR-15 parts as true-to-life weight values as I could manage, and if you're curious what my notes look like for something like that, here you go: Reveal hidden contents ***AR-15***Barrels alone:10.5" 1.3714.5" 1.620.0" 2.1Handguards:A1 triangular 0.75A2 shielded 0.72A2 M203 + Leaf sight 0.55M4 shielded 0.56M4 KAC RAS 0.71M16 KAC RAS M5 1.04KAC 11-rib rail cover panel 0.06M4 rail covers x4 approx. 0.24M16 rail covers x4 approx. 0.4(Subtract appropriate rail cover weight from value used for omods that involve removing one or more rail covers.)Gas tubes:Carbine 0.04Rifle 0.05M203 3.0M203A1 2.840x46mm round 0.5Bayonet lug alone 0.05Bayonet lug + mount (est.) 0.1Receiver:Lower, all internals 0.84Flat-top upper 0.6Barrel nut 0.13Bolt, carrier, firing pin 0.7Charging handle 0.08Pistol grip 0.18Total 2.53Stock:A2 1.53M4 Telestock 1.06Buffer Tube (Pistol) 0.6Foregrips:KAC Vertical Foregrip 0.17Grip Pod (polymer) 0.44Mags:20rnd USGI 0.1830rnd USGI 0.2630rnd EMAG 0.3360rnd MAG5-60 0.4100rnd C-MAG 2.25.56x45mm M855 x1 0.02645.56x45mm M855 x20 0.5285.56x45mm M855 x30 0.7925.56x45mm M855 x60 1.5845.56x45mm M855 x100 2.64Mag Pulls:Sleeve (Magpul 1st gen) 0.04Floor Plate (Ranger) 0.06Muzzle Devices:Flash Hider (A2) 0.14Micro Compensator 0.15Three Port Muzzle Brake 0.23NT4 Suppressor 1.5Sights:Front sight base (no lug) 0.28Carry handle 0.57Carry handle sights total 0.85Folding Rear Sight (est.) 0.16Folding Front Sight 0.3Folding sights total 0.46***Misc***AA battery x1 0.066AA battery x2 0.132DL1/3N battery x1 0.022CR2032 battery x1 0.006Accupoint scope 0.8C79 scope 1.521Weight with batteries:AN/PVS-4 Starlight scope 4.132Heads-up reflex sight 0.276C-More Railway sight 0.428EOTech 552 Holo-sight 0.814Surefire G2 Tac-light 0.25LPC Laser Sight (estimate) 0.5DBAL-A2 Laser Sight 0.513Surefire light mount 0.08M2 "Bayonet" (est) 0.8M7 Bayonet 0.6 It does take a lot of work. I was helped this time by the AR-15 platform being so popular; someone had compiled a spreadsheet of the weight of common AR-15 parts. I still needed to look quite a lot of things up myself though. Other weapons will likely be more difficult to find weight values for (the individual parts, that is; usually you can find the total weight on wikipedia or what-have-you) - so if anyone happens to have, like, a Mini-14 or USAS-12 or something at home and feels like taking it apart to weigh all the pieces, that would be very helpful. ;) Anyway; barring Legendary effects, right now the lightest AR-15 you can get in WARS is ~5.7lb, and the heaviest is ~19.6lb. A bog-standard M4A1 configuration (including empty 30 rd USGI mag) is weighing in at ~7lb, which seems a bit high actually. It's hard to know exactly how they got whatever that weight value is though; especially with something as customisable as an AR-15. Still, if anyone who knows about these things spots something obviously wrong in my notes there, feel free to let me know. On 11/18/2017 at 8:56 AM, Moldy said: Good sodding lord. If I knew how to make models,I'd gladly whip up a set of meshes for a machine gun and an LSW for you. But,I can't,so I shan't. And it's driving me insane. All I can do is be the peanut gallery. Then again,it'd likely be a highly fictional weapon,if I did miraculously pull 3D skills out of my ass,which would fly in the face of the mod's goals. Hey, don't worry about it. Comments, suggestions, etc are all helpful. On 11/19/2017 at 8:44 PM, meowjar said: Do you think this will be released by the end of the year? No, I think that's pretty unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuzi127 Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 (edited) If you're in need of weight numbers, when you get to it I have a Mossberg 500 12 gauge; pretty much the same gun as the 590. I have a few different barrels (one with a heat shield), pistol grip, and normal stock, all synthetic. I don't have all the attachments you've made though. Edited November 21, 2017 by kuzi127 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antistar Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 That'd be pretty handy - thanks! The Mossberg 590 was what I used as my test case for giving (ideally) realistic weights to all the parts of a weapon, but I did have to estimate a lot of it based on what information I could find. For reference here are my messy notes for it: Reveal hidden contents ***Mossberg 590***Total590A1 synthetic total 7.25590 synthetic total (8 rnd) 7590 with 14" barrel total 6.25Shockwave total 5.25ReceiverForend action assembly 0.52Total (est.) 1.58After -1 for WEAP record 0.58Barrels barrel (long - 20") 2.8barrel (short - 14" est.) 1.96mag tube (8 round) 0.94mag tube (5 rnd - est.) 0.588mag cap 0.115long total 3.855long, short mag total (est.) 3.503short total (14" - est.) 2.66312Ga shell x1 0.102512Ga shell x5 0.512512Ga shell x8 0.82Stockswood stock (full) 2.15Forend pump (wood) 0.5polymer stock (full) 1.25Forend pump (polymer) 0.315Cruiser grip kit 0.44Wood sawn furn. total (est.) 1.25Wood full furn. total 2.65Polymer cruiser furn. total 0.755Polymer full furn. total 1.565SightsPicatinny rail 0.175Ghost ring sight 0.285MiscHeat shield 0.475Muzzles:Micro Compensator Three Port Muzzle Brake Salvo 12 Suppressor Those numbers are in pounds of course. (As much as I'd prefer it if FO4 had an option to switch everything to metric measurements. ;)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moldy Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 About the Mossberg; Would pumps impact firing speed? Like,say,tuning the "draw weight",for lack of a better term,to make it easier,and thus faster,to cycle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuzi127 Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 On 11/22/2017 at 1:06 AM, Moldy said: About the Mossberg; Would pumps impact firing speed? Like,say,tuning the "draw weight",for lack of a better term,to make it easier,and thus faster,to cycle?Due to the way the action is designed, not really; the best you could do would be to use lightweight components in the action and use good lube (always a good idea lol). The arms connected to the pump physically grab the bolt and move it back and forth, so all the resistance you'd feel would be from friction and the inertia of the parts. List of weights in the spoiler. Reveal hidden contents Barrels18.5" bare - 1.9424" with rifle sights - 2.1928" ribbed - 2.81 Forend/Pump - 0.81 Internals (bolt, levers, shell lift) - 0.75 Trigger - 0.28 5 round mag tube - 0.53 Receiver - 0.72 Heat Shield - 0.35 Pistol grip (synth) - 0.31 Full Stock (synth) - 1.16 Shell, 2-3/4", 7-1/2 Shot size, Trap/Skeet load - 0.094 Total (24" barrel, full stock) - 6.44 These were done with a $20 kitchen scale from Walmart so they might not be absolutely accurate, but they're definitely close. In my experience, you'd only find 14 inch barrels on highly custom (and also illegal without the proper paperwork and tax stamp here in the US) guns; the shortest legal length is 18.5", and that sticks barely 2"/5cm past the end of a standard 5 round mag tube. Most standard hunting/clay shooting guns will use between 24 and 30 inch ones. BTW Antistar, for someone who's never touched a real firearm, I'd say your work is pretty darn impressive since your weapon mods are easily the most realistic that I've seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moldy Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 I used draw weight in the same way you'd use it to describe a bow; How much pull force you need to apply to get the part in question to move. On bows and crossbows throughout history,this was adjustable by assorted means,and because a shotgun's pump utilizes,among other things,a spring,I figured it'd be a similar principle; A lower draw weight on the spring means for easier,and thus faster,operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuzi127 Posted November 22, 2017 Share Posted November 22, 2017 (edited) The 500 at least has no major springs in it; the only ones in the weapon are for the magazine tube, the extractor, firing pin, and various trigger parts, none of which have to do with the pump. Most simple pump shotguns will be designed in a similar way. Autoloading guns are a completely different story though; pretty much every single one ever designed for individual use has used a recoil spring. Edited November 22, 2017 by kuzi127 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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