[LE] Quest aliases and game performance issues.

[cumbrianlad]

This is just a question about how badly 'specific reference' aliases affect game performance.

 

I understand from the Creation Kit page about aliases that using this method of assigning aliases results in the data for the reference always being loaded even when the quest isn't running. The article warns that this causes performance issues, especially when used for actors.

 

I could see why this would be a problem, since the amount of data associated with even one actor can be enormous if it includes levelled actor data, levelled character data, encounter actor data, inventory data and so on.

 

I got concerned about it because I need 8 actor aliases in my final scene and these actors cannot be unique because they are levelled enemies. The way I'm putting in these aliases is to use the 'find matching reference in loaded area' option and adding a condition 'GetIsID' Lvlactor. I hope this works and the aliases fill properly.

 

How concerned should I be over the fact that I've selected a dozen or more specific references, such as XMarkerHeadings, keys and books? Is there a better way to add these aliases?

 

As mod authors, should we avoid assigning aliases as specific references at all costs?

 

 

[Shurah]

My mod Immersive Citizens overuses quest aliases and has no noticeable performances impact, install it and see by yourself.

[cumbrianlad]

Shurah, when you say "overuses quest aliases" are you talking about 'specific references'?

 

From what I read these are the only ones that cause an issue with performances.

 

If your mod does use specific references, rather than unique actor references or matching reference aliases, then that article on the creation kit website is a load of baloney...mind you, that wouldn't surprise me: I've found a lot of errors there already. For instance, with regard to aliases, the website states that the unique actor reference for aliases only works for actors that have a persist location assigned to them. This is definitely untrue because my actor Joncis Milvan has no such persist location and is assigned as an alias using 'unique actor', nor have I checked the 'optional' checkbox for him. The alias fills and the quest runs.

 

If you are using these references with no performance issues, it'll make my life that bit easier because I won't have to add multiple of conditions to these actors and have them checked as optional aliases in the quest. (I need them to be optional because I can't find a suitable way of getting the aliases filled when the quest starts in a cell miles away from the one that the actors are in.)

 

P.S. I'm not questioning your knowledge which is obviously far greater than mine. I'm just wanting to be clear that we're talking about the same thing, so that I can happily fill in my quest aliases the easy way!

[Aragorn58]

Shurah, when you say "overuses quest aliases" are you talking about 'specific references'?

 

From what I read these are the only ones that cause an issue with performances.

 

If your mod does use specific references, rather than unique actor references or matching reference aliases, then that article on the creation kit website is a load of baloney...mind you, that wouldn't surprise me: I've found a lot of errors there already. For instance, with regard to aliases, the website states that the unique actor reference for aliases only works for actors that have a persist location assigned to them. This is definitely untrue because my actor Joncis Milvan has no such persist location and is assigned as an alias using 'unique actor', nor have I checked the 'optional' checkbox for him. The alias fills and the quest runs.

 

If you are using these references with no performance issues, it'll make my life that bit easier because I won't have to add multiple of conditions to these actors and have them checked as optional aliases in the quest. (I need them to be optional because I can't find a suitable way of getting the aliases filled when the quest starts in a cell miles away from the one that the actors are in.)

 

P.S. I'm not questioning your knowledge which is obviously far greater than mine. I'm just wanting to be clear that we're talking about the same thing, so that I can happily fill in my quest aliases the easy way!

I did 2 quests for Cirena's Raven Castle to defend Raven Fortress, in which I used over 120 Aliases marked as Specific Reference. They are Lvlactors as well as xmarkers and other staic objects with no performance impact what so ever. During the quest there are catapults firing, explosions occurring, and all happening in multiple cells.

 

But all the leveled actors are not marked as disabled, and located in a holding cell and then moved by script to their specific areas as each quest stage progresses. And after some of them are dispatched, I run a cleanup script to delete them at the end of that stage. But one of the quests is repeatable and the Aliases are moved back to the holding cell after they are killed so the quest can repeat. So in essence they never go away.

 

Now Raven Castle has some issues in the Castle itself, only because of the detail that went into the rooms with all the static objects and lighting effects, but the Fortress area is its own group of cells apart from the castle.

 

When the quest starts, all aliases are filled even though they are in several different cells so there must be a reason why all your Aliases are not filling.

[cumbrianlad]

Interesting.

 

I did have a problem with the aliases not filling at the start of the quest, which takes place in Dragonbridge. The actors concerned are all in my tomb location. I've worked around this by making them optional but I haven't tested them yet because I'm working on the scenes that lead up to the tomb encounters and a second quest that starts up when the player arrives at the place.

 

If it works fine, I'll leave the aliases as they are. If not, I'll have to look into why they don't fill and sort it by some other means.

 

I still have to write the scenes that they are involved in before I can test. That's next on my list after I sort out getting dead counts set up on the enemies in the tomb and sorting out some pesky drunkard in the tavern who occasionally sandboxes onto the bench that I want my player and main NPC to use. I'll probably just put down a pair of XMarkers in the tavern, unless I can figure out a way to script the bench so that it's ignored by sandbox for the duration of the player's meeting.

 

As a footnote, there's not much point checking the box in quest data to 'warn on aliases not filling'. Mine was checked but I got no warning when the quest didn't start up. Thankfully it didn't take long to find the problem because the quest initiated fine right up to the moment I added the new aliases.

[Aragorn58]

Interesting.

 

I did have a problem with the aliases not filling at the start of the quest, which takes place in Dragonbridge. The actors concerned are all in my tomb location. I've worked around this by making them optional but I haven't tested them yet because I'm working on the scenes that lead up to the tomb encounters and a second quest that starts up when the player arrives at the place.

 

If it works fine, I'll leave the aliases as they are. If not, I'll have to look into why they don't fill and sort it by some other means.

 

I still have to write the scenes that they are involved in before I can test. That's next on my list after I sort out getting dead counts set up on the enemies in the tomb and sorting out some pesky drunkard in the tavern who occasionally sandboxes onto the bench that I want my player and main NPC to use. I'll probably just put down a pair of XMarkers in the tavern, unless I can figure out a way to script the bench so that it's ignored by sandbox for the duration of the player's meeting.

 

As a footnote, there's not much point checking the box in quest data to 'warn on aliases not filling'. Mine was checked but I got no warning when the quest didn't start up. Thankfully it didn't take long to find the problem because the quest initiated fine right up to the moment I added the new aliases.

 

If you leave your Alias as optional and it does not fill, and it is required for the quest to progress you may wind up with a broken quest. It is best to figure out why the Aliases are not filling.

 

As far as setting up dead counts on your enemies in the tomb, it is relatively simple. To save myself some typing, see this post as an example. Just be sure to fill the properties in the CK correctly, and be sure to add the script to the quest first then the actor, or vice versa its been a while since I used it or the compiler will complain.

[cumbrianlad]

Thanks for that Aragorn58,

 

I know about the counting in theory. I just haven't done it yet. I also saw how to alter the quest objective depending how many enemies are dead out of the total.

 

I think I'll ditch tidying other bits up for now and get that crucial scene in and test it.