Wearing a Stealth Boy makes you invisible but adds rads

[darlingg]

On the one hand, a nightkin like the one in Novac can go invisible for hours at a time; on the other, any vanilla stealth boy that the player acquires, once activated, only lasts a few minutes then disappears. Lore seems to call for the stealth boy to be a worn instead of ingestible item, with an invisibility field that consumes no energy cells etc (perhaps running off a microfusion breeder, or whatever powers a Pip-Boy), but that seems to be overpowered, plus it raises the question why there aren't more invisible human bandits running around. I propose that the stealth boy's invisibility field steadily irradiates the wearer, which is why a radiation-immune mutant can wear one indefinitely, while a human can only stand a few minutes before having to stop & take RadAway, or see a doctor, or get sick & die. This would also make radiation a bigger factor in the game, and make the radiation-related perks more attractive.

EDIT: this mod is now posted at <https://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/64747>.

Edited March 23, 2018 by darlingg

[devinpatterson]

How many rads would you like it to add per a second?

An object effect on the armor (it's treated like a armor to function as you describe) will give you both the rads and shader effect.

I'd say I could also rig it so it would appear on your person when equipped but I doubt you could see it with the stealth field active so there's no real point to it.

[darlingg]

Devin, thanks for your interest.

Good question. I suppose one rad per second is the minimum. This would be enough to discourage full-time use, especially if the rads can't be resisted by Radiation Suits etc (which, in real life, prevent breathing or dusting by particles emitting short-range alpha or beta rays, but wouldn't block a bath of something like X-rays or gamma rays; Rad-X, say, is similarly helpless against such deeper penetration). But to explain why we don't see Stealth Boys used much by humans, even with Radaway around, I'd crank things up higher; this would also encourage tactical thinking. At 8 rads per second, one could survive as long as 2 minutes (120 seconds, for 960 rads), consistent with the vanilla ingestible Stealth Boy, which lasts that long. At that intensity, even a sackful of Radaway (base -6 rads/sec) couldn't keep up for long (with a Medicine skill under 30). Perhaps players can re-adjust this rate to taste, such as from instructions on using the console to change a variable.

A Stealth Boy is supposed to look like an oversized wristwatch, but as you say, it would be invisible while worn. Too, not having to show it on the person might save a body slot, no? Similarly, to be automatically on/off when worn/removed would save an activation key.

You might also consider changing Lily's Stealth Girl perk (whose vanilla version keeps Stealth Boys going for 4 minutes) to cut the dosing down to 4 rads per second, as she has learned to keep Stealth Boys in constant tune (for the improved damage from sneak attacks; she wouldn't care about the lower rads).

If you keep the same ID, would all Stealth Boys in the vanilla game, & DLCs & mods, be replaced by the new version?

Stealth Suits, on the other hand, say, over their whole surface, generate much less radiation which they can also block, or work by a different principle altogether.

[devinpatterson]

Good question. I suppose one rad per second is the minimum.

Yeah I would think you'd want to balance the "value" of a reusable stealthboy.

 

This would be enough to discourage full-time use, especially if the rads can't be resisted by Radiation Suits etc

Since this would be a script based object effect or simply an attached script it would bypass your typical radiation protection (adding directly to an actor value, RadiationRads)

 

But to explain why we don't see Stealth Boys used much by humans, even with Radaway around, I'd crank things up higher; this would also encourage tactical thinking. At 8 rads per second, one could survive as long as 2 minutes (120 seconds, for 960 rads), consistent with the vanilla ingestible Stealth Boy, which lasts that long. At that intensity, even a sackful of Radaway (base -6 rads/sec) couldn't keep up for long (with a Medicine skill under 30). Perhaps players can re-adjust this rate to taste, such as from instructions on using the console to change a variable.

Two aspects that might be interesting.

1. would be something similar to a non linear scale where the first seconds would provide minimal radiation but exposure after 30 seconds or a minute is substantially higher. This would put a upper limit on teh time the stealthboy is used unless the player wants to burn through an enormous amount of radaway.

2. A somewhat random amount of rads each second, to keep things interesting.

 

Too, not having to show it on the person might save a body slot, no? Similarly, to be automatically on/off when worn/removed would save an activation key.

Yes if there is no body slot there is no need to rig it, and it doesn't show up on the player model (but can still be equipped from teh armor/outfit tab)

 

If you keep the same ID, would all Stealth Boys in the vanilla game, & DLCs & mods, be replaced by the new version?

Yes they will all be replaced if they have the same ID (editing the existing form as opposed to creating a new one)

 

Stealth Suits, on the other hand, say, over their whole surface, generate much less radiation which they can also block, or work by a different principle altogether.

I believe the stealthboy is an imperfect copy of the Chinese stealth suit tech, as I don't believe they suffer the dangerous side effects.

[darlingg]

I'm very glad this might be practical after all.

As mentioned, I'm OK with bypassing regular radiation resistance, and have a rationale for that. Though there'd still be a way of mitigating that cost, via the new version of Stealth Girl I described.

Since even brief uses of a Stealth Boy would provide tremendous tactical advantage, I'd argue that, if anything, more of the cost should be at the beginning. For instance, the vanilla stealth boy is lost entirely as soon as it's activated, no matter how long you're actually hiding from anything with it. Possibly you could add a surge of rads at the start, like the extra pulse of current when you turn on a light bulb - say, 40 rads? Then it would be worth leaving the Stealth Boy on if the start of the next threat is less than 5 seconds from the end of the last one (but maybe it's longer!). And 2 minutes steady use would then add 40 + 8*120=1000 rads, and really would represent an absolute limit that's similar to the vanilla game's. It would also discourage merely precautionary or other casual activation, and give a stealthing player some hard choices.

Random's an idea, but we'd still need to settle on the mean and deviation of the rate of dosage. I wouldn't bother, myself. The effects of other ingestibles are very predictable, except for addiction (and I'm not proposing to make a Stealth Boy addictive to humans - before it kills them).

Yeah, let's keep this mod to Stealth Boy (plus, at most, Stealth Girl perk; no Stealth Suits) for now.

Let me know of any other questions or suggestions.

Edited July 13, 2017 by darlingg

[darlingg]

devinpatterson, how does it look so far?
Anyone else have ideas?

[devinpatterson]

devinpatterson, how does it look so far?

Alas I haven't had a chance to do any modding :sad: but I'll try and take a look at it this weekend. And if anyone else wants to help out Darlingg while I'm tied up with RL junk, please feel free.

 

 

And 2 minutes steady use would then add 40 + 8*120=1000 rads, and really would represent an absolute limit that's similar to the vanilla game's.

OK so 40 for initial "ingestion" and 8 per a second shall be the rate then?

 

Let me know of any other questions or suggestions.

Random idea, I can have a burned out stealhboy appear on the wrist after the stealth effect is over, simulating the stealthboy's single use nature (it can be unequipped and dropped as any normal item). Just for a little extra graphical pizazz.

[darlingg]

Devinpatterson, great!

Let it be as you say: rads = 40+8*t.

I'm all in favor of graphical pizazz, but Nightkin can use these things for years, so why should they run out for humans? I propose that each has a built-in microfusion breeder, like the recharger rifle and pistol and whatever runs the Pip-Boy, so that only radiation limits how much humans can use it. Though, in principle, if not kept repaired, it can eventually wear out like any armor.

Best of luck with all your projects, both mod and RL.

[devinpatterson]

Sorry haven't had time to work on this yet (but hope to Thursday). I'v decided a object effect for the rads per a second, and just the script for the +40 on equip. I think that will work best. I wanted to run an idea or two by you though.

 

Instead of all stealthboys working this way, how about making this the game mechanics for the Stealth Boy mark II prototype that doc Henry made....it seems like a nice spot to slot into the game world and we know the MK II is reusable ( or so I assume, since after lily used it Keene wanted to aquire it).

 

Second I can keep a tally of seconds or of total rads over time that is acquired by the prototype and a quest script that could activate various "effects" that would be suggestive of the madness prolonged use of the MK II can cause.

These can be visual effects (hallucinations of a second or two), barely heard whispers, or perhaps strange suggestions by voices unseen. I think it would add some interesting flavor to teh experience and give a faint suggestion of what the nightkin experience in their twisted madness. Initially these incidents would be far and few between but with cumulative use they would happen more frequently and over time open up more of them.

 

Last there is a animation for typeing or pushing buttons on the pipboy, if that could be mirrored/converted along the x axis it could be made to appear as if you are pushing buttons on the stealthboy to activate it. I'm assuming it's on the right hand, so that it doesn't overlap the pipboy....and of course I'd rig it there, potentially opening this up for hotkey use. So you'd hit your hotkey, the animation of your player punching buttons on the stealthboy plays and poof you disappear.

 

And once again sorry about the delay, I want to mod....probably as bad as you want this mod to be finished if not more. It's just a question of finding an hour or two of free time.

Let me know if your still interested in teh mod, and any feedback on the additional ideas.

 

P.S. the second two suggestions can be cobbled together later, so that they don't delay the initial release of the more basic mod we have been discussing (rad only effects).

[darlingg]

devinpatterson, thanks for your continuing interest, and looking forward to seeing the results.

 

I mainly wanted to see stealth boys that actually fit game lore, which specifies they're already widely used and re-used by nightkin, but not by vanilla humans (because, we say, RADS!). So, ours should replace the MK I, and be an equippable item instead of an ingestible, and so forth as we've discussed. The MK II would, say, put out half the rads and take twice as long to show any other side-effects.

I really like the idea of "what doesn't kill you makes you crazy", and your suggestions for showing that. The game already has graveyard whispers--with cumulated use (while surviving with Radaway), these could slowly appear everywhere, and get louder and louder, eventually drowning out NPC voices. It would be nice to already have a visual effect anyway when going invisible, that perhaps starts lingering on over-use. To simulate addiction, any stealth boy in the PC's inventory could start being randomly equipped, and the PC can no longer muster the willpower to drop, store or sell it (like the One Ring in Lord of the Rings--also, by the way, an invisibility item), without a dose of fixer or help from a doctor. For the paranoia, random strangers can be made to appear hostile on the HUD compass, when in fact they're not. As Doctor Henry suggests, it might not be easy to permanently reverse these side-effects--maybe, only abstaining from stealth boy use ("cold turkey") would let them gradually fade over many days.

I note that DUST simulates madness blackouts (called "fugues" in Real Life) by randomly teleporting the Player Character and advancing time. This could be accompanied by decay in all reputations as the deranged character becomes known for crazy or dangerous acts (but karma doesn't change, because the PC was not responsible at the time).

Your suggested animations sound great, and ambitious. My own preference would be a single release that has pretty much everything we ourselves want, if it doesn't take too much longer; and after that, only bugfixes. More splash and buzz that way. Or at least, if we do think we might eventually add later features, not to announce them in advance: I myself am a bit leery of "works-in-progress" on the Nexus that, too often, never get finished; plus, leaves us freer that way. Also to consider these for an eventual separate or optional mod, patch or version, that might also work in some way with the vanilla stealth boy, and that players could choose to merge in or not, according to possible issues of performance or compatibility.