drach Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 I went with institute on my first playthrough and got terribly disappointed, especially with their "let's kill all humans and substitute them with our controllable machines" for that even BoS and Enclave are better while being effectively flavours of Nazis of the Fallout age on the other hand we have neo-socialistic Railroad children (Railroad being major faction is a serious overstatement imo) and the Minutemen..., both are terribly written the last suffers from additionally bland questline and Preston, while first is just infantile so Player, the choice is yous which evil you see as lesser? that's actually a good narrative choice, but in this setup makes me want to forget main questline even exists, but wait we have new Raider faction hundreds of players cried about, Bethesda listened and delivered. I was genuinely exited until I found out new faction has no ending it's a sidetrack nothing more, still It's my faction choice and I'm gonna nuke the institute one way or another Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinlessorrow Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017  I may be wrong but I just can't see the Minutemen being canon. They just seem like to much of a fall back faction Imo. I could be wrong though.  You are wrong. It's in the game - thus it is canon. More importantly, they're a primary faction with an ending (that lines up nearly exactly with two of the other factions). You really can't get more canon then that. They are the "fall back" faction though. In the bizarre chance you upset all of the others - there will always be the Minutemen.   That's my point the Minutemen only exist so that you can finish the game if you tick off the others. They're not meant to be the faction that wins the war, they're only existence is to not lock you out of beating the game. They're canon as far as they existed and we're wiped out, but that's it. I can't see them being the cannon ending in fallout 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iXenite Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 I went with institute on my first playthrough and got terribly disappointed, especially with their "let's kill all humans and substitute them with our controllable machines" for that even BoS and Enclave are better while being effectively flavours of Nazis of the Fallout age on the other hand we have neo-socialistic Railroad children (Railroad being major faction is a serious overstatement imo) and the Minutemen..., both are terribly written the last suffers from additionally bland questline and Preston, while first is just infantile so Player, the choice is yous which evil you see as lesser? that's actually a good narrative choice, but in this setup makes me want to forget main questline even exists, but wait we have new Raider faction hundreds of players cried about, Bethesda listened and delivered. I was genuinely exited until I found out new faction has no ending it's a sidetrack nothing more, still It's my faction choice and I'm gonna nuke the institute one way or another That's not really what the Institute is doing. I think their intentions are a lot less evil than people think. I think they have good intentions (which we all know how good intentions go). Technically we don't actually know their plan because Bethesda, as always, never really went into detail on it. My best guess though is that they were inspired by Start Trek: TOS when it came to the purpose of Synths. The "Mankind Redefined" part. The episode "What are little girls made of?" of Start Trek shows a scientist that discovers this ancient "race" of androids. These androids destroyed the people that created them because they were flawed in comparison. However, the part that I think Bethesda took from this episode is what the scientist wanted to do with the androids. You see, the facilities to create androids still existed and functioned perfectly fine. His theory was that immortality and peace could be achieved by replicating humans exactly as they are. Thus, shedding their mortal form in favor of an android body. The Institute discusses how Synths are superior to humanity, or rather an evolution of humanity, that can persevere in the Commonwealth (and the Wasteland in general) due tot heir resistances to disease, radiation, hunger, etc. They wouldn't have any use for war because those negative emotions could be removed. Humanity could rebuild through Synths. Kirk demonstrates the failure in this logic though in a very similar fashion to how the Lone Survivor can persuade John Henry Eden that he isn't an Artificial Intelligence. That he's a machine. Kirk was able to show how these androids may not be as "unfeeling" as the scientist implied. That they do have emotions, such as anger, affection, and love. In addition to the fact that they may not be as perfect replications of humanity as theorized. That they will always be at a fundamental level be machines. The big thing about the Institute for me though is that it is one of the factions you the player can actually control. Bethesda, again as always, fails to deliver on this front in any meaningful manner but it is heavily implied by Piper (and in general) that the future of the Institute is open. A hero character, and lets be honest all Fallout 4 protagonists are heroes due to the design of the game, would unlikely steer the Institute in a negative direction. The speech the Sole Survivor gives over the radio to announce the Institutes new generator gives the player the opportunity to "go off script" as one of their first tasks as the future Director. The things you can chose to say do show potential for the Institute to a more positive source in the Commonwealth. Synths can be used to help rebuild the Commonwealth alongside humanity. That's how I see it anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drach Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 yeah, you being director still does not change institute's prime directive - replace humans with obedient synths and engineer new species - whether you'll do it the hard way or nice way human race is going to be exterminated, to me it's nuke time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyArchaon Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 Brotherhood is the best faction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iXenite Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 yeah, you being director still does not change institute's prime directive - replace humans with obedient synths and engineer new species - whether you'll do it the hard way or nice way human race is going to be exterminated, to me it's nuke time That doesn't have to be true. As Director you could feasibly redirect the entire Institute's mission. After all, not everyone in the Institute is dedicated to Synth production. There are also those within the Institute that dislike the Institutes current stance on Synths, like Dr. Madison Li. Your role as Director is to dictate what each department of the Institute does. Typically the Director doesn't need to tell people what to do, as oversight is pretty lean in the Institute. However, there is evidence in the game that shows this isn't always the case. Super Mutant production was something that Virgil had no interest in continuing - but on the orders of the Director it kept going on. Bethesda never gives the player the ability to exercise their authority as Director, but who honestly thought they were going to do that. Its the same people that thought the busy work quests for the Companions Guild should be unlocked after you become their leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drach Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 play again and pay attention to dialogues, I was hoping for institute to play out as you describe it, sadly director only manages and leads his faction on already set course and has no power to change it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iXenite Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 play again and pay attention to dialogues, I was hoping for institute to play out as you describe it, sadly director only manages and leads his faction on already set course and has no power to change it I've explained this numerous times. That is only because Bethesda never gives you the option to do anything. That should come as no surprise as Bethesda is notoriously lazy with their writing. They barely wrote anything about the Institute anyway. They rushed the ending (which is horrible by the way) as fast they possibly could (as usual). Sadly this is one of their better attempts at story writing. They really need a new writing team. There is dialogue in the game that suggests that the Director has power to dictate Institute policy. I've already mentioned in my previous post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drach Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 (edited) true, but we're talking about what is, not what might or should be, for all I care as a General you should be able to make minutemen mercs to rival the gunners not babysit some misguided fools, as an overboss you should get custom ending being probably the largest faction (BoS as a whole aside), same story with the institute, you should be able to stop this madness, but... Edited September 23, 2017 by drach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iXenite Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 true, but we're talking about what is, not what might or should be, for all I care as a General you should be able to make minutemen mercs to rival the gunners not babysit some misguided fools, as an overboss you should get custom ending being probably the largest faction (BoS as a whole aside), same story with the institute, you should be able to stop this madness, but... You've pretty much summed up the whole point of role playing. As well as summarizing why Bethesda isn't very good at making role playing games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts