Why an Orc would side with the Stormcloaks..

[LobselVith66]

we do know why your being captured. as ralof says you were crossing the border illegally and they caught you with the storm cloaks. and @landy the background of our char is what we say. its the whole point of role playing. your what you want.

 

im currently a dunmer mage and i chose storm cloaks. because my toon was cast out of morrowind and fled to cyrodiil. there he had a family. in the great war he became a soldier and went to war. after the war when he came back he saw his family gotten killed in the sacking of the imperial city. he wanted revenge on the Altmer but saw empire does nothing. he wandered for 20 yrs in cyrodiil and after that he wen to skyrim. he wants to get revenge both from altmers and empire so he chose storm cloaks.

 

Interesting backstory for your character. Considering that Morrowind seems to be independent now (with House Hlaalu losing all it's power because of it's political ties to the Empire) I've made the same decision with my Telvanni mage (to help the Stormcloaks), although for different reasons than your protagonist. Perhaps Ulfric can reach out to High Rock and House Redoran to deal with the Thalmor, since the former might change their response with an independent Skyrim offering the alliance, and I'm certain some Orcs who served in the Legion during the Great War might be willing to bear arms against the Thalmor, given how there are Orc strongholds throughout the region.

 

Considering that some Legion troops talk about a possible invasion of Morrowind (by the troops stationed in Riften) if you help the Empire, it seems like the right decision (to me).

 

With the Thalmor posing a threat to virtually everyone with their intention on unmaking Mundus, it's not too difficult to see why anyone would want to oppose them directly - Orc or otherwise.

[Aluroon]

I've played the Civil War from both sides, and I think on both a personal (character) and a large scale (intellectual) level there are relatively strong points to both sides.

 

Imperials

Generally speaking when I side with the Empire it is with the belief that while the Empire is not perfect (see, attempting to cut my head off with no trial or evidence), it has the best chance of resisting the Dominion. A united Empire is a stronger Empire, and a strong Empire is good for the races of man. The characters that usually endorse this position tend to be extremely practical and intellectual - you are doing what you have to do despite understanding and even sympathizing with the Stormcloak position. I've completed the Imperial Legion side of the quest with the following characters:

 

-Alexander, my dedicated imperial war mage who believed the only hope for men lay in a united Empire. He put down the Stormcloak rebellion, believing them to be shortsighted traitors to the Empire who cared only for their own power and glory, and who could not see the larger perspective.

 

-Iscariot was high elf mage and former agent of the Domnion who betrayed them and resolved to work against them at every turn when they condemned his wife. He took to Skyrim and ended up in on the side of the Empire because he believed the racist Stormcloaks would never accept him and that in the long run they were being manipulated by the Dominion (which was true). A more powerful Empire was a bigger thorn in the side of the Dominion.

 

-G'kar was my incredibly honorable argonian swordsman (and only character to finish the main questline!) who sided with the Empire because he believed that the Stormcloaks had forsaken their own honor and broken their oaths by opposing the Empire. He's somewhat unique in that his position was not motivated by any larger considerations. Even though he sympathized with Ulfric, and regarded him as a worthy foe and otherwise honorable man, he could not pass over their decision to forsake ancient oaths.

 

Stormcloaks

When I side with the Stormcloaks the characters are usually more self-centered, wild, or personally powerful. These characters tend to share outrage over the events in Helgon (e.g. executing prisoners, executing Ulfric without a trial, executing innocent people callously), sympathy for the way an otherwise largely free Skyrim has been stomped on by the Empire and Dominion, hatred for the Dominion, and affinity for Skyrim as a whole. Alternatively, they are characters who seek to take power in Skyrim and view both the Dominon and Empire's presence as undermining their own plans or powers.

 

-Katrina was my nord summoner / sword and board - she was Nord through and through, an honorable warrior who could not stand by and watch her people's religion and traditions be stomped on. She refused to allow the Dominion to abduct good and honorable men from their homes to be murdered and opposed any who were willing to permit that to happen. Towards that end, while she was sympatheic to many within the Empire, dedicated herself entirely to the cause of Ulfric Stormcloak, eventually laying before him the heads of Rikke and Tullius. Her actions were entirely motivated by her love for her people, and she sought no personal glory (though she gained much).

 

-Alex was my breton mage and thief (and occasional two-handed fighter for comical effect) who sought to force the Empire out because she resented the law and order it represented. She wanted a free and open land where all men (and women) could find their own path. Any who sought to force upon others certain beliefs were her foes. She did not love the Stormcloaks, but was willing to hold her nose and work with them to achieve her own desires.

 

-Lanfear was my ridiculously powerful high elf sorceress, assassin, and vampire lord. She sought to force the Empire and Dominion out of Skyrim so she could claim the entire domain as her own, having already wrapped the Companions, College, Thieves Guild, and Dark Brotherhood around her fingers. She desired to rule for herself, but saw the defeat of the Empire as a first step (believing she could manipulate or even replace Ulfric in the long run).

 

-Sigurd is my current Nord swordsman turned ronin. Born and raised in Cyrodiil, a loyal servant of the Empire and legionnaire, he was driven to rage when, during a journey north to lay his father's bones to rest in his ancestral homeland he was summarily attacked, captured, condemned, and nearly executed by the power made general and his assistant. He watched his father's bones thrown into a ditch as he was hauled away without even a chance to defend himself despite his own position in the legions. His family had given their entire lives to the Empire, and to have that fealty betrayed and repaid with such callous disregard drove him over the edge. He escaped Helgon with the Stormcloaks and never looked back, having seen the true face of the Empire in the outer provinces rather than simply the pretty face it put on in the Imperial City. Though he discovered the Dominions manipulation of Ulfric, believes he can throw a wrench in their plans by winning the war and leading the true High King's armies against the Dominion himself. Given the personal power he now wields that might just be the case...

 

-Jorgen was my red guard barbarian, a man who lived for battle but eventually came to see there was a wider world. He sided with the Stormcloaks, believe the Imperials to be weak, conniving, and honor-less men unwilling to stand up for what they believed in. He desired a campaign against the Dominion after the reclaiming of Skyrim, holding that it was better to take a fight on your own terms than to wait for your opponent to do so on his, and that he would rather die with a sword in his hands than on his knees before any man (it is my great tragedy that there was no DLC that ever let you attack the Dominion).

[Morrovvind]

Personally, I can see any race of character joining either the Stormcloaks or the Imperial Legion. However, my main problem is trying to figure out how I can be in all of the side factions at once while siding with either the Imperials or Stormcloaks.

 

Going into details would reveal too many spoilers (forget if I'm in the spoiler section or not, going to be careful), but for example:

-Siding with the Brotherhood almost seems made for a Stormcloak playthrough, and very illogical for an Imperial Legion playthrough

-The Thieves Guild is in the pocket of Maven Blackbriar, who is allied with the Imperials, making a Thieves/Stormcloak playthrough misguided

-The Companions seem more Stormcloak aligned (given their roots)

-The College of Winterhold seems a bit more neutral, but tensions with the Synod of Cyrodiil make the College seem more suitable for Stormcloaks

 

So even if I was an Orc in the Imperial Legion, it would seem misguided for me to join the Dark Brotherhood, the Companions, or, to a lesser extent the College of Winterhold. I'm stricly speaking from a role-playing perspective, here, but it seems like to get the most content out of a playthrough, I'd have to join the Stormcloaks because many of the factions in Skyrim, save the Thieves Guild, seem much more reasonable to a Stormcloak character.

 

Either that, or I'd ignore the Civil War altogether and be a neutral force, but then I get to the issue of being some weird jack of all trades Mage/Thief/Assassin/Werewolf-Warrior type of character.

[Aluroon]

I think you can join the Legion while skill finishing the Dark Brotherhood and killing the Emperor - it all depends on how you frame it. I had a character that murdered him, knowing that he had no power and that only such an event (the murder of the emperor by a high elf) might shake the Empire free from the political control the Thalmor had over it.

 

I had another character who won for the Empire but latter fell from grace and became a thief and murderer for hire. He later joined killed the Emperor - which proved to be a moment of clarity that led to him renouncing his former ways and becoming the hero Skyrim needed him to be.

[maxernst]

First, i'd like to point out that the Empire did NOT lose the Great War, though a lot of people seem to get confused on that. They fought to a stalemate in which the Dominion had no forces to continue the fight, and the Empire had no infrastructure with which to supply an invasion. Orcs very much recognize the concept of compromise and temporary reprieves. Nothing in the Code of Malacath states they much continue fighting when both sides are spent. In fact, to do so would likely violate the terms of honorable combat against worthy foes, to fight against so depleted an opponent would not be in keeping with the Code.

 

Umm, have you ever heard of a face-saving lie? Exactly what concessions did the Dominion make other than agreeing not to attack the Empire any more? The Empire gave up territory (though the Dominion has struggled to make it their own), they changed their laws, they disbanded their secret service. They allow the Thalmor to violate their soverignty by pursuing Talos-worshippers in the empire. That sure doesn't sound like a stalemate to me.

[Lachdonin]

 

First, i'd like to point out that the Empire did NOT lose the Great War, though a lot of people seem to get confused on that. They fought to a stalemate in which the Dominion had no forces to continue the fight, and the Empire had no infrastructure with which to supply an invasion. Orcs very much recognize the concept of compromise and temporary reprieves. Nothing in the Code of Malacath states they much continue fighting when both sides are spent. In fact, to do so would likely violate the terms of honorable combat against worthy foes, to fight against so depleted an opponent would not be in keeping with the Code.

 

Umm, have you ever heard of a face-saving lie? Exactly what concessions did the Dominion make other than agreeing not to attack the Empire any more? The Empire gave up territory (though the Dominion has struggled to make it their own), they changed their laws, they disbanded their secret service. They allow the Thalmor to violate their soverignty by pursuing Talos-worshippers in the empire. That sure doesn't sound like a stalemate to me.

 

 

This argument has been had out dozens of times. Frankly, i'm tired of repeating it. The situation is far more complicated than you seem to imply, and frankly, if people aren't willing to do some research i'm not going to keep having the same discussion.

 

And the Blades had already ceased to be an officially standing Imperial agency by the ascendance of Titus Mede I. By 4E30 they had already been replaced by the Penitus Oculatus.

[nekollx]

^^ Also let's be honest here, it was Ulfric that cased Talos Worship to become a crime, sure it was illeagle but the Empire tirned a blind eye to it, hell to becoem Thane of Solutide the High Queen Elisif the Fair ask you to lay her husband's horn at a shirne to Talos, yeah, that's right the Jarl at the Seat of Imperial Power has a soft spot for Talos.

[kradus]

 

Umm, have you ever heard of a face-saving lie? Exactly what concessions did the Dominion make other than agreeing not to attack the Empire any more? The Empire gave up territory (though the Dominion has struggled to make it their own), they changed their laws, they disbanded their secret service. They allow the Thalmor to violate their soverignty by pursuing Talos-worshippers in the empire. That sure doesn't sound like a stalemate to me.

 

 

It was, the Thalmor had been trying to take the imperial province, and the Concordat, though ugly, put a stop to that.

[fraquar]

^^ Also let's be honest here, it was Ulfric that cased Talos Worship to become a crime, sure it was illeagle but the Empire tirned a blind eye to it, hell to becoem Thane of Solutide the High Queen Elisif the Fair ask you to lay her husband's horn at a shirne to Talos, yeah, that's right the Jarl at the Seat of Imperial Power has a soft spot for Talos.

People should think twice before using the term stalemate, because in a stalemate position it makes no sense for EITHER side to continue - and in turn make no sense for EITHER side to give up massive concessions. It's the essence of the Stormcloak fight, where a good number of Stormcloaks (and it's leadership) were actually Legions in the Great War (nothing great about it though). There was no need to concede Talos worship, no need to "send it underground" either. The Dominion was in no position to challenge that either if we are to believe the propaganda that it really was a stalemate and the Dominion could no longer field an effective fighting force.

[Lachdonin]

 

People should think twice before using the term stalemate, because in a stalemate position it makes no sense for EITHER side to continue - and in turn make no sense for EITHER side to give up massive concessions. It's the essence of the Stormcloak fight, where a good number of Stormcloaks (and it's leadership) were actually Legions in the Great War (nothing great about it though). There was no need to concede Talos worship, no need to "send it underground" either. The Dominion was in no position to challenge that either if we are to believe the propaganda that it really was a stalemate and the Dominion could no longer field an effective fighting force.

 

 

The entire justification for NOT calling the result of the Battle of the Red Ring a stalemate implies that the Thalmor are rational people. They aren't, not by a long shot. They would bleed their population dry for their goal. The result of the Great War was what any reasonable historian would have referred to as a stalemate.