Seamless Texture Help

[SnakeSlippers]

When you change the texture of an item with the GECK it always ends up darker then the ground texture even if it's using the same texture

 

Anyone know why?

 

https://imgur.com/WnBmDM8

[EPDGaffney]

Are you saying that used to be a seamless texture? Are you absolutely sure? Cos I don't remember it that way.

 

I'll be honest with you, this game is filled to the brim with texture oversights like this, among other weird graphical flaws, and you'll never fix them all so I tend to ignore them if they haven't been fixed by all my mods at this point.

 

What did you do to change it exactly? Which object in that image has a new texture? I'm using texture mods for so long that I actually don't perfectly remember the vanilla graphics.

[SnakeSlippers]

Are you saying that used to be a seamless texture? Are you absolutely sure? Cos I don't remember it that way.

 

I'll be honest with you, this game is filled to the brim with texture oversights like this, among other weird graphical flaws, and you'll never fix them all so I tend to ignore them if they haven't been fixed by all my mods at this point.

 

What did you do to change it exactly? Which object in that image has a new texture? I'm using texture mods for so long that I actually don't perfectly remember the vanilla graphics.

I'm working on my own custom mod and I replaced the whole landscape with 1 seamless sand texture, (In photo) and it's seamless everywhere. Untill you take like say rail road tracks in the GECK, edit, where you choose the nif model you can also change textures there too. But the texture is always darker then the ground. I've tried with snow, sand, everything. It might be something with the model itself.

[dubiousintent]

I'm working on my own custom mod and I replaced the whole landscape with 1 seamless sand texture, (In photo) and it's seamless everywhere. Untill you take like say rail road tracks in the GECK, edit, where you choose the nif model you can also change textures there too. But the texture is always darker then the ground. I've tried with snow, sand, everything. It might be something with the model itself.

I've seen that mentioned about railroad tracks before and believe it (the roadbed ballast) is indeed part of the model.

 

-Dubious-

[EPDGaffney]

Yes, the model determines the lighting in this game. I'm asking, in the vanilla game was it seamless? I don't mean the 2D .dds texture file; I'm asking, did it look seamless in-game?

 

So, the way it works is that the way an object is lit is dependent on several factors. The first is the normal map and its alpha channel. Obviously, you're telling me these are all the same texture, so that's not the problem here but it is certainly something to be aware of. The normal map behaves as you expect, and its alpha channel is used as the specular map. Generally, you want that spec map to be mostly dark, down to drawing distinctly different effects in-game from a portion of a spec map that is 5% bright and 8% bright, for example (that is, 0% is pitch black, and bringing the RGB values all up by 5% of the maximum value available, 255, is termed 5%, in this case about 13).

 

Now, be aware that the spec map is manipulated in NifSkope but its effects are completely ignored visually until you see it in the G.E.C.K. or the game, though the G.E.C.K. usually doesn't display it accurately to the way it will look in-game.

 

So, now that the basics are out of the way, the rest of the lighting stuff is determined per model in NifSkope. Open your train tacks model in NifSkope (located in meshes\dungeons\metro\exterior), and click on the dirt portion:

http://prntscr.com/hrfe6f

 

This tells you quickly and easily which NiTriStrips it is. Expand that and go to the NiMaterialProperty node that is attached to the NiTriStrips for the dirt:

https://prnt.sc/hrffdb

 

The Specular and Emissive both have an effect but it's really the Glossiness entry that's likely to have the effect you're looking for. It will be a good bit of trial and error.

 

Other things that can have an effect are the Shader flags:

http://prntscr.com/hrfjtk

 

and though not in this case (unless the terrain model has it), other texture slots besides the diffuse and normal:

http://prntscr.com/hrfkdw

 

 

However, looking at images of the vanilla graphics, I think they just did their UVs in a way that makes the textures look more cohesive just where they meet, perhaps, but they definitely aren't seamless, at least in the screenshots I'm seeing.

Edited December 25, 2017 by EPDGaffney

[Deleted1205226User]

The NiTristripsData can also have vertices colored (used for shading purpose). If that's the case, that part will always look darker no matter what changes are made in the previous settings.

[EPDGaffney]

I didn't even know that, wow. Thanks for that.

 

Edit: Although, just gave it another thought, and if that's the case, that would be weird, because they seemed to be trying to make them look seamless in the vanilla game but couldn't make it perfect. I think it's the UVs most likely, for this particular case.

Edited December 24, 2017 by EPDGaffney

[madmongo]

When they run rail through the desert, they still use ballast. It would probably look a lot more realistic if you mixed the ballast texture with the sand texture in the rail nifs instead of making it all sand.

 

In any event, if you really want all sand, it's not difficult to remove the ballast from the tracks and ties in Blender. I did it so that I could put the tracks on something else (a bridge, in my case). You could then just place your tracks and ties directly on your sand landscape and there would be no seam and no texture mismatch.

Edited December 24, 2017 by madmongo

[dubiousintent]

@EPDGaffney: Interesting thread. I'm putting it together as a tip on "Model Lighting", and would like permission to use your images (with credit of course). I know you have been willing in the past, but Nexus rules require permissions for use of images from "off-site" to be explicitly stated. Their default license is CC-by-SA. This is the easiest way for them to confirm it.

 

-Dubious-

Edited December 25, 2017 by dubiousintent

[EPDGaffney]

That's a great idea, mongo. So simple but I completely missed how easy that would be. If I were doing this mod, I'd probably do that. OP could remove it just as easily in NifSkope, or at least, I would do that and if it would cause any problems I'm not aware of them. I've been right-clicking on stuff in NifSkope and choosing Remove Block for a while now and haven't had any trouble yet.

 

Sure, Dubious. As far as I'm concerned, you can use my images any time you like, in much the way anyone can Google this forum and see them. But I understand if it's sort of a requirement that you ask each time. I'm easy-going like that.

 

Also, do you have a link to older versions of NifSkope in any of your guides? I got this one from PixelHate some time back:

https://github.com/niftools/nifskope/releases/tag/nifskope-1.1.3

 

It's pretty hard to find, as most of the links to that version don't contain an .exe file, which obviously, you would need. The newest version works fine for the most part, but is missing some features that a lot of guides refer to, like importing and maybe even exporting .obj files. I think that's even a requirement for Skyrim as opposed to just one of many potential methods the way it is on older Gamebryo games.