Portable Tent plus Nevada Skies

[VaporWatch]

So I've spent the larges portion of last night trying to sort this out to no avail. I can't find anything online that would give me a hint as to where the conflict is and I've exhausted my troubleshooting knowledge. Here's the issue.

 

I didn't realize when installing it, but Portable Tent (PT) has some kind of weird conflict with Nevada Skies. PT will work fine for a while until, seemingly at random, you'll try to enter your tent to find yourself stuck in place, maybe 1 FPS, and a bunch of clanking going on. The only way out of this is to either hold the escape key until the menu comes up, then reload a previous save, or alt-tabbing out and shutting down.

 

I have isolated the interaction between these mods by running a test load with only those 2 mods loaded. It took about 5 hours for the weirdness to start, but eventually it happened. (I tested this by fast travelling to a location and letting the game run for about 30 minutes while I worked on other things. Roughly every 30 minutes I came back to the game, dropped the tent on the ground, set it up, and entered the tent. Once it borked in game, I tried reloading, fast travelling, and waiting individually before trying the tent with the same results, then I tried once reloading, travelling, then waiting (just for the hell of it) before trying the tent with, again, the same results.

 

I have also gone as far as I can with my knowledge. This is what I've done:

 

Obviously, I've tried swapping them in the load order with no change.

 

Portable Tent (PT) has a unique weather and climate. I deleted the unique weather and climate and changed the references in the tent cell to refer to vanilla weather and climate. Tested multiple times - No Change.

PT uses a unique image space for the tent. I deleted the unique image space and changed the references to a vanilla image space (the same space used for Ceasar's tent, 00064ece). Tested multiple times - No Change

Deleted all unique climate, weather, and Image Space records. Changed all references to deleted records to vanilla references. Tested multiple times - No Change

 

 

These two mods do not do the same things, so there should be a way to make them compatible! Please! I know there is someone out there who has the knowledge to figure this out. I absolutely do not want to unload Nevada Skies OR Portable Tent.......plus, I avidly try to avoid making any changes to my mod list whatsoever once I've achieved a stable game.

 

Please help?

[dubiousintent]

Known problem (called the "vortex tornado" or "blackhole"), and the only known solution is to choose between one or the other mod. (You've already attempted more to fix it than I've seen in any other report.) There are other Weather mods, and a new version of PT called "Portable Tribal Tent". Don't know if this has the same problem (nothing in comments). The other version called "Tent Remade" admits to having the same problem as the original, but not with other weather mods.

 

Regarding your stable game mod list. Please see the 'Clean Saves' section of the wiki "FNV General Mod Use Advice" article. Keep track of the save game file before you attempt a "clean save" and you can revert to it if necessary. I would try replacing Nevada Skies with another weather mod first. While they affect more cells, I don't believe that weather mods add anything to the save game files that will hang around after a "clean save" process. "Portable Tent" on the other hand is saving all of it's containers in the game files. But, if you unload all the tent's containers to others before removing it, you should be able to perform a "clean save" on it as well.

 

The rationale for this is that neither mod should be providing any GMST or scripts that alter game quests or anything else that might make the save file corrupt. Not guaranteed, but worth a shot. But the full "clean save" process give you the best chance.

 

-Dubious-

[VaporWatch]

Thanks for the advice, Dubiousintent. It's not the lack of understanding regarding "clean saves" that has me reluctant to change the load list. It's more that I've got 375+ mods in my current game that took me nearly 2 months to get stable. There are many, MANY manually copied records from mods with only a handful of records, tweaks of other mods that I've used as templates and incorporated into my own plugin, and merges. As I go through the process of doing all that, virtually every one of my plugins end up being modified in one way or another. My mod list doesn't have a single reported error or conflict (beyond those that are inherent in the game plugins) because I manually go through every single record for every single plugin in my mod list and manually resolve all of them in what I call my "Tail Mod" (kinda like a bashed patch that takes far more into account). The end result is my tail mod is slave to every other mod in the load order. Yes, I could remove one of the two mods in question from my tail mod, but that's a last resort kinda thing.

I know there's someone out there who has the knowledge to figure this out. It makes no sense that these two mods should be incompatible! Tell you what.......I'll give a $50 donation to the first person who can give me a working solution that doesn't involve removing the mods. I don't need a plugin........instructions will do. The way I see it, avoiding having to pick through my "tail mod" removing the references from a mod is well worth $50!

[Mktavish]

Going with the idea that it is the dynamic weather changes of Nevada Skies causing it.

 

Try a test with a geck edit , by opening up the cell window of " FeePtTentCell " Go to the lighting tab , and uncheck the flag " Behave like Exterior "

And I guess you will have to drop in some lights temporarily so you can see in there.

Then run your tests to see if you still get stuck.

 

If no problems with that. Then my only real guess to fix it , not knowing how Nevada Skies does it's thing.

Would be to Duplicate "NVWastelandIS" image space modifier ... giving it a new name.

Then on "FeePtTentWeather" change to your new one.

The thought there being that Nevada Skies will no longer be able to inject it's dynamic weather changes with the tent interior.

But not really sure.

 

However ... seems you could just try and fake the daylight changes in that cell through some scripting ... and leave the "Behaves like Exterior" unchecked ?

[VaporWatch]

Going with the idea that it is the dynamic weather changes of Nevada Skies causing it.

 

Try a test with a geck edit , by opening up the cell window of " FeePtTentCell " Go to the lighting tab , and uncheck the flag " Behave like Exterior "

And I guess you will have to drop in some lights temporarily so you can see in there.

Then run your tests to see if you still get stuck.

 

If no problems with that. Then my only real guess to fix it , not knowing how Nevada Skies does it's thing.

Would be to Duplicate "NVWastelandIS" image space modifier ... giving it a new name.

Then on "FeePtTentWeather" change to your new one.

The thought there being that Nevada Skies will no longer be able to inject it's dynamic weather changes with the tent interior.

But not really sure.

 

However ... seems you could just try and fake the daylight changes in that cell through some scripting ... and leave the "Behaves like Exterior" unchecked ?

Ok, I tried to follow your instructions, but I'm either missing something or they weren't complete. I did try setting the tent cell to "is interior cell" only, eliminating the e"behave like exterior" flag and tested in game. Still have the vortex bug, though. I think I got your advice there and tested as you suggested, but no joy. I'm absolutely willing to listen to other options!

[Mktavish]

Ya if it didn't work with the test ... then my further instructions would make no difference.

I was just throwing out a second line on that if it did work ... sorry it didn't :confused:

 

The only thing that makes sense for what's going on ... would be the tent custom cell not liking the nevada skies ... with what seems it's custom weather input.

 

So if the flag didn't work ... I would suggest making a small world cell ... and transporting everything to there.

Sorry that is the extent of my knowledge without some testing :unsure: .... gota luv that testing though eh :thumbsup:

[VaporWatch]

Ya if it didn't work with the test ... then my further instructions would make no difference.

I was just throwing out a second line on that if it did work ... sorry it didn't :confused:

 

The only thing that makes sense for what's going on ... would be the tent custom cell not liking the nevada skies ... with what seems it's custom weather input.

 

So if the flag didn't work ... I would suggest making a small world cell ... and transporting everything to there.

Sorry that is the extent of my knowledge without some testing :unsure: .... gota luv that testing though eh :thumbsup:

 

I'd REALLY rather not have to move everything to another cell! There are hundreds of references I'd have to move........and my limited knowledge of GECK would almost definitely result in many mistakes. In the end, I'll just have to let it go if I can't get it fixed. I'll end up using the magical "bag of holding" mod.....which works fine, but is far FAR less immersive.

 

For anyone else wishing to try, in this most recent test, I deleted the climate, weather, and image space, changing all references to them to point to vanilla resources as well as deleting the "behave like exterior" flag. Also, for gits and shiggles, I changed the light template, acoustic space, music type, and deleted the ownership. All with no luck.

 

The offer of $50 reward still applies to the first person who can give me instructions to definitively fix this problem.

[kingbeast88]

I don't believe the is interior cell, and behaves like exterior cell flags have anything to do with it. I have another mod from another site which has those flags although it's not a player home tent mod and is much more bare bones inside but it does not suffer from that black hole vortex when using Nevada Skies.

 

It doesn't use a unique image space, uses WastelandClimate for it's weather and uses Default for the water height (no number values). The lighting template, acoustic space and music type really shouldn't affect anything.

 

I really suspect it has to do with the way the cell itself was made. Since I believe all the portable tent mod's are using that same cell (copying it or making edits to the original). Here is what I mean (hopefully the images show). Below is a cell that has no Blackhole conflict with Nevada Skies and uses a tent.

 

 

 

And the latter most is the cells that all the Portable Tent's mod's seem to use. I believe using a similar world space style to the working mod would solve the issue. The tent cell is basically hovering in the void with only a collision marker underneath it to keep things from falling from the looks of it. I imagine this is causing the issue somehow combined with the behaves like an exterior flag with Nevada Skies. Could probably just use one of the tent cells from Primm using only the interior cell flag and have no issue. However I don't quite have time to test this out.

Edited February 21, 2018 by kingbeast88

[dubiousintent]

I see what you are saying. As the "interior cell" is not anchored in any worldspace, it (probably) behaves abnormally. To be "portable" all it needs is a "temporary portal" placed in the current worldspace (which it probably already does) that links to the separate worldspace that contains the "interior cell" of the tent. That separate worldspace can be extremely bare bones as it is never actually seen. It's sole purpose is to "anchor" the interior cell. All of which presumes it's the lack of an anchor underlying the "vortex".

 

In which case all that would be needed is to create the separate worldspace, place the PT interior cell in it (with a "North" marker), and change the "temporary portal" to link to that location in the new worldspace cell. Using the JIP NVSE "MoveToCell" or "MoveToNode" functions I would suggest.

 

(Edit: If this works, give the donation to kingbeast88. It's his solution.)

 

-Dubious-

[Mktavish]

Ya but VaporWatch says they don't want to create a whole new cell , and then deal with all the scripting changes that would need to be put in to change it over. Although ... it might not be that hard. By first making a new cell (small world exterior) Then just copying everything from FeePtTentCell ... and paste in place ... and adjust the z position of everything at once ... so the tent floor lines up with the new ground (slightly above for no texture flashing)

 

Go back to FeePtTentCell , delete everything and the cell.

Then close out geck , and relaunch so those pieces and their names will be gone. Then back to the new small world cell ... and rename cell ... then all the duplicated pieces to match the originals. Could work ... but some references may have to be re-linked up manually in the geck. Because of course their number letter combo (form-Id's) have now changed. Also would have to just re-make the navmesh ... but it is pretty small , so no big deal.

 

Although that mention of the north marker you said dubious ... may be worth a quick test. Just plop one in the existing cell , since it doesn't have one , may fix it ? Or maybe even giving it a default water height ?

 

The collision plane in there , seems not needed , as it is at least 50 units below the tent floor.

And I'm puzzled as to the purpose of the second tent and other objects below the first one and collision plane.

 

And if I would have got the 50 bucks ... I would have said just to donate it to the Nexus so they can pay dubious something ... LOL