Removing and adding mods mid-playthrough

[Bazza0304]

I know this has been discussed before but Iâve seen so much conflicting advice i was hoping for something more definitive. Is it safe to:

 

1. change load order mid-playthrough even if no mods are added or removed. Iâve seen numerous comments and posts saying it is not safe yet I never heard that for Skyrim, Fallout 3 or new Vegas.

 

2. Add mods mid play through (obviously doing so would change the load order of other mods too) as long as you rebuild any merged or bashed patch you have

 

3. Remove mods mid play through. This is the one I believe is most dangerous but does it depend on the type of mod and how much it changes and is there a safe way of doing it? Iâve restarted so many times now due to changing mods which I donât mind too much but Iâm not going to lie, Iâm starting to detest the Corvega factory. For example I wanted to change from UFF to AFT and I couldnât see a way to do it without restarting because they both alter companion limits but in very different ways. (Off topic but I just had to have AFT for those multiple follower interjections, makes having multi comps so much more immersive and satisfying)

Edited March 18, 2018 by Bazza0304

[Rasikko]

The first 2 are safe. The last one is not. Bethesda themselves have said repeatedly that the game doesn't support removing mods mid-playthrough. It doesn't matter what the mod does.

 

You might get folks telling you otherwise, and I can assure you these are people who know they shouldn't do it, but don't care about the risks.

 

You'll need to go back to a save that does not have the mod installed, that's the safe way of "removing" mods.

[Kodiak412]

Any time you make any change mid game it is a crap shoot as to what you will get. Some can be done without issue and I have done it many times without issue at all. However I tend you gravitate to small mods that change or add specific things and I generally stay away from large mods that change lots of things.

 

Others will be able to chime in and give better advice but what I will say is this. If you have a playthrough and now you want to make mod changes, write down a list of what you want to change or uninstall. Now do it in steps making one change at a time. After each change try to go to the area that might be affected or try to perform something could be affected by that single change and see if the game looks and runs alright.

 

This may be tedious but if you make 15 changes at the same time, and now the game is messed up, you will have no idea whether it was a single change or some combination of changes, that messed up the game. So many variables will make any trouble shooting nearly impossible. One at a time will usually be easy to tell if that change was problematic.

 

As always back up your saves. This can be a great fall back if you change a lot of things and it ends up FUBAR. Good luck.

[RS13]

Bethesda themselves have said repeatedly that the game doesn't support removing mods mid-playthrough. It doesn't matter what the mod does.

 

You might get folks telling you otherwise, and I can assure you these are people who know they shouldn't do it, but don't care about the risks.

 

You'll need to go back to a save that does not have the mod installed, that's the safe way of "removing" mods.

 

Yeah, this is mostly not true. I'm sure Bethesda has said that the game does not support removing mods, but they've also said the game doesn't support using the console. Bethesda's advice on this subject is very cautious precisely because they don't want to be responsible for breaking your savegame.

 

Now, removing mods midgame is the *most* dangerous of the 3, but in many cases it's as safe as pressing the play button. Retextures, or mods that merely change values existing forms or settings (things like mute player voice, create your own difficulty, darker nights, frassen's lights tweaks, Better Mod Descriptions (but not necessarily it's patches)) are completely safe to remove. Mods that merely add non-scripted items or objects to the game are also fairly safe to remove.

 

The real problems start to show up when you start removing mods that change things that are really crucial to the way the game functions (like factions or vanilla quests.)

 

But by far the most dangerous mods to remove are scripted mods. This is because scripts can continue to run even when the originating mod is removed--they get "stuck in the savegame." But, because they objects that the scripts are looking for are missing, they won't find them, freak out and CTD. This was especially bad in Skyrim because the whole thing was propped up three toothpicks and some bubblegum and would crash if you gave i a nasty look or just because it was Tuesday and f*** Tuesday.

 

As far as I know, scripts still get stuck in the savegame in Fallout 4, but the engine is on the whole MUCH more stable. In my experience it rarely causes a problem (though I'm sure it still can!). In fact, in Fallout 4, my crashes are almost always traceable to (I) screwed-up form IDs (II) Screwed up meshes.

 

Now, still, as with everything, it's at-your-own-risk, so I'd recommend you don't remove a mod unless it's causing you problems. Don't remove a mod mid-playthrough just because you don't use it. On the other hand, if a mod is making the game unplayable, then remove it. After all, what do you have to lose?

Edited March 18, 2018 by RS13

[RS13]

2. Add mods mid play through (obviously doing so would change the load order of other mods too) as long as you rebuild any merged or bashed patch you have

 

Sidenote I: removing mods that merely change values is really no different than removing mods that change values. It's just changing numbers. If you can safely change them by adding mods, you can safely change them by removing mods.

 

Sidenote II: Merged patches are unsupported by FO4Edit. I know wryebash just came out for FO4, but I'm not at all convinced it's something that most modders should be using at this point. IMO, you'd be better off learning to use FO4Edit and making your own patches as necessary.

[Bazza0304]

Thanks guys, some solid info there. To be fair I have been playing it safe and restarting when I make major changes because I was still testing things out but I believe Iâve arrived at a mod setup that I would like to stick with now. The only issue left now is micro stutter that, weirdly, only happens in indoor areas. It can happen in interiors that donât even have a load screen like the house of the future and seems to be worse the smaller the interior is. For example the root cellar in sanctuary is horrible. Iâve tried everything I can think of to fix it and nothing has worked but iâll just live with it I suppose. Thanks again everyone.

[SKKmods]

3. Remove mods mid play through.

 

This can be safe if a mod has been designed and implemented to allow for this, including for example (but not limited to) being stateless, having an idle condition, being totally additive making no changes to base game forms/scripts/assets. Check the mod documentation carefully.

 

I put a lot of effort into ensuring my scripted mods are always removable, and wont publish unless they are because I don't want to be stuck with crap mods, and neither should anyone else. But that's just me.

[Bazza0304]

Will do mate and that is great that you make your mods that way, would that they were all like that.

[RS13]

Thanks guys, some solid info there. To be fair I have been playing it safe and restarting when I make major changes because I was still testing things out but I believe Iâve arrived at a mod setup that I would like to stick with now. The only issue left now is micro stutter that, weirdly, only happens in indoor areas. It can happen in interiors that donât even have a load screen like the house of the future and seems to be worse the smaller the interior is. For example the root cellar in sanctuary is horrible. Iâve tried everything I can think of to fix it and nothing has worked but iâll just live with it I suppose. Thanks again everyone.

Yeah, I've had this problem before too. Have you tried turning vsync off and/or running in borderless window? Those two things seem to help.

[chucksteel]

I think it's important to mention scripted mods with injected menus that can cause issues if removed improperly. Yes they are still scripted mods and, most do come with a uninstall method but, surprisingly enough (Not really) some players don't uninstall them correctly. :wallbash: