NCR new vegas

[darkus37]

My best suggestion is for Yesman pledging himself to the new mayor of New Vegas, thus having a functional city police force without being a threat to the NCR. The PC could be that mayor, but it would be a figurehead position with a Deputy Mayor being the actual power behind the throne. This implies a fully annexed New Vegas is equal to any other city in the NCR.

 

Truthfully, I see post-game New Vegas as a matter of consolidation. By the time I reached the end-game, I had decimated most of the Legion and fiends. If they were not marked as respawns, I would only have ghost towns to reclaim.

 

My idea involves turning New Vegas into the equivalent of a castle. You have the inner keep (the strip), the city (West/Freeside), the walls, and outer territory. So, if I follow that track:

 

1) You get a letter from President Kimball thanking you for all of your hard work and as a hero of the NCR, you are being appointed as the new Mayor of New Vegas.

2) A new building will appear in Westside, an old hotel. This will be the new City Hall. Part of your duties will be restore this building and the surrounding area. The more money you put in, the more you get back.

An example of one such quest: restoring the city power generators gives you a boost in fame (visually, all the power lines are restored). More stores are opened. Restoring the sewers seals all of them which means you're going to have to figure out a way to move their associated quests and npcs elsewhere. Eventually, West and Freeside are joined together, with separations of course into outer New Vegas. This would be a good time to get the back Vegas gate opened.

Another example, the final tier of defense upgrades will replace the billboard walls with ones similar to the gate from the Citadel in F3.

3) The more stores opening up, the more money rolls in, a.k.a. Profit!

[devinpatterson]

My best suggestion is for Yesman pledging himself to the new mayor of New Vegas, thus having a functional city police force without being a threat to the NCR. The PC could be that mayor, but it would be a figurehead position with a Deputy Mayor being the actual power behind the throne. This implies a fully annexed New Vegas is equal to any other city in the NCR.

 

Yeah, and it's very "iconic" of New Vegas, keeps the city's theme/flavor. We can throw in some good political humor;

Yesman: Mayor Yesman, I never would have imagined.

Player: Not so strange, some would argue all politicians are actually "Yesman"

 

or

 

Yesman: this collections of statutes, laws, foundations and constitions are so convoluted, twisted and contradictory it will take my data processing banks years to process.

Player:That's right Yesman, welcome to your first lesson in politics

 

But in the end it's the player that will choose the path. Work with Yesman or kill him based on what he/she wants to do.....we'll just put the options out there.

 

Truthfully, I see post-game New Vegas as a matter of consolidation. By the time I reached the end-game, I had decimated most of the Legion and fiends. If they were not marked as respawns, I would only have ghost towns to reclaim.......My idea involves turning New Vegas into the equivalent of a castle........1) You get a letter from President Kimball thanking you for all of your hard work and as a hero of the NCR

 

Yep, sounds like a good story line to pursue, but it goes back to teh point I was trying to make earlier. You don't want NV impregnable. If you do, you kill off a major portion of the story line...the ever present specter of the legion. Build it up, create more diversity, detail, population etc. All good, and a good story line to boot. But don't loose any of what makes FONV interesting....that power struggle. Kill off the fiends around the area, (no problem they'd just move further out for the spawns and avoid NV), clean up the criminals running rampant in freeside etc. All good, but don't remove NV from the Mojave's main story (battleground the two largest groups on hte western U.S.)

 

Remember this is only the end of the 2nd hoover dam battle, cass's slide states there will be another (ie a 3rd). So (I know belaboring the point), spruce up NV, even fortify it some, but don't make it impenetrable, because that just reduces the number of plots we have to work with and makes it a less rich mod.

 

Plus New Vegas is going to be a "hook" for a lot of cool storylines. As the NCR has annexed New Vegas they become responsible for it's protection. Already stretched dangerously thin across the Mojave it falls primarily on their spec ops agent/adviser a unique and extremely capable individual that "takes care of problems"....ie hte player. So one plot can be stopping a massive fiend attack when a new fiend leader unifies the junkies. Another could be a legion raiding party for slaves or just to weaken the NCR by drawing defenses from it's other military locations to protect the city. A third could be legion spies instigating a NCR underground resistance by framing the NCR for atrocities they commit. It just goes on and on in re: to possibilities.

 

But if NV is untouchable a lot of stories are lost.

 

That's the cool thing, your not just reaping the rewards of New Vegas your also serving your responsiblity and that can run into a lot of blood, sweat and tears. Same for hte NV independent ending.

Edited July 2, 2012 by devinpatterson

[darkus37]

I think we are operating from two different perspectives. I am referring to making this a post-endgame mod. Give people something to do when all is said and done that has real and visible consequences, i.e. your own city to restore. BTW, I checked the endings, but I didn't see to what you were referring to, only that in the best ending it is restored to it's former glory or left as a landmark to the defeat of the NCR. In any event, none of the endings refer to New Vegas which brings up the question, are you referring to the game or the city?

 

I based my idea on solving the problem of interfering with the side quests that are completed by the end-game. Yours would involve going around them. It is of course possible, but it seems unnecessarily complicated.

[devinpatterson]

I think we are operating from two different perspectives. I am referring to making this a post-endgame mod. Give people something to do when all is said and done that has real and visible consequences, i.e. your own city to restore.

 

Yeah, not too sure why you'd think that, I was pretty clear that this is a post hoover game mod. Remember how I stressed not interfering or altering the main quests, I didn't want to screw up anybodies main quest game?

 

BTW, I checked the endings, but I didn't see to what you were referring to,

 

That's weird it's easy to find right near the top under the Mr. House heading.;

"Mr. House's Securitron army took control of Hoover Dam and The Strip, pushing both the Legion and the exhausted NCR out of New Vegas. Mr. House continued to run New Vegas his way, a despotic vision of pre-War glory."

 

Evidence that the securitrons can make NV secure but not conquer the Mojave much less the NCR/Legion.

 

Or is there a different one you'r referring to specifically that I can address?

 

brings up the question, are you referring to the game or the city?

 

Always the city, when I refer to the game it will always be FONV.

 

I based my idea on solving the problem of interfering with the side quests that are completed by the end-game. Yours would involve going around them. It is of course possible, but it seems unnecessarily complicated.

 

No you can't do that because how those quests are completed determines what the game world is like. For example whether or not there will even be a Yesman, BOS, Khans etc.

 

No I don't go around any of them.....that's why I'v been saying depending on what the player has done. You should see that clearly in my references to Yesman, as an example. The players choices make his/her world unique compared to canon and the whole point is to build upon his/her choices.

Edited July 2, 2012 by devinpatterson

[darkus37]

Alright, so we're on the same page. Post-second battle of hoover dam is post-endgame. That's exactly why I'm saying that you don't have to limit yourself any further to the main or side quests. There is no game-breaking, this is a continuation. Heck, you can build an impenetrable fortress, or just burn the damn thing and everyone in it down. This is basically the Broken Steel to Fallout 3.

 

I interpreted Mr. House's ending in that he didn't want or need to leave New Vegas. He had a stable power supply at the Hoover Dam and the perfect city-state to run his way in New Vegas. Everything else in ancillary. Once you are outside his city border, you're on your own. Not because he couldn't do something about it, he just doesn't feel the benefit outweighs the risks. I mean think about it, everything he has done has been to support New Vegas - tribes were converted to provide thinking man power; Hoover Dam was given to the NCR for them to provide security; the same accord, allowed him to keep control of New Vegas through his securitron guards but as soon as the NCR was no longer needed, bye-bye.

 

Don't forget, this isn't the independent New Vegas thread, this is the NCR New Vegas thread. I'm pretty sure the NCR would take steps to cement their position once manpower was freed up from fighting the Legion.

[devinpatterson]

Heck, you can build an impenetrable fortress, or just burn the damn thing and everyone in it down. This is basically the Broken Steel to Fallout 3.

 

Or you can go with teh lore and extend the world already in play, fallout is after all, about lore.

 

I interpreted Mr. House's ending in that he didn't want or need to leave New Vegas.

 

That's fine, but don't you see your contradicting your previous statements. You claim absolute power corrupts absolutely in re: to the senate, Kimball, Oliver etc people that run one of the largst factions in North America. Then claim it doesn't with House, because he's happy enough with just NV (which is just a single city).

 

I'm pretty sure the NCR would take steps to cement their position once manpower was freed up from fighting the Legion.

 

Right, and I'm saying that making NV impenetrable means you loose a lot of plot lines not to mention the NCR is stretched incredibly thin. Do you see any bases that you would consider impenetrable or even close to it? McCarran is supposed to be their primary military center and you can see what it packs.

 

That doesn't change due to Hoover, nor are the Legion neutralized, they are huge just like the NCR and extend all over the 4 corners states (possibly further).

Edited July 2, 2012 by devinpatterson

[darkus37]

I think we're arguing in circles here over nothing. Nothing I'm suggesting affects the game lore. At least I don't think it does...

 

I've also said previously that the Courier, Mr. House, and Yes Man are probably the only people who would not be affected by absolute power, with the Courier's actions being up to you, and who knows what Yes Man will do. You've already said yourself, the securitron army is probably several hundred strong at most and therefore will be able to hold New Vegas and the Hoover Dam. With the NCR going to lick it's chops and the legion losing it's commanding officers, he wouldn't need to advance beyond his borders, especially since eventually the NCR would come back to try again.

 

Alright, let's say New Vegas is built up like I suggested, and is impenetrable. How about a Khan terror group infiltrates the city and attack from within? How about a new raider group begins attacking the caravans from the city? How about an enclave raid? These are all threats the NCR has faced. As for the plotlines you have mentioned before, you don't think they can be incorporated into the buildup?

 

One last thing: the reason McCarran is the way it is, is because the NCR took over as it was, filling in the holes in the walls while under possible attack by the Legion. You don't have those limitations. You are the courier, and you have accomplished incredible things. You can surely put some thought into rebuilding a city to be better than it was Pre-War.

Edited July 2, 2012 by darkus37

[devinpatterson]

I think we're arguing in circles here over nothing. Nothing I'm suggesting affects the game lore. At least I don't think it does...

 

Yep definitely burning creative capital for very little purpose. Really the only reason I keep engaging is twofold, 1. I want you or anyone that responds to the thread to have their ideas considered and not summarily dismissed out of hand. I don't want anyone to think their suggestions aren't important.

 

and 2. has to do with lore. FO3 & FONV have a few things going for it; the modding community, a good combo FPS/RPG hybrid and it's lore. That lore really ties it together, that's why I'm working so hard to stick to as accurate an ending and story lines as the original game. I'm not trying to create something in a vacuum but rather strengthen what is already there. It's why so many of the plots I mention are tied to the players past decisions....I want this mod to be a seamless transition from the main quest.

 

I've also said previously that the Courier, Mr. House, and Yes Man are probably the only people who would not be affected by absolute power

 

Right, but stating it and having a rationale for it are two totally different things. You havn't made a single point why House could handle this power, but the president of the NCR (which is overwhelmingly larger) couldn't, instead you'v just stated that it is the case.

 

Alright, let's say New Vegas is built up like I suggested,

 

Actually this one is really easy to draw a parallel to. Do you play on god mode? I don't because it's no fun being invulnerable, there is no challenge to it. Nor would I want NV impenetrable. That's not a fun game.

 

I think that what this really boils down to is.......you have a mod that you'd like to feature an impenetrable NV as the focus and I have a mod that I'd like to see focus on the main quest's continuation. They are simply two different mods. What I would recommend you do is start another thread (or add to your previous thread that you said you had up) and expand upon your impenetrable NV and if I have any ideas for that one I'll contribute to it and vice versa. That way both themes are covered and ideas are being generated for both mods.

Edited July 3, 2012 by devinpatterson

[darkus37]

The only thing I can think of that proves my theory is that Mr. House is a control freak. He cannot control large amounts of territory simply because he has to micro-manage everything.

Yes Man cannot be quantified because the endings don't really expand on what happens afterwards. Things stay the same I guess since Yes Man has no imagination.

The NCR reaches to far, too fast without thinking things through. I based my theory on a lot of things, but mostly that whenever people get control of something very powerful, it's hard not to use it. And if you have a hammer, everything begins to looks like a nail. As soon as they had the manpower, they spread across the wasteland, gobbling up other communities - for good or ill. The securitrons would be a potent weapon that would most likely be given control of to the NCR president, like in the U.S. with drones. I sincerely doubt it would end well for his political opponents. From the wikia: "Kimball's personality is accurately summarized by the term "war hawk". Supported by Colonel Cassandra Moore and General Lee Oliver, President Kimball firmly believes in expanding the NCR and bringing new territories into the fold by any means necessary, be it Hoover Dam or Baja."

As for the courier, that depends on how you play. For ex, I rejected the use of Archimedes II 1) because I didn't need another weapons 2) because more people would be helped by diverting the power to the Mojave.

 

But your right - I concede the argument. I cannot give you lore-based facts that will prove me correct as A) it's been a while since I've gone through the main quests and B) the wikia is only a summary. Let's just say that this is the impression I have and move forward.

 

Impenetrable is in the eye of the beholder. Anything can be conquered, destroyed, overtaken. What I was suggesting is after putting in several hours of quests, the payoff would be a city that would withstand the test of time, a Camelot. I'm not saying you can't have raider attacks or other stuff happen. Which leads me to ask, what is the difference between what I am suggesting and McCarran or the current state of the strip? Most of the changes would be cosmetic in nature, with some added snipers and patrols, say an extra 10-15 npcs.

 

As for the continuation of the main quest, there's really not much else to do except to conquer or control the other factions. Getting rid of the raiders and Legion, making new outposts in all the small towns, adding patrols going from town to town. But that's not very story oriented. I'll have to think about it. Truthfully, I was curious as to why they didn't make the DLC be post-endgame as it would make a lot of sense as the finale.

[devinpatterson]

The only thing I can think of that proves my theory is that Mr. House is a control freak. ............ Let's just say that this is the impression I have and move forward.

 

Nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree.

 

Plus the point is kind of moot, since the securitron army is certainly a force to be reckoned with (more so the 2.0's), but not so powerful as to change the balance of power on the west coast. But still a potent military force. And it's not a problem if you want to bump it up to 200, I just don't want to increase them to 100's or 1000's. We don't want a calculator story line going on here or changing the balance of power for the NCR so much that the legion is no longer a threat.

 

If they are used by the NCR (depending on player actions) I think it's best to have them follow the outcast model (a bot or two with a patrol).

 

Impenetrable is in the eye of the beholder.......Which leads me to ask, what is the difference between what I am suggesting and McCarran or the current state of the strip? Most of the changes would be cosmetic in nature, with some added snipers and patrols, say an extra 10-15 npcs.

 

Absolutely, something on par with McCarran is what I had in mind, give or take. I just don't want something an order of magnitude greater because it will preclude some story lines. And not to worry we will have additional NCR personal (perhaps even patrolling in tandam with securitrons depending on the choices the player makes, also applies to hoover) in NV.

 

As for the continuation of the main quest, there's really not much else to do except to conquer or control the other factions.......I'll have to think about it. Truthfully, I was curious as to why they didn't make the DLC be post-endgame as it would make a lot of sense as the finale.

 

Actually I think we can come up with intriguing extensions of the storyline (legion especially) as well as unique plots that will result in compelling mod. I'm going to do some research and see what's assumed to have happened after hoover (canon) as example ideas. I think there is probably other info besides the ending slides.

Edited July 3, 2012 by devinpatterson