Need help troubleshooting Expanded Towns and Villages

[Lederberg]

As per my post on the official thread for missjennabee's awesome mod, I am having trouble with crashes when installing the latest version of the Expanded Towns and Villages mod. I have the 3.0 version three of the towns (Riverwood, Ivarstead, and Darkwater Crossing) installed and playing nicely, but every attempt to upgrade to a higher version so I can add Dragon Bridge (and ultimately Rorikstead when it is ready) leads to an unrecoverable freeze or a CTD when I leave my safe, interior space. I have moved the mod around in my load order, and looked for potential conflicting mods, but to no avail. I am particulalry puzzled that an older version of the mod works fine but the latest version is causing me issues.

 

My current load order is as follows (some are personally created, so feel free to ask questions):

 

Update.esm

CLARALUX - More and Brighter Lights.esm

JSwords.esm

ApachiiHair.esm

DSpSoB.esm

Conan.esm

Expanded Towns - RESOURCES.esm

lydia chair fix.esp

SoS - The Dungeons.esp

SoS - The Wilds.esp

SoS - Civilization.esp

Realistic Lighting.esp

Realistic Lighting Patcher.esp

enhancedlightingforrealisticlighting.esp

Natural Skyrim Rain.esp

Arrowsmith.esp

Birds.esp

Birdsofskyrim.esp

Catsofskyrim.esp

Chesko_WearableLantern.esp

Convenient Horses.esp

dD - Enhanced Blood Main.esp

dD-Reduced Splatter Size.esp

dD-Reduced Wound Size.esp

Dogsofskyrim.esp

Dr_Bandolier.esp

dragonsoulstoperks.esp

hqsnow.esp

ktxcompleteskyforge.esp

Long lost smelters.esp

lt_camping.esp

MoreVillageAnimals.esp

SabreFurBag.esp

ScenicCarriages.esp

ValsCraftingMeltdownAlpha.esp

xgfPferdeKarren-en.esp

Auto Unequip Arrows.esp

BattleFlute.esp

bobsarmory.esp

brutal armor.esp

1nivWICCloaksCRAFT.esp

ConanSwords.esp

Craftable Triss armor.esp

CraftableHoods.esp

CrainteVomir.esp

Divine Aegis.esp

Divine Aegis Sword.esp

Earrings Set1.esp

Northborn Fur Hoods.esp

geralt_ravenarmor_v02b.esp

Guild Duelist Armor.esp

gun.esp

HentaisJamellaArmor.esp

hunterarmor.esp

LFArmors.esp

Nicos Raven Swords.esp

nomo1.esp

Prometheus_ConanOutfits.esp

R18Pn - Leere Armor.esp

R18Pn - Eisen Platte Armor.esp

RangerArmor.esp

ScoiataelBow.esp

ScoutArmor.esp

StandalonePack20.esp

TH3WICK3D1-BlueStripesEliteArmor.esp

TH3WICK3D1-GeraltSeltkirkArmor.esp

WeaponsOf3E.esp

EMHighviewCottage.esp

Orlong's Hearth vdot9.esp

RiversideLodge.esp

The Paarthurnax Dilemma.esp

Whiterun Ferns.esp

Better Dynamic Snow.esp

BetterQuestObjectives.esp

dD-No Screen Blood.esp

dynamic fires.esp

knc_resilient_dragons.esp

Lawren RNG Guards.esp

Nightingale Maskless.esp

RichMerchants_Less.esp

Expanded Towns - Riverwood.esp

Expanded Towns - Ivarstead.esp

Expanded Towns - Darkwater.esp

dD - Realistic Ragdoll Force - Reduced.esp

PowerMasterTheTimeAndSpace.esp

dovahkiinrelax.esp

SeeYouSleepByMadmole.esp

Teleport.esp

MageArmor.esp

UFO - Ultimate Follower Overhaul.esp

Reduced Distance NPC Greetings.esp

saadia.esp

zzz_Jenassa_MAKEOVER_by83Willow.esp

Follower Trap Safety.esp

Spousetocustomhome.esp

WATER - Get Wet.esp

Blacksmithforge water fix.esp

Bashed Patch, 0.esp

MjollDress.esp

Breezehome Enchanting Table.esp

LydiaRedux.esp

AerinRestrainingOrder.esp

Conan.esp

ConanHorse.esp

MjollHorseNoDefaultArmor.esp

LederbergMageArmor.esp

Sunnie_NG_Set.esp

Wanderers Robes - Armour.esp

lydiatweaks.esp

Ebony Mage Armor.esp

VanillaRaces - English.esp

Reality Check.esp

UniqueHorses.esp

AnoukArmor.esp

FaendalRedux.esp

Craftable Thieves Guild Armor.esp

sneAAAKhaleesi.esp

Cloaks PC Only.esp

 

 

My PC specs are a little older but pretty up to snuff:

Core2Duo E8400 3.00 GHz

4 GB Ram

GTX 560 Ti

Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit

 

I appreciate any feedback or tips. Thanks!

[Lederberg]

I have now successfully installed the modular 3.2 versions of Riverwood, Ivarstead, and Darkwater Crossing without any crash issues. I will next attempt adding the modular Dragon Bridge and see if things remain stable.

[Lederberg]

Okay... for better or for worse I have confirmed what I suspected. As soon as I added Dragon Bridge, my clean saved game became borked. When I attempted to exit the interior space where I had saved, the game immediately CTD'd.

[missjennabee]

First off, your PC is fine. Which I'm sure you knew, but figured I would throw that out there.

 

This mod is unfortunately really ornery about load order. What you've got up there looks decent enough... but I might trying throwing the town files right after "lydia chair fix.esp" some of the other mods above it, while maybe not immediately obvious, do share some space with things in the town mod. Honestly nothing that looks like it would be an issue, but I've had success with the towns be high high high up on the list (really the only things I have above it are the "fix" type mods and "Alternate Start - Live Another Life" and THAT one is only up there because it refuses to play nice otherwise).

 

It does look like you are running the old version, which I believe your comment mentioned. The Dragon Bridge update also included the first non-modular version of this mod, so there were a whole ton of changes made to the .esm file including the addition of all the bakery resources. It was also renamed. I'm not sure what your install process was, but on this list the old .esm is still lingering out there. Be sure that that's gone before updating to the new version.

 

I actually keep meaning to put up an article about this whole load order - CTD issue as via the comments thread I've managed to get a whole well of information on the subject, but I keep getting distracted by Rorikstead lol.

 

EDIT: Someone else had a similar problem, they were able to install 3 of the towns no problem, but as soon as they added a fourth it all went upside. In HIS case the issue turned out to be too many texture files. It takes a whole LOT of textures for this to be an issue, but because it's hardly ever thought of otherwise (even by me) I figured I'd throw that out there as well.

 

Brandy, who is on a one woman mission to solve all the worlds mod problems, will likely be by later :biggrin: If you are unable to get it working, let me know and I'll see what I can do.

[Lederberg]

@mjb

 

Thanks for the reply! I tried re-arranging the load order as per your suggestion, but still no love. Also I am pretty certain the old esm was completely removed before I attempted to activate the upgraded versions... as since posting my load order I have gotten Riverwood, Ivarstead, and Darkwater 3.2 all working fine in their standalone forms.

 

Your comments do raise some questions for me about my install process however. Does the modular version of Dragon Bridge have a different esm packed with it than the one included with each of the 3.2 versions of the other towns? I am installing via Wrye Bash and added Riverwood, Ivarstead, and Darkwater Crossing first and ensured that they worked in game before attempting to add Dragon Bridge. Wrye didn't ask about overwriting the esm when I installed Dragon Bridge, but it does show the install icon as being yellow in comparison to the other three towns which are green. It seems that Wrye Bash is trying to tell me something here, but sadly I am not well-versed enough in the color code indicators of Wrye Bash to know what that message is. *sigh*

 

If I should be adding the modular towns in a different order let me know. I could also try manually overwriting the esm with the one packaged with Dragon Bridge.

[Lederberg]

*UPDATE*

 

After installing all four modular versions of the towns and playing with activating them one at a time and in various combinations, I am forced to accept a hard reality. Read on for the sad details...

 

While all towns work fine in my game on their own, and in various combinations with one another, under no circumstances will my game put up with having all four towns active at the same time. I have pretty much eliminated a conflict with another mod as the cause of my CTDs, as each standalone town works independently within my game. And, since I have put all the towns at the top of my load order, it is also unlikely that my issues are load order related. And so now I must consider the possibility that my crashes are due to having reached a critical mass of mods installed in my game *insert dramatic sigh and accompanying pouty face here* As missjennabee suggested, this is possibly due to having too many textures added by my extensive list of mods, and so now I must look over my load list and look for other texture intensive mods that I might consider to be expendable. I have one or two in mind... and I am certainly open to suggestions as to what I might eliminate. Hopefully that will begin to help me get to the root of my issues. I will update accordingly.

 

Thanks again for the help!

[Brandy1123]

Hi , oh whats this? A mod loading/conflict issue. You mean this kind of thing still happens?

 

i looked really fast at your loaded mods.;

 

Village animals makes changes to Dragon bridge. See if that one is part of the problem with mod conflicts.

 

Scenic carriage might be an issue also. It appears to go right through part of the area at dragon bridge

 

Lawrens guards will conflict with script changes on existing gaurds. I'm not sure about this one, but a quick disable/load will tell you

 

Sounds of Skyrim mods have been pulled by the author. They are known to cause bad saves and corruption. Since that is a mod known to cause issues, I definately say to at least disable it for the time being. IF the solution is found elsewhere, then re-enable it.

 

Don't rely on BASH for its patches. Its not been updated and is known to cause issues with what it believes is best for you. Use it as a guide only

 

On a side note, did you activate these while you were in the region of the Bridge? If so, it will surely cause you to crash. If so, for the future, NEVER activate a mod while in the same cell or vacinity as it is.

Edited July 22, 2012 by Brandy_123

[Lederberg]

*UPDATE Part 2*

 

*Even bigger sigh* After going through my mod list and doing a long overdue culling and cleaning I again went into my game with all four towns installed and once again CTD as soon as I exited the interior space where I had saved. I returned once more to Wrye Bash and with great reluctance unchecked the esp for one of my all time favourite player homes... Orlong's Hearth. I went back into game with all towns active and viola... I was now able to exit into exterior space with no crash. While I am not using Orlong's for my current favourite character (who prefers Riverside Lodge :) ), I have an ongoing game with another toon (that I do plan to return to) in which I have extensively moved into that home. I really do not wish to cut it from my game. Alas... I will keep attempting other options to see if i can come up with an alternative.

 

Thanks for the suggestions Brandy! I will look at those next, though I am no longer implicating Dragon Bridge as the chief cause of my woes ;) due to its ability to be installed on its own (took a big ol' walk through mjb's reimagined Dragon Bridge earlier :) ) and in combination with any 2 of the other (but NOT 3) towns. Silly Skyrim. I wonder if the Orlong's Hearth conflict I observed above has to do with too many scripts running as opposed to too many textures. Orlong's has a fair number of automatic item sorters included with it. I will play with that possibility and even see if i can't create a reduced-script mod of that home for myself, as the author sadly appears to have abandoned it.

[Brandy1123]

I was looking at your processor, the 2 core E8400. If you by chance have that overclocked, tick it back a few cycles. You are running quite a few increased resolution mods, not necessarily HD quality, but improvments on vanilla wireframe. If you are overclocking that 560ti, its probably not netting you what you think with that processor. Overclocking is a bad thing. Few people do it correctly with latency, front side bus, AGP speeds, heat with increased freq's and power consumption. Not to mention heat dissapation and fluid (air/liquid) flow.

 

Here's something you can try... Enable papyrus logging for the crash.

 

add or enter the following to your SkyrimCustom.ini (create it if you don't already have it). Path should be : My Documents/My Games/Skyrim

 

After a CTD. check the log file at : My Documents\My Games\Skyrim\Logs\Script

 

I heard some people say it doesn't show up. If thats the case, launch the game again, it will be there. See what the last entry is. More then likely, that's your culprit (at least for that present crash). This hunt and peck can become really bothersome (especially when you're reading a book to an 8 year old). OK, I'm out for a while. good luck, i'll be back to see if you found anything else.

Edited July 22, 2012 by Brandy_123

[missjennabee]

And while you're off doing that I will download and check out Orlong's Hearth to see if there is any conflict :thumbsup:

 

Although from the sounds of it... I'm not really leaning in that direction, based off the description, if it was going to conflict with anything it should probably conflict with Riverwood alone... it's unlikely that there would be a conflict towards any and all of the mods but only when all four are loaded together irregardless of what the 4th mod is.

 

I don't really want to be the barer of bad news, but it sounds awfully similar to a memory related crash. These are BIG mods, unfortunately. It could be between the mods and the textures the 4th is just putting you over the limit...

 

If that is the case I think I've still got a couple links lying around that had been provided by others as a way to trim things down without having to eliminate much.

 

Will stick check out Orlong's Hearth though. Ya never know!

 

We shall reconvene shortly.

 

UPDATE: So I did that. I ran Orlong's Hearth with all 4 (technically 5 towns, half built Rorikstead was also active) and no issues. Checked it out in the CK no obvious source of conflict... :confused: