[LE] Mod overwriting each other question

[funkmonster]

Let's say I have 2 separate skills mods (that mod different skills/perks unrelated to each other) and all the unofficial Skyrim patches, and load order is as below:

 

Skyrim

Update

DLCs

Unofficial Skyrim Patches

Unofficial DLC Patches

Skill Mod 1

Skill Mod 2

 

What's to stop Skill Mod 2 from overwriting Skill Mod 1; and Skill Mod 1 from overwriting the skill fixes in the patches, which are supposed to overwrite the vanilla Skyrim bugged skills?

 

The reason I ask this is because when I open up say, Stealth Skills Rebalanced by kryptonyr, it contains the whole skill tree for all 18 skills, with some Sneak skills changed, but Magic skills are not changed. But doesn't the mod contain information for all 18 skill trees? Why doesn't it overwrite Better Magic, which I placed before Stealth Skills Rebalanced in the load order?

 

I'm asking this question because I'd like to make a mod that makes additional changes to some perks, but I'm only loading Skyrim.esm and Update.esm to make this mod. But I don't want this mod to accidentally overwrite the USLEEP fixes since it will be placed after USLEEP.

 

I don't even know where to begin to look up this issue and I've been modding - and learning how to mod - for about a week in my spare time now. Most tutorials jump straight into animation and dungeon making, I can't seem to find tutorials for "simple modding" where they simply explain what Value means, or whatever. (This is just an example, I know Value = 1 means true, and Value = 0 means false; but some Values have 4, which makes me assume things but I'd rather clarify it than just assume.)

[thumbincubation]

I'm not 100% certain I follow the question, but if it's what I think, you're wondering why mods don't overwrite the ones before them, even with information that hasn't been changed from vanilla? (ie: you make one mod that changes an iron dagger to a 'shiny iron dagger,' and why doesn't the next mod turn it back into an iron dagger?) It might, if there was an ITM in the second mod, in which someone opened the iron dagger and either closed it without a change, or made a change then changed it back. At that point, of the two iron daggers, the latest loading would win. If the mod author of the 2nd mod never touched the iron dagger, though, it isn't considered a part of the mod. If, instead, the 2nd mod author changed the iron sword to a 'dull iron sword,' but made no change to the iron dagger, you would have a 'shiny iron dagger' and a 'dull iron sword' available in game, whether it be by console command or included recipes, leveled lists (a whole new opportunity for conflicts), etc.

 

If I misinterpreted the question, please disregard this.

[DarkRudra]

 

The reason I ask this is because when I open up say, Stealth Skills Rebalanced by kryptonyr, it contains the whole skill tree for all 18 skills, with some Sneak skills changed, but Magic skills are not changed. But doesn't the mod contain information for all 18 skill trees? Why doesn't it overwrite Better Magic, which I placed before Stealth Skills Rebalanced in the load order?

 

Stealth Skills Rebalanced does not have information for all 18 skill trees. It touches the Sneak, Pickpocket, and Lockpicking trees and one perk each in Light and Heavy Armor. It has nothing to do with the magic skill trees at all, so it has no need to contain information for those. Mods that are well designed will contain only the information they really need to function.

 

 

(This is just an example, I know Value = 1 means true, and Value = 0 means false; but some Values have 4, which makes me assume things but I'd rather clarify it than just assume.)

It depends on the type of field storing the value and how it is used. For example, if it's an integer or float field, then Value = 4 would be the number 4. If it is a string or text field, then Value = 4 would be the text "4". If it's a flags field, then Value = 4 means something else altogether that is specific to the field.

[masternoxx]

Mods do overwrite the ones before them but only if it changes the exact same variable and value. And there are multiple ways to accomplish similar things in the CK

 

In fact modOrganizer will tell you exactly the files that are being overwritten, there is a plus when it overwrites and a minus when something from that mod is overwritten by the next ones in order. I believe you double click on the mod and there is and overwrite tab.

Edited February 8, 2019 by masternoxx

[funkmonster]

I'm not 100% certain I follow the question, but if it's what I think, you're wondering why mods don't overwrite the ones before them, even with information that hasn't been changed from vanilla? (ie: you make one mod that changes an iron dagger to a 'shiny iron dagger,' and why doesn't the next mod turn it back into an iron dagger?) It might, if there was an ITM in the second mod, in which someone opened the iron dagger and either closed it without a change, or made a change then changed it back. At that point, of the two iron daggers, the latest loading would win. If the mod author of the 2nd mod never touched the iron dagger, though, it isn't considered a part of the mod. If, instead, the 2nd mod author changed the iron sword to a 'dull iron sword,' but made no change to the iron dagger, you would have a 'shiny iron dagger' and a 'dull iron sword' available in game, whether it be by console command or included recipes, leveled lists (a whole new opportunity for conflicts), etc.

 

If I misinterpreted the question, please disregard this.

 

No you didn't misinterpret the question, instead you gave me exactly what I needed to know. (And others as well, thank you!)

 

I was afraid that if USLEEP fixed the "iron dagger bug" (using your example), but then my mod, which doesn't affect iron dagger at all, overwrites USLEEP and reverts the dagger back to the vanilla bugged version.

 

I guess I'll have to use CK to open up USLEEP and see what changes have been made to the skills I'm trying to change... Because one of these skills is "Tower of Strength", which UESP claims to be bugged in vanilla but fixed in unofficial patches.

[funkmonster]

 

 

 

(This is just an example, I know Value = 1 means true, and Value = 0 means false; but some Values have 4, which makes me assume things but I'd rather clarify it than just assume.)

It depends on the type of field storing the value and how it is used. For example, if it's an integer or float field, then Value = 4 would be the number 4. If it is a string or text field, then Value = 4 would be the text "4". If it's a flags field, then Value = 4 means something else altogether that is specific to the field.

 

 

Is there a tutorial or something that tells me which field it might be? For example:

 

WornApparelHasKeywordCount Keyword: 'ArmorMaterialDaedric' == 4.00 OR

 

Since this is for Matching Set perk in Heavy Armor skill tree, I'm guessing the value (4.00) means four pieces of heavy armor made from Daedric material. And the "OR" means that any other conditions aside from the one above can also trigger the Matching Set perk. I suppose the value here belongs to integer field?

 

But something like:

 

WornHasKeyword Keyword: 'ArmorLight' == 0.00 AND

WordHasKeyword Keyword: 'ArmorHeavy' == 1.00 AND

 

I take it that this one is flags field?

 

The only question here is how do I safely know which value belongs to which field without trying to guess what they actually mean? Because if the value 4.00 does not actually mean four pieces of armor, but means category 4 or something with its own information that I know nothing about, then I'm screwed...

 

I looked everywhere for guides on these things but aside from random videos on Youtube, I found no help at all. Even the Bethesda CK Wiki doesn't seem to say much, or I'm looking in the wrong places or searching wrong keywords.