Megaton crater

[Ferodaktyl]

i've been playing the game since it was released, but just now i've started to wonder : what has made that crater where Megaton is built if the bomb didn't explode?

I doubt there was another bomb, or the radiation would have been higher, and the crater is too large for just a simple impact.

So, any ideas?

[TheStrictNein]

One bomb hit the ground, created the crater (Yes, one bomb did explode at this location) The bomb in the centre failed to explode. Radiation level is down because it was a very low yield bomb, and I believe around 100 years had passed before the site was inhabited.

[7thsealord]

A couple of thoughts. One never knows, maybe someone will take these ideas and use them to work up an awesome mod. ;)

 

First, do we know for certain that the crater itself WAS made by a bomb?

 

I fully agree it is very probable, given all the stuff being thrown around during the War. But, 'The Lore' (as far as I can tell) never actually states this outright - it has always been something that people in-game and out of it have speculated about. A case could be made that there was something else there that happened to go BOOM! in a big way around the time of the War (a military base, a Mad Scientist lab, a nuclear power plant - or combinations thereof maybe?), and the bomb we all now and love arrived in the aftermath.

 

For that matter, if the crater was caused by bombing (and assuming the bombs were on-target), what was there beforehand?

Edited August 16, 2012 by 7thsealord

[oblivious12123]

Perhaps Chinese spies got hold of Vault 101's approximate location and bombs were dropped on the area where they thought it would be? Who knows, maybe Vault 101 actually does run under that location (That would explain why raiders appear to be digging into Vault 101 from a ridiculous distance away from it)?

[channel0]

I agree it's food for thought, and a great idea for a mod :thumbsup:

[BlackRampage]

First, do we know for certain that the crater itself WAS made by a bomb?

Why not? Dropping an object that big and heavy from low orbit can create one hell of a crater. Even if it was dropped from a bomber flying at an altitude of, let's say 5 kilometers, it would still create quite a crater.

If the bomb would have it's own propulsion system (doesn't looks like it though) the crater would likely be even bigger.

 

For that matter, if the crater was caused by bombing (and assuming the bombs were on-target), what was there beforehand?

Personally I think bombs like the one in Megaton weren't exactly meant for precision bombardments at all. In the real world, bombs with that shape were and are usually used for carpet- type bombardments.

The bomb in the middle of Megaton is likely just a single bomb from a carpet bombardment which didn't detonate when it should have.

 

So, if it is indeed a remnant of a carpet-bombardment, why aren't there any other impact craters in it's immediate vicinity?

 

Most likely cause: Because all those bombs likely had sensors which would trigger a detonation right before the bombs hit the ground. Detonating a bomb right before it hits the ground causes significantly more damage.

The atom bombs that were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, for example, also had sensors which caused the bombs to detonate before they hit the ground, so it's not like the idea is far-fetched either.

[Ferodaktyl]

I stumbled upon another theory while reading a fanfic. The bomb was carried inside a plane and the plane felt, making the crater.

Subsequently it was that particular plane that was stripped for the parts used in constructing Megaton, and the bomb was what left.

Although it's still a huge crater...

[BlackRampage]

A fanfic is just a fanfic though. In-game (and thus in-lore), Manya Vargas explains that they constructed their homes using aircraft parts from a nearby airfield.

 

On that note: It might very well be that the bomb inside the crater was originally intended for that airfield.

[7thsealord]

First, do we know for certain that the crater itself WAS made by a bomb?

Why not? Dropping an object that big and heavy from low orbit can create one hell of a crater. Even if it was dropped from a bomber flying at an altitude of, let's say 5 kilometers, it would still create quite a crater.

If the bomb would have it's own propulsion system (doesn't looks like it though) the crater would likely be even bigger.

 

Yeah, well, as was said, I was not disputing that bombs caused the mess we see. Merely speculating on other possibilities.

 

But, given your above speculation, I question if a manmade object that was (a) as big heavy and complex as a nuke, and (b) dropped at reentry velocity; would remain usable or even recognizable after a hard landing. On this basis, I suspect the Megaton Bomb did NOT arrive in the manner you describe. Even a simple airdop at a comparitibely low altitude should have done nasty things to the object being dropped, but the exterior looks pretty much intact.

 

Which does raise questions of how the Megaton Bomb got there? It's a big BIG bomb, so maybe it was parachuted down from a bomber (as was done with the Hiroshima and Nagasaki attacks) and intended to explode in mid-air (like the aforementioned). Given its bulk in an era of some VERY high tech, one could infer that it was an especially powerful weapon - maybe a proper "city-killer" intended to turn DC into a super-sized crater.

 

Another possibility to consider is that the Bomb was NOT dropped. Either it was on the ground already (being housed or transported someplace, maybe) or the airraft carrying the weapon belly-landed without actually dropping it. Pure speculation at this point, nothing more.

 

So why (if one takes the "Evil" option for 'Power Of The Atom'), did this bomb "only" take out Megaton. Because, by rights, it should not have worked even a little. Nukes need a lot of maintenance even if just sitting on a shelf somewhere, and this one had been sitting in a puddle for over a century. The end result was a squib, a partial detonation at best. If the detonation had been The Real Deal, the audience at Tenpenny Tower would have gotten a bloody sight more than a lightshow.

 

For that matter, if the crater was caused by bombing (and assuming the bombs were on-target), what was there beforehand?

Personally I think bombs like the one in Megaton weren't exactly meant for precision bombardments at all. In the real world, bombs with that shape were and are usually used for carpet- type bombardments.

The bomb in the middle of Megaton is likely just a single bomb from a carpet bombardment which didn't detonate when it should have.

 

So, if it is indeed a remnant of a carpet-bombardment, why aren't there any other impact craters in it's immediate vicinity?

 

Most likely cause: Because all those bombs likely had sensors which would trigger a detonation right before the bombs hit the ground. Detonating a bomb right before it hits the ground causes significantly more damage.

The atom bombs that were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, for example, also had sensors which caused the bombs to detonate before they hit the ground, so it's not like the idea is far-fetched either.

 

These days, when we think "precision" weapons, we think of UAVs taking out terrorist HQs with a single missile, or of smart bombs taking out fortified buildings via a skylight or whatever. Nukes, by basic definition, have never been in this class. A "precise" nuclear strike means that the target lies somewhere within the detonating nuke's optimum area of destruction. Just how big that area might be depends largely on the accuracy of the targeting, the yield of the nuke and the toughness of the target.

 

Taking out (for example) something "soft" like an urban centre, one can probably get away with a relatively small nuke or two that don't necessarily have to be that accurate or powerful to have the desired effect. Taking out a hardened target (such as a missile silo or a Vault) probably requires something a lot bigger and targeted a lot closer. If one isn't 100% certain where this hardened target is (or just to allow for the chance that the intel and/or the actual targeting may be a tad "off"), one may go for several overlapping strikes in that area. Which is not carpet-bombing in the proper sense of the word ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpet_bombing ).

 

An awful lot of downtown DC, (surely the centre of any serious carpet bombing effort, if it was ever undertaken), is remarkably intact. Sure, several individual targets (such as the White House) are completely gone, but other targets (the Capitol Building, the Pentagon, much of the subway, etc.) are remarkably intact. If there was proper carpet-bombing going on, one would have expected those places to be among the first to go.

 

Under the circumstances, I think it more likely that the majority of nukes to hit DC were intended for very specific targets. As well as the obvious military, industrial and technological targets; the attack would have gone for population centres, government facilities, communications / transportation foci, and so forth. This was intended to not just smash structures, but also wreck any chance to recover and rebuild. Lots of targets to go around, and every nuke would have been intended for a specific target or set of targets, rather than possibly being wasted on areas of little or no importance.

 

As I speculated on another thread, we don't know how effective the DC defenses were (or even if they somehow made things worse!). We also don't know just how many incoming missiles and bombers were fratricided or thrown off target by prior detonations. I'm guessing a very large percentage of the attack was lost this way, given that certain extremely obvious targets (the Pentagon, for one) remain recognizable.

Edited August 18, 2012 by 7thsealord

[7thsealord]

Perhaps Chinese spies got hold of Vault 101's approximate location and bombs were dropped on the area where they thought it would be? Who knows, maybe Vault 101 actually does run under that location (That would explain why raiders appear to be digging into Vault 101 from a ridiculous distance away from it)?

 

Interesting point, which got me to thinking. Maybe they were trying for ONE of a number of accessways to that Vault.

 

Why would these Vaults have only ONE means of access? If there was a direct hit on that doorway (as happened in at least one instance), or if the tunnel merely collapsed for any of several dozen other reasons, or if the door mechanism simply broke down, then entering/leaving that Vault became more than a little difficult.

 

Surely it would make sense to maintain at least a couple of completely separate entryways for each Vault.