tetradite Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 To tell the truth, there are lots of bandits in Skyrim, more than civilized citizen. I think, for some weeks I killed people more, than live in whole Tamriel ( I'm not a cruel man, I just carry out mission). To establish balance we should download 10-20 NPC mods and occupy uninhabited regions of Skyrim. It's a shame so many adding population mods need to be so large...or that's exactly what i would be doing. I'm not sure what you mean by "large", but I'm in progress with something that may address this to some extent, gonna take a while though :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worldofscotty Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 (edited) The game labels them for you, so you know exactly what your dealing with....my Dovahkin has come across plenty of Hunters, often trades with them, has never killed any of them....As for displaced individuals due to Civil War or other disastrous events, refugees exist in Skyrim...though their usually dead when you find them....but to be a bandit you already need to have acquired the level of fitness necessary for such a life and considering that level of fitness they could just as successfully hunt and trade/barter (adding to the failing economy and food stores) to keep up a comfortable lifestyle, rather than accosting and brutalizing/murdering travelers to steal their valuables. ...Bandits are not innocent, they prey on the weakness of others. If we are talking in a literal sense then yes you are right. When you say things like 'the game labels them for you' I assume we are talking about different things. Obviously for the simplistic game approach of good and evil they are obviously evil, placed there for you to kill. I'm taking a more RP approach to this and getting a little deeper into the mentality as if the game were real and whether if under real life circumstances this society was in fact doomed to fail; which I don't believe it is. In many cases you never see a bandit brutalise/murder anyone and yet proceed to storm their fort anyway. Orcs react in much the same way as a bandit until you gain their trust but they aren't bandits. They are just a separate faction who stay away from the rest of society. The Mafia is a good example I think. They surely must be considered bandits. They became well known during the Napoleonic era, strongly fighting against French occupation of Italy. They just wanted their land back in Italian hands. Much like the Stormcloaks want their land back. Stormcloaks are considered bandits by the Legion. I expect the Legion are considered bandits by the Stormcloaks. It's all a matter of perspective and which one your buying into. Edited August 21, 2012 by worldofscotty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tetradite Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 In many cases you never see a bandit brutalise/murder anyone and yet proceed to storm their fort anyway. Orcs react in much the same way as a bandit until you gain their trust but they aren't bandits. They are just a separate faction who stay away from the rest of society. Orcs are set up in very remote locations down little used tracks in "isolation". Bandits (e.g Valtheim Towers) are often set up on the main roads where it's impossible to use the main road as a peaceful traveller without being either attacked or extorted. Bandits =/= Orcs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StayFrosty05 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 To tell the truth, there are lots of bandits in Skyrim, more than civilized citizen. I think, for some weeks I killed people more, than live in whole Tamriel ( I'm not a cruel man, I just carry out mission). To establish balance we should download 10-20 NPC mods and occupy uninhabited regions of Skyrim. It's a shame so many adding population mods need to be so large...or that's exactly what i would be doing. I'm not sure what you mean by "large", but I'm in progress with something that may address this to some extent, gonna take a while though :thumbsup: I'm definitely no modder....but trying hard to learn, though I am very tech-no-logic.... :( ....but from what I have come to understand from much of the reading I have done, dont adding population mods need to generally use quite involved and sizable scripting systems? Though tetradite do please let me know when you start getting your mod off the ground, I would be very interested....and it would be much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StayFrosty05 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 (edited) If we are talking in a literal sense then yes you are right. When you say things like 'the game labels them for you' I assume we are talking about different things. Obviously for the simplistic game approach of good and evil they are obviously evil, placed there for you to kill. I'm taking a more RP approach to this and getting a little deeper into the mentality as if the game were real and whether if under real life circumstances this society was in fact doomed to fail; which I don't believe it is. In many cases you never see a bandit brutalise/murder anyone and yet proceed to storm their fort anyway. Orcs react in much the same way as a bandit until you gain their trust but they aren't bandits. They are just a separate faction who stay away from the rest of society. The Mafia is a good example I think. They surely must be considered bandits. They became well known during the Napoleonic era, strongly fighting against French occupation of Italy. They just wanted their land back in Italian hands. Much like the Stormcloaks want their land back. Stormcloaks are considered bandits by the Legion. I expect the Legion are considered bandits by the Stormcloaks. It's all a matter of perspective and which one your buying into. I never said anything about good vs evil....And I also RP...I would have no interest in playing the game any other way....but it all also depends on what you want to RP....I RP something of a relentless, unforgiving, black and white visioned Dovahkin....I do not agree with everything he does or his heavy handed approach and principles...I see a lot more grey in the world....But I do agree with him in this: Just because a Bandit/Necromancer/Thalmor/Thief/Assassin/Vampires is not harming you in particular but they are obvious threats to others, it does not excuse you from exercising your duty to protest those unable to protect themselves from threats and dangers....if you yourself have the ability to do something about it. As for the Mafia.... their original intentions and fight were noble and right...but eventually greed and power got the better of them and they became something else....no longer Freedom Warriors, now just thugs.....I cannot see the Imperials and Stormcloaks viewing one another as Bandits, they fight for something much greater than just attempting to line their own pockets with another stolen belongings. Though you are certainly right about perspectives. Edited August 21, 2012 by StayFrosty05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StayFrosty05 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 (edited) In many cases you never see a bandit brutalise/murder anyone and yet proceed to storm their fort anyway. Orcs react in much the same way as a bandit until you gain their trust but they aren't bandits. They are just a separate faction who stay away from the rest of society. Orcs are set up in very remote locations down little used tracks in "isolation". Bandits (e.g Valtheim Towers) are often set up on the main roads where it's impossible to use the main road as a peaceful traveller without being either attacked or extorted. Bandits =/= Orcs Good point tetradite....Bandits do often use traveled choke points or just straight out attack if you wander too close to their encampments.....Where as the Orcs have made their intentions off wishing to be left alone very clear with a lot less threat or encroachment on populated areas. Edited August 21, 2012 by StayFrosty05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worldofscotty Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Some good points. I never said anything about good vs evil....And I also RP...I would have no interest in playing the game any other way I see a lot more grey in the world No you didn't but but this is all I'm trying to get at. The aim of the thread is to decide the balance of good vs evil and I'm just trying to highlight the perspective of what is good and what is evil. And like you said, in reality there would be a lot of grey areas. I'm not trying to get you to justify whether it's ok for your character to kill certain NPCs. Just that they aren't necessarily a threat to society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StayFrosty05 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Some good points. I never said anything about good vs evil....And I also RP...I would have no interest in playing the game any other way I see a lot more grey in the world No you didn't but but this is all I'm trying to get at. The aim of the thread is to decide the balance of good vs evil and I'm just trying to highlight the perspective of what is good and what is evil. And like you said, in reality there would be a lot of grey areas. I'm not trying to get you to justify whether it's ok for your character to kill certain NPCs. Just that they aren't necessarily a threat to society. Yes, there is a large imbalance between the passives and aggressives....I would have loved to have seen larger populations in towns/villages....more travelers, refugees (not dead), non-aggressive wilderness groups...aka Mage Communities, Gypsy style bands, etc....A Skyrim with life, not just a continuous line of bullies and thugs....and not just a double up of more farmers with painted cows, would be soldiers and farming couples who have lost everything to Dragons....I would not expect all these extra's to be named....(that's a big ask and quite a loss if they die, the population is too small as it is)....just spawners like the Bandits are....I do think the game is very unbalanced at the moment and it would make for a much richer and greater experience if numbers were leveled out more. As for the Bandits....we should just agree to disagree...I am going by the dictionary definition as to what a Bandit is and so thus they pose quite a threat to innocent travelers....Someone who opts to live in a secluded group for the seclusion is something entirely different, they don't make their living by preying on others....they maybe unfriendly, such as the Orcs, but the Orcs make their own way and are not a direct threat to the safety of others, they are probably a good example of 'neutral' actually...I would like to see more of such neutral groups in the wilderness. Bethesda is not very good at grey areas.... :sad: ...I must say I have been quite impressed with Bioware (Mass Effect) though for the not so cut and dried approach.... :happy: ...that's all very up in the air and really gives our principles/views a run for their money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeblebub Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 its about 300 or so isnt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xaliqen Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I imagine most of the bad guys aren't so bad. They're just trying to make a living like anyone else. If you're in their cave/fortress/hideout etc, wouldn't it be pretty natural for them to respond in a violent manner? From that perspective, it'd be you (the hero) who would be the bad guy, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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