Do Conspirisy theories have any Truth to them?

[Minuteman308]

The Illuminati was a good group.

No, Freiherr von Knigge wrote a book about them, it was a total rip-off. They were after upperclass peoples money and frauded most of their members.

Also, the official statements of there goals are nearly identical with those from the communist manifesto. Typical "we promiss you a totaly paradise" sect jabbering.

 

Every read a book about them?

[marharth]

The Illuminati was a good group.

No, Freiherr von Knigge wrote a book about them, it was a total rip-off. They were after upperclass peoples money and frauded most of their members.

Also, the official statements of there goals are nearly identical with those from the communist manifesto. Typical "we promiss you a totaly paradise" sect jabbering.

 

Every read a book about them?

Most books on him are written by nut-job conspiracy theorists.

 

Right, so a nobleman that left from the Illuminati and wrote a book for profit is more legitimate then letters from Thomas Jefferson or George Washington saying that the Illuminati stood for good believes. People can stick to conspiracy theories all they want and hate the Illuminati, but it goes against historical fact.

 

http://etext.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=WasFi36.xml&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=388&division=div1

 

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?ammem/mtj:@field%28DOCID+@lit%28tj090050%29%29

[dunmermaiden]

The Illuminati was a good group.

No, Freiherr von Knigge wrote a book about them, it was a total rip-off. They were after upperclass peoples money and frauded most of their members.

Also, the official statements of there goals are nearly identical with those from the communist manifesto. Typical "we promiss you a totaly paradise" sect jabbering.

 

Every read a book about them?

Most books on him are written by nut-job conspiracy theorists.

 

Right, so a nobleman that left from the Illuminati and wrote a book for profit is more legitimate then letters from Thomas Jefferson or George Washington saying that the Illuminati stood for good believes. People can stick to conspiracy theories all they want and hate the Illuminati, but it goes against historical fact.

 

http://etext.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=WasFi36.xml&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=388&division=div1

 

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?ammem/mtj:@field%28DOCID+@lit%28tj090050%29%29

 

 

If the Illuminati are so good how will they archeive their agenda of 1) food for everyone - when at todays population they are talking food shortages and 2) Healthcare for all - when we all know how expensive that costs. and 3) providing benefits when currently the benefits cost countrys that have them billions every year. Though not as much as prisoners cost to be locked up.

 

Then you take a look at the Fema camps and the stock piles of coffins and how they are set up like Hitlers death camps were and then you see how they plan to do their goals. Same close to railways, same double barbed wire fences same furnaces......

 

And why is their a stone plague in america saying to keep the world population at 5 million?

 

It is a human right to grow ones vege and drink and use rainwater.

 

Someones getting rich and people are too dumb to oppose this loss of freedom and can't see whats happening.

 

And btw, they aren't wanting to enslave us, they are wanting to kill us and depopulate the worlds population because they know at the current rate it's growing this world cannot feed the rising populations - on the news scientists are talking food shortages.

Edited August 31, 2012 by dunmermaiden

[JimboUK]

As soon as you start applying logic to these theories they tend to fall apart, not trusting authority is healthy, dismissing logic and evidence in favour of nonsensical fantasies is not.

It's usually mostly this.

 

But at its root all conspiracies are about the same thing... Trying to establish a reasonable belief as to what happened in an event. For most people, they work based on the facts offered to them from an authority or eye-witness and when there are gaps or omissions in information they usually ignore them and just go on with their lives. For those who are more likely to accept conspiracy theories, or who have a deep distrust for that authority, they look at any gaps or omissions as being either intentional, or as evidence of everything being suspect. But the reason why it is so prevalent is due to two reasons:

 

The first is that there is almost no such thing as an event which would be independently reported by dozens of people in the same exact way. There will always be people who get the series of events wrong, misidentify individuals, or be mistaken about certain facts. Even when you have video footage, not all of that footage is always immediately clear, and in the case of national reporting it may be edited dozens of times or had sections chopped out, leading to numerous questions as to why it was edited, what wasn't shown, ect, ect... even when most of it was done for practicality, runtime, or issues regarding graphic violence. But since there is some aspect which is missing, conspiracies fly.

 

The second is that once a conspiracy starts and spreads, you can't put it to rest... EVER. Not only does a conspiracy often take on a broad range of variants ranging from the equally probable to outright impossible, but that all variants tend to be spread with the same amount of conviction and can even become stronger in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary (case in point flat-earthers, hollow-earthers). You also can't tell them to stop with their claims, or just kill them since then you are only validating their beliefs by establishing yourself as someone who is part of the conspiracy or who is trying to silence the truth. In short, there is no explanation which is good enough for them, and once started a conspiracy tends to live for as long as it continues to be spoken by believers.

 

Both of these issues become larger simply because of the rate that information spreads, so rather than a crazy person just standing on a soap box on the street until told to move, they can go to the internet and have millions of other people who will not only hear the idea, but usually resonate with it and add their own views. There were likely conspiracies in ancient times too, just that the knowledge base was small enough to limit claims to either things that would get you put in prison, killed, or ostracized and beaten for being a lunatic.

 

 

 

Some conspiracies probably have a little truth to them, but most of that truth tends to get distorted or dropped completely in favor of aspects which are more sensationalist... Like aliens, secret societies, or any other group which is large enough to throw darts at.

 

I gave up arguing with them a long time ago, trying to argue is pointless because their beliefs are not based on logic or looking at all the facts but rather jumping on any "evidence" however ludicrous that supports their position while dismissing everything else. Their beliefs are faith based rather than evidence based which makes reasoned argument a waste of time. Most can be dismissed as harmless but some do need to be tackled, those stoking up antisemitism for example, the Nazis used those to great effect in the 1930s and we all know the end result of that.

[marharth]

The Illuminati was a good group.

No, Freiherr von Knigge wrote a book about them, it was a total rip-off. They were after upperclass peoples money and frauded most of their members.

Also, the official statements of there goals are nearly identical with those from the communist manifesto. Typical "we promiss you a totaly paradise" sect jabbering.

 

Every read a book about them?

Most books on him are written by nut-job conspiracy theorists.

 

Right, so a nobleman that left from the Illuminati and wrote a book for profit is more legitimate then letters from Thomas Jefferson or George Washington saying that the Illuminati stood for good believes. People can stick to conspiracy theories all they want and hate the Illuminati, but it goes against historical fact.

 

http://etext.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=WasFi36.xml&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=388&division=div1

 

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?ammem/mtj:@field%28DOCID+@lit%28tj090050%29%29

 

 

If the Illuminati are so good how will they archeive their agenda of 1) food for everyone - when at todays population they are talking food shortages and 2) Healthcare for all - when we all know how expensive that costs. and 3) providing benefits when currently the benefits cost countrys that have them billions every year. Though not as much as prisoners cost to be locked up.

 

Then you take a look at the Fema camps and the stock piles of coffins and how they are set up like Hitlers death camps were and then you see how they plan to do their goals. Same close to railways, same double barbed wire fences same furnaces......

 

And why is their a stone plague in america saying to keep the world population at 5 million?

 

It is a human right to grow ones vege and drink and use rainwater.

 

Someones getting rich and people are too dumb to oppose this loss of freedom and can't see whats happening.

 

And btw, they aren't wanting to enslave us, they are wanting to kill us and depopulate the worlds population because they know at the current rate it's growing this world cannot feed the rising populations - on the news scientists are talking food shortages.

Because the Illuminati you are talking about does not exist. There is no conspiracy, the people who rule the world are rich and corporations. There is nothing deeper then that.

[JimboUK]

 

Because the Illuminati you are talking about does not exist. There is no conspiracy, the people who rule the world are rich and corporations. There is nothing deeper then that.

 

This^^^^ and who gave them that power? we did. We want services but don't want to pay for them so governments borrow, now like any debtor the creditor has got us by the spherical objects. No conspiracy, no cover up, no secret organisations.

[Minuteman308]

marharth

Most books on him are written by nut-job conspiracy theorists.

 

Right, so a nobleman that left from the Illuminati and wrote a book for profit is more legitimate then letters from Thomas Jefferson or George Washington saying that the Illuminati stood for good believes. People can stick to conspiracy theories all they want and hate the Illuminati, but it goes against historical fact.

 

First off, there is no "historical fact" about things which were secret. Secound, Jefferson and Washington weren't Members of the Illuminati. Knigge was.

[marharth]

marharth

Most books on him are written by nut-job conspiracy theorists.

 

Right, so a nobleman that left from the Illuminati and wrote a book for profit is more legitimate then letters from Thomas Jefferson or George Washington saying that the Illuminati stood for good believes. People can stick to conspiracy theories all they want and hate the Illuminati, but it goes against historical fact.

 

First off, there is no "historical fact" about things which were secret. Secound, Jefferson and Washington weren't Members of the Illuminati. Knigge was.

There was historical fact about the Illuminati. Of course there was. If there wasn't historical fact you wouldn't even know it existed (or at least couldn't say it existed since you would have no evidence.)

 

Why does it matter that he was a member? The Illuminati isn't what people think it was. It wasn't so secret that no one knew what they did, or who they were. At the time people knew the Illuminati existed, and knew what they stood for. A single guy getting mad and leaving isn't much to base your entire opinion of the organization off.

 

Someone else who was a member was Goethe. He wrote against the Catholic Church and totalitarian control.

Edited September 1, 2012 by marharth

[bben46]

Here is a reply to some of your specific conspiracy theorizes.

I live in the US

I, and many of my neighbors have a vegetable garden. No problems with the law. I can even sell my home grown produce if I choose. I only have tomatoes this year - and pretty poor tomatoes at that.

I, and many of my neighbors collect and use rainwater to water lawns & gardens - the local government actually encourages this. The rainwater is used to water my lawn during drought periods. but there has been so much rain here this summer, I leave the valve open to drain the tank

 

There is NO law federal law in the US forbidding either. There may be local laws or Home owner associations that prohibit rainwater collection or vegetable gardens in your yard for some specific reason. But the federal government has no rules on those at all. (open rain barrels would be great mosquito breeding places)

 

Why would the not so secret FEMA camps be set up beside rail lines? Rail is not used nearly as extensively in the US as most other countries - instead they would be set up near interstate highways to facilitate moving your victims to them by bus or tractor trailer. Why would they stockpile coffins? Mass murder victims are usually just dumped into a trench and covered with a bulldozer. However, I could see FEMA stockpiling coffins for use in a disaster of some kind. During the 1919 influenza epidemic there was a big shortage of coffins and many people were buried wrapped in nothing but a sheet. - and not just in the US.

 

Here is a link debunking the FEMA camp conspiracy - Not that I expect people who subscribe to stuff like that to accept reality over fantasy. http://www.popularme...ry/news/4312850

[rizon72]

Here is a link debunking the FEMA camp conspiracy - Not that I expect people who subscribe to stuff like that to accept reality over fantasy. http://www.popularme...ry/news/4312850

 

How dare you bring reality into conspiracy talks. :tongue: :D :laugh: