Altering Weapon Properties

[defKAB]

So, I was messing around with the weapon properties, like every newb does.

I decided to try giving heavies the option of using Assault Rifles (my alterations make them good shots -except- with the LMG-) for better aim.

So, I left in the Rifle property (for fear that my rookies and support will then not be able to use it) and added the Heavy property...

However, it still says that heavies cant use it. I'm assuming that the Rifle property has innate class restriction, eh?

But a work around (having JUST the Support, Heavy, and Assault properties) will give the weapon the Long Range fall off (because it's an assault weapon now) and MIGHT not let my Rookies use it (because it's not a Rifle).

The other work around is to give it the Any Class property. However, that STILL might not let my Rookies use it (because Rook isn't a class...) and it'll then have the Close Range drop off of a Sniper Rifle (because it's now a Sniper Weapon) and MIGHT have the Long Range drop off of the assault still (cause above)...

I'm gonna try both ways, and see what happens, but I want to know; Does anyone have more experience with this? Any idea the EXACT constraints a class property has on a weapon?

At the very least, I'll probably have to remove the Short Range Sniper fall off for ALL weapons, and let any class use it...

[PaxEmpyrean]

If you add eWP_Assault it will have range falloff like a shotgun. If you add eWP_Sniper it will have inverse range falloff like a sniper rifle. AnyClass and Heavy together will allow all classes to use the weapon without any weird range modifiers.

 

The problem with making sniper rifles available to everyone and removing the close range penalty is that you then have a weapon that does more damage than an assault rifle with the same range characteristics, and does the same damage as a shotgun with no long range penalty, and you get better crit modifiers on top of all that.

[defKAB]

If you add eWP_Assault it will have range falloff like a shotgun. If you add eWP_Sniper it will have inverse range falloff like a sniper rifle. AnyClass and Heavy together will allow all classes to use the weapon without any weird range modifiers.

 

The problem with making sniper rifles available to everyone and removing the close range penalty is that you then have a weapon that does more damage than an assault rifle with the same range characteristics, and does the same damage as a shotgun with no long range penalty, and you get better crit modifiers on top of all that.

 

Mm, yeah... I'm working through the complications inherit. I'm not saying I have the foresight to see all the issues, but I am dealing with them, in their own ways...

 

Good news, the Any Class and Heavy property combo works great. It doesn't portray any of the range fall offs from class restricted weapons, works just like it should...

So, moving on with that, you can give a weapon to ALL the classes, but picking and choosing comes with its limitations... It's going to be a chore to reinforce the traditional weapon roles... With Snipers, Squadsight should reinforce the sniper rifle, as other weapons have that range limitation. For others, the range might be a buff, but the move restriction makes it a poor choice. For Assault, the damage and Crit chance is enough to reinforce a Shotgun, and using an LMG will induct an accuracy malus, making it a poor choice for the run-n-gunners... For Heavies... I don't know.. Suppression now becomes viable with any weapon, (I think? Any one know for sure?) The Shotgun might become a good choice for a heavy... But since almost every class will be 'faster' than him, the range falloff might make it a lesser choice? I dunno. I think the heavy's thing are his abilities, not his weapons, so I'm detecting that it'll make them a good choice, not an overpowered one...

The Support will just be Even More Support... This might unbalance them, I think... Any weapon, any time? That lets them REALLY tone themself to the situation... Any thoughts?

 

Also, in a very, very unrelated post... Does anyone know how to delay the progression of enemy improvement? I mean like the time between meeting the Floaters, and the Mutons, and such. I'm looking for a longer, Marathon-style gameplay. (I don't know how to fix Marathon, and what all it actually DOES, so I'm hardballing it.) But the long research might screw you as the tougher enemies appear far to quickly. Anyone?

[Kaerar]

If you are interested in a Marathon style playthrough you can edit nearly all the global modifiers for R&D and costs making things last a lot longer. Make sure to reduce the number of alien alloys and weapon fragments too as the frequency of UFO's is still the same so you run into a lot more before each "level" of enemy is conquered. My current game is modded to marathon style with lots of other tweaks and is so far very interesting. Most of my Squad only just hit squaddie level (first exp level is the same, second is double, the rest are triple in my game) making life a lot harder. The biggest problem is getting Support characters up to Sergeant level to get the healing perk with medkits.

 

If you want a look at my files PM and I'll send them over. Using Notepad++ you can use the compare function (in the plugins menu) to compare with a stock "defaultgamecore.mod" and see all the changes. It's still WIP as I'm editing Normal, Classic and Impossible to provide similar yet increasingly harder challenges to the player.

[defKAB]

If you are interested in a Marathon style playthrough you can edit nearly all the global modifiers for R&D and costs making things last a lot longer. Make sure to reduce the number of alien alloys and weapon fragments too as the frequency of UFO's is still the same so you run into a lot more before each "level" of enemy is conquered. My current game is modded to marathon style with lots of other tweaks and is so far very interesting. Most of my Squad only just hit squaddie level (first exp level is the same, second is double, the rest are triple in my game) making life a lot harder. The biggest problem is getting Support characters up to Sergeant level to get the healing perk with medkits.

 

If you want a look at my files PM and I'll send them over. Using Notepad++ you can use the compare function (in the plugins menu) to compare with a stock "defaultgamecore.mod" and see all the changes. It's still WIP as I'm editing Normal, Classic and Impossible to provide similar yet increasingly harder challenges to the player.

 

That'd be great. I'm sort of doing the same thing. The only thing I'm worried about is the enemy progression going faster than my R&D can handle. Then again, I could plan for that to be part of the difficulty.

[mutonizer]

Also, in a very, very unrelated post... Does anyone know how to delay the progression of enemy improvement? I mean like the time between meeting the Floaters, and the Mutons, and such. I'm looking for a longer, Marathon-style gameplay. (I don't know how to fix Marathon, and what all it actually DOES, so I'm hardballing it.) But the long research might screw you as the tougher enemies appear far to quickly. Anyone?

 

You can do a lot of things on your side but enemies seem to indeed pop up on a tighter schedule, at least some.

For example, I couldn't delay the apparition of Thin Men whatsoever, and Muton/Floater/Disc always start to appear in May-June for me. The rest seems to be story related, with some tech progression thrown in as well it seems. I have yet to just research nothing, do nothing and end up in late August alive, though I might try it someday, see how that goes.

 

Marathon SW option seems..a bit too hard core/bugged at the moment :)

[defKAB]

You can do a lot of things on your side but enemies seem to indeed pop up on a tighter schedule, at least some.

For example, I couldn't delay the apparition of Thin Men whatsoever, and Muton/Floater/Disc always start to appear in May-June for me. The rest seems to be story related, with some tech progression thrown in as well it seems. I have yet to just research nothing, do nothing and end up in late August alive, though I might try it someday, see how that goes.

 

Marathon SW option seems..a bit too hard core/bugged at the moment :)

 

Agreed. I did the whole no research thing, and the baddies get badder as time goes on without you. It's not an issue, I'm sure, I'll just have a time of tweaking in the game so that Mutons dont just run over your face completely. Mostly, but not completely. It makes research time important.

[Kaerar]

Well primary testing of my stats is working a treat. The progression isn't too fast either though Muton's are really tough as you are only just getting a beam rifle or pistol or two by the time you meet them. However due to the buffs in Ballistic weapons they are survivable. The main bit is tactical thinking and making sure that Lieutenant/Sergeant doesn't get his/her head blown off early...

 

Sectoids with 4/5 health (if they get buffed by mates) are certainly a challenge when you are greeted by 12 of the buggers :D

[shiwan8]

Promising.

[defKAB]

So, after letting every class use every weapon, I found out a few things... Namely, why heavies are so special in their properties listing. The Heavy Property not only allows the heavy to 'Suppress' with the weapon (Funny watching a Heavy suppress with a sniper rifle...) but it also gives it the ammo of a Heavy. Meaning 3 shots, where previously their were for the cases of the other weapons... For anyone delving into the .upk's, this means ammo is determined by Class, not by weapon... Also, equalizing the difficulty balance numbers, I found that there was still an imbalance between Normal, and Classic. The Aliens no longer got their amazing critical powers (tho there is a slight increase in AI), however, my squad suffered from inexplicably bad luck. More often than not, a high hit chance (70% and above) would surprisingly miss. As would lower hit chances, but that's expected. Maybe there's more to the difficulties than outlined in DefaultGameCore?