Want to learn more about mergeing leveled lists, resolving conflicts,

[mothergoose729]

Hello nexus. I am thinknig about starting a project like S.T.E.P., but one that has a broader and more inclusive mod package. I have a huge list of mods I have experimented with and tried and I have more or less settled on all the ones I think are worthwhile. I want to go about making sure all of them are 110% compatible and stable. I am aware of several utility programs that could help me do it, but I am not aware of all the problems to look for or what are the best tools to use to solve these problems.

 

Specifically I have occasional problems with CTDs. I expect this is due to VRAM bursting which is bound to happen from time to time, but I can't be sure. How could I go about determining what causes these occasional crashes in my game? Is there a logging utility I could use?

 

I need to merge some leveled lists and some smithing lists. I understand wyre base is good for this. Might it be better to use the CK editor for this instead though? In general, I am curious to know which problems wyre bash is best used for solving, and which problems it would be better to go in by hand and fix.

 

At some point I need to edit scipted messages to the player, at the very least.

 

I have heard about TES5 edit. It is good at finding mod conflicts and bad references, from what I understand. I have a fairly weak CS understanding though so I would appreciate a link to a guide or an explanation so I can better understand what that means.

 

In addition, just any tips, simple instruction, or otherwise good information on what problems a mod project brings up and possible suggestions on how to go about fixing them would be really awesome and much appreciated. At this point I know a lot about what mods are on the nexus and what they do, but I don't know much about the technical side yet and want to learn as much as I can.

 

Thank you for any help with any and all questions :) :)

[nakakita]

Trying to use the CK to edit leveled lists does not seem like a good idea. TES5 edit isn't so much for resolving conflicts as it is for cleaning up 'dirty' edits that can occasionally be the reason for crashes. Wrye Bash is the best way if you are trying to merge leveled lists, but I'm not sure what you mean by 'smithing lists'. Are you running multiple smithing or perk overhaul mods or something? Mods that just add to the list of recipes don't generally conflict with anything.

 

I don't use the Nexus Mod Manager personally, because it would always crash unless I ran it as an administrator. The Mod Organizer does basically the same thing as the NMM, but without dumping things in your data folder. It isn't the easiest program to use at first though.

 

My installation process is this more or less:

• Stick mod in MO download folder.
  
• Run MO
  
• Install Mod.
  
• Launch Boss through MO.
  
• Examine messages from Boss.
  
• Remove Boss folder from Skyrim folder.
  
• Launch Wrye Bash from MO.
  
• Re-arrange unrecognized mods.
  
• Make a bashed patch, exit Wrye Bash.
  
• Launch Skyrim (through MO again, using SKSE.)
  

 

If you don't use MO, you can ignore everything regarding it. Since all your files are in the data folder, you don't need techno-voodoo to make certain things work. Removing Boss is the only way I have been able to make Boss and Wrye play nice together lately because Wrye crashes and throws up errors.

 

There is a way to log errors, but it doesn't always help. Occasionally it won't register, and if the error is caused by a bad texture or mesh, it never seems to register. There's a texture in the Optimized Bethesda Texture pack (using the vanilla normal maps..) that always seems to make me crash in the Whiterun Tundra. I have no idea what this mysterious texture is, I only know if I don't chose that option, I never have those crashes in that area. Better Males also has a faulty shoe mesh that has never been completely fixed that will cause your game to die. It's the Forsworn shoe. It's edited to have toes instead of the block-foot, and looks fine in Nifscope, but it still causes crashes. The fix for it even causes crashes.

 

Anyway, to enable logging enter this into your skyrim.ini (in the folder near your saves.)

 

[Papyrus]

bEnableLogging=1

bEnableTrace=1

bLoadDebugInformation = 1

 

If you have multiple things editing leveled lists and don't want to use Wrye Bash to merge them, just stick the one that you care about most lowest in the load order. It will override all the other edits.

 

Hopefully this helps?

[mothergoose729]

Trying to use the CK to edit leveled lists does not seem like a good idea. TES5 edit isn't so much for resolving conflicts as it is for cleaning up 'dirty' edits that can occasionally be the reason for crashes. Wrye Bash is the best way if you are trying to merge leveled lists, but I'm not sure what you mean by 'smithing lists'. Are you running multiple smithing or perk overhaul mods or something? Mods that just add to the list of recipes don't generally conflict with anything.

 

I don't use the Nexus Mod Manager personally, because it would always crash unless I ran it as an administrator. The Mod Organizer does basically the same thing as the NMM, but without dumping things in your data folder. It isn't the easiest program to use at first though.

 

My installation process is this more or less:

• Stick mod in MO download folder.
  
• Run MO
  
• Install Mod.
  
• Launch Boss through MO.
  
• Examine messages from Boss.
  
• Remove Boss folder from Skyrim folder.
  
• Launch Wrye Bash from MO.
  
• Re-arrange unrecognized mods.
  
• Make a bashed patch, exit Wrye Bash.
  
• Launch Skyrim (through MO again, using SKSE.)
  

 

If you don't use MO, you can ignore everything regarding it. Since all your files are in the data folder, you don't need techno-voodoo to make certain things work. Removing Boss is the only way I have been able to make Boss and Wrye play nice together lately because Wrye crashes and throws up errors.

 

There is a way to log errors, but it doesn't always help. Occasionally it won't register, and if the error is caused by a bad texture or mesh, it never seems to register. There's a texture in the Optimized Bethesda Texture pack (using the vanilla normal maps..) that always seems to make me crash in the Whiterun Tundra. I have no idea what this mysterious texture is, I only know if I don't chose that option, I never have those crashes in that area. Better Males also has a faulty shoe mesh that has never been completely fixed that will cause your game to die. It's the Forsworn shoe. It's edited to have toes instead of the block-foot, and looks fine in Nifscope, but it still causes crashes. The fix for it even causes crashes.

 

Anyway, to enable logging enter this into your skyrim.ini (in the folder near your saves.)

 

[Papyrus]

bEnableLogging=1

bEnableTrace=1

bLoadDebugInformation = 1

 

If you have multiple things editing leveled lists and don't want to use Wrye Bash to merge them, just stick the one that you care about most lowest in the load order. It will override all the other edits.

 

Hopefully this helps?

It does yes. I looked over my mod list and realized I was using two different compatibility mods for the same thing. Oop! I was unaware of the foresworn foot texture problem for better males... are you certain this is still an issue? Seems like a simple thing to fix really... once I get used to references list on the new ck this is something I am definitely capable of providing some kind of fix for.

 

Is there a method for finding faulty/game crashing textures other than stumbling upon them? Do you know of any others associated with popular mods?

 

Also, what exactly is a dirty edit? STEP mentions "conflicts" in their description of mods, specifically better quest objectives and AIMPZ. What is problems is this referring too? Thanks again for you help. I am getting a better idea of how to go about this.

Edited November 4, 2012 by mothergoose729

[nakakita]

There's a patch for it, but the patch doesn't work, and it still causes crashing. The mod itself hasn't been updated since February, and I noticed this issue in July I believe. (I thought the issue was a specific ruin (Volskygge) for the longest time. After removing all .esp based mods when I still got crashing, and it continued to happen even on brand new saves, I eventually found that the Forsworn nearby (wearing said faulty shoes) were the issue.) It's also not a texture issue, its a mesh issue. Deleting the forsworn shoe meshes from your data folder will resolve that crash, and there are no textures for that added by the mod. I don't know if it's actually fixable in the CK, but you could certainly try.

 

And other than trial and error, no, there does not seem to be any way to notice if a mesh or a texture has gone wrong. I am not aware of any other examples either. And this provides more information on TES5edit in general. I believe dirty edits are edits that are duplicates from the master files they are associated with, but I might be a bit off. Cleaning is fairly easy though.

 

Edit: As for the conflicts, avoid those mods for now. I think the author of this guide is hoping the issues with these mods is resolved soon, but if not, they'll probably be removed from the guide.

Edited November 4, 2012 by nakakita

[mothergoose729]

Ok. I I think I might need to ask around the STEP forums to get a better answer there. Do you know what the file path is for the faulty texture? Thanks again.