Prenihility Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 I want to talk about best practice for mod installation and dealing with multiple ESPs post-installation of a mod, particularly in situations that call for only ONE being used at a time, as well as ESPs appearing post-installation that you haven't even checked off as options. I've encountered two mods already that dump extra ESPs into your data folder and load order despite the fact that only one can be used at a time, or either you literally didn't even check it in its own INSTALLER yet it appears. Why? Well i'm not sure. Nevada Skies for example. You have to choose the appropriate option. Sure. No problem. I have all DLCs and Pre-Order Packs. I use the merged files of both and use the Ultimate DLC edition. But I still have TWW and Basic Edition ESPs. So I figure, no problem? Just uncheck the ESPs. That's what I thought was what you're supposed to do. Whenever I post my Load Order people point out my "mistakes" when they see these extra ESPs despite the fact I don't have them activated. FCO, another one. This time, even dumber. This thing has its own installer. It has options for Clean Teeth, Companions and whatever the hell else may be applicable to you depending on what other mods you use. Do I have the Russell Companion? Nope. Did I check it off during installation in the installer? Nope. Did I end up with the FCO - Russell ESP? Yeah! :laugh: So apparently unchecking does nothing? My 4 years of playing Skyrim and modding apparently didn't teach me squat, as they're supposedly still loaded into memory and whatnot. So that's why I'm having my game crash. So how on earth do you install these mods properly? What am I doing wrong? The installation instructions don't describe either of these situations. What do I have to do to fix this? And what's the proper way of removing unneeded parts of mods? And also, for the sake of discussion, why do they come packed in with the mod in those situations where you are only able to use one? You apparently have to go through some process of removing said content which is redundant and useless. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubiousintent Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 It sounds like you are confusing "mod installation" to the "DATA" folder with "unpacking the mod to the disk drive". Your problem arises from the mere presence of the "inactive" plugins in the "Data" folder. So the trick is not to unpack or place them there in the first place. You download a mod's "archive package" (e.g. .7Z or .RAR, etc.) from the Nexus. (I don't use either NMM or Vortex, so I've never used the Nexus "Mod Manager Download" button and don't know if it automatically unpacks the archive for you after downloading.) I recommend you download to a folder completely separate from the game itself. Once the package is on your computer, IF it has an "installer" or otherwise is in the form of an "executable" you should "unpack" it into the appropriate "game mods" folder (wherever your mod manager wants the "installed" mods placed). All the "mod managers" I am aware of have or allow this to be separate from the game "Data" folder. You should setup your own folder for holding mods requiring unpacking if you install them manually as well. Unpacking the mod just makes the individual files comprising it available for selection. Once such a "mod" is unpacked to the "game mod" folder, then you want to choose only the required plugins (ESM and/or ESP) files for placement into the "Data" folder. If the mod is packaged in standard archive format (e.g. .7Z or .RAR, etc.) it may not need to be unpacked (depending upon the manager), but it won't hurt if you do so. However, without a "wizard/script" that chooses between plugin options based upon what other mods you have in your "load order", you are effectively manually installing the mod, so then it is up to you to correctly choose which plugins are needed in "Data". It sounds like the package in question does not have such a "wizard". (Personally, I build my own "packages" which contain only the plugins *I* specifically need, and use them for my "load order", but that is a more advanced technique requiring time and knowledge of what is needed; because I use an older mod manager (Wrye Flash). Please see the 'Packaging Mods for Installation' section of the wiki "Getting started creating mods using GECK" article.) -Dubious- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prenihility Posted April 2, 2020 Author Share Posted April 2, 2020 It sounds like you are confusing "mod installation" to the "DATA" folder with "unpacking the mod to the disk drive". Your problem arises from the mere presence of the "inactive" plugins in the "Data" folder. So the trick is not to unpack or place them there in the first place. You download a mod's "archive package" (e.g. .7Z or .RAR, etc.) from the Nexus. (I don't use either NMM or Vortex, so I've never used the Nexus "Mod Manager Download" button and don't know if it automatically unpacks the archive for you after downloading.) I recommend you download to a folder completely separate from the game itself. Once the package is on your computer, IF it has an "installer" or otherwise is in the form of an "executable" you should "unpack" it into the appropriate "game mods" folder (wherever your mod manager wants the "installed" mods placed). All the "mod managers" I am aware of have or allow this to be separate from the game "Data" folder. You should setup your own folder for holding mods requiring unpacking if you install them manually as well. Unpacking the mod just makes the individual files comprising it available for selection. Once such a "mod" is unpacked to the "game mod" folder, then you want to choose only the required plugins (ESM and/or ESP) files for placement into the "Data" folder. If the mod is packaged in standard archive format (e.g. .7Z or .RAR, etc.) it may not need to be unpacked (depending upon the manager), but it won't hurt if you do so. However, without a "wizard/script" that chooses between plugin options based upon what other mods you have in your "load order", you are effectively manually installing the mod, so then it is up to you to correctly choose which plugins are needed in "Data". It sounds like the package in question does not have such a "wizard". (Personally, I build my own "packages" which contain only the plugins *I* specifically need, and use them for my "load order", but that is a more advanced technique requiring time and knowledge of what is needed; because I use an older mod manager (Wrye Flash). Please see the 'Packaging Mods for Installation' section of the wiki "Getting started creating mods using GECK" article.) -Dubious- I'm resurrecting this thread because I may as well and not bother with creating a new one. Plus, I haven't gotten back to New Vegas until now. Yeah, this whole process doesn't make much sense and is just confusing. I've modded Skyrim EXTENSIVELY, OBLIVION of all things, and even Fallout 3. This never seemed to be a problem. I still barely understand what you're saying here. Or at least in context to what's happening. I think i've installed countless Skyrim mods that are the exact same as Fallout Character Overhaul and have an installer. Whatever you don't choose doesn't end up having an ESP. Plain and simple. But unpacking? WHA? I don't understand. I downloaded a mod. I decompress the thing as part of the installation process directly through my mod tool - i'm using Mod Organizer 2 - and it goes through the installation process. And it seems as if you're thinking i'm doing this in some other fashion NOT involving a mod management tool? I think i'd rather put a gun in my mouth. Because I can't even grasp how that could possibly work. For organization's sake alone. No, i'm definitely using a mod manager. Always have been. Only haven't in the days of old when modding Oblivion and dumping everything into the game Data folder and overwriting was considered "normal" for some damn reason. You're suggesting I go in there doctor style, decompress downloaded mods and pick apart what I want and don't want? Then how would such a mod involving an installer even work? The fact that it has an installer and this is happening in the first place is probably the most confusing thing of all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M48A5 Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 The problem you are encountering is trying to use a modern mod manager (MO2) with mods made for an older mod manager. Newer isn't always better. The mods you mention were authored when FOMM was used for mod installation and management. The mod installation was scripted to work with FOMM and not every newer mod manager. You cannot always use a different mod manager and expect the mod to install properly. It is up to the mod manager developer to insure his product will work with existing mods. It is not the mod author's responsibility to see that their mod will work with all mod managers. This problem was first encountered with NMM and then carried forward with the other mod managers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts