Skyrim is more linear and a step down from Oblivion

[fraquar]

Nothing wrong with a walkthrough if it's the 17th puzzle lock and you are sick of the redundant puzzle lock spam..... After a while the same spam just gets old and you just want to get on with whats behind the spam. See solution, stop, go back to game and finish the rest of the stage.

[Lachdonin]

I don't understand how people can say Combat is dumbed down... In oblivion, i'd run straight for Umbra, lead him outside, and jsut backpedle for 5 minutes whittling him down with my sword. Bam, best sword in the (vanilla) game. Not that it was really nessessary, because you could just backpeddle and kill every enemy in the freaking game without taking damage. Maybe strafe a little for mages and archers.

 

I also don't understand where the OP is comming from in the majority of their complaints, since with the exception of character sceduals you can't do any of those things in Oblivion. You can't bribe Bandits, you can't side with the Blackwood Company, you can't choose to replace Mannimarco. The linear nature of quest chains was just as strong in Oblivion as it is in Skyrim. At best, you are given an 'Either Or' option, like with the Foresworn or the Civil War. The biggest choice you get to make in either game is the choice of ommission, totally avoiding the Dark Brotherhood, for instance.

 

Yes, there are more Essential NPC's, and the forced conversations are particularly annoying, but one has to remember how frusterated people got having hidden guilds in Oblivion. I recall no shortage of rage because people couldn't figure out how to join the Thieves Guild.

 

Nothing Bethesda does will ever please everyone. You still have the bitter old codgers who want to go back to Daggerfall (good game though it was). But Skyrim is certianly not a step down from Oblivion.

[frakle]

I don't understand how people can say Combat is dumbed down...[snip]

 

I agree completely.

Edited December 27, 2012 by frakle

[sajuukkhar9000]

Yes, there are more Essential NPC's,

Actually, Oblivion has just as many essential NPCs as Skyrim

 

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Essential_NPCs

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Essential_NPCs

 

Oblivion = 223

Skyrim = 219

[Lachdonin]

Yes, there are more Essential NPC's,

Actually, Oblivion has just as many essential NPCs as Skyrim

 

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Essential_NPCs

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Essential_NPCs

 

Oblivion = 223

Skyrim = 219

 

Ah, more vindication in my preferance for Skyrim over Oblivions generic forests and castles... Pretty soon argueing this is going to be like argueing evolution.

[sajuukkhar9000]

Ah, more vindication in my preferance for Skyrim over Oblivions generic forests and castles... Pretty soon argueing this is going to be like argueing evolution.

Admittedly, there's about 6 or 7 essential NPCs, some of the dark Brotherhood random quest givers, that are essential and not on the list, while 3 of the others are. But all in all, Oblivion and Skyrim have a pretty much equal number of essential NPCs, with neither game having a huge gap over the other. The main difference is that a larger number of Oblivion's NPCs become killable after a quest, while Skyrim's remain essential.

 

But that is mostly due to the civil war, there's 9 holds, each with a Jarl, Steward, Housecarl, and Army agent, and every hold, but Solitude, can be potentially replaced during the civil war. So we have like 60 total NPCs, 1/4 of Skyrim's essential NPC population, from the civil war alone.

Edited December 28, 2012 by sajuukkhar9000

[Alithinos]

I don't understand how people can say Combat is dumbed down...[snip]

 

I agree completely.

The thing is that it changed in a way so now it is much more player character's skill important (e.g. what perks you have) than player's skill (timing when to attack or block).

 

Your way to success in Skyrim is to apply perks to the weapon you are using and raise your health,and from there and on just get close to an enemy and start mindlessly spamming the attack button.

 

Your way to success in Oblivion though was to block enemy's attacks and attack him the right time that he is vulnerable. You had to decide the right time to attack or to block and play more tactical,or else you could even get seriously harmed from any enemy. That was against enemies that use weapon and shield combo of course. If you had a scamp in the distance though throwing you fireballs, you had to maneuver and strafe sideways to avoid its fireballs,because if you didn't they would harm you enough,even with your shield on.

 

See how things changed ? It is just that in Skyrim stats are more important in combat,while in Oblivion player skill like reflexes was. Of course some other aspects of the combat itself have been greatly improved in Skyrim. The ability to dual wield,to shout,and the killcams are nice additions,and also the attack animations and sounds are better,as also it is easier in Skyrim to guess how long your weapon can reach, so you don't hit the air thinking you will hit the enemy so often. To be fair many aspects of combat in Skyrim have been indeed improved over Oblivion.

But I think it's a matter of preference in the end. Some players might like a more classic and old-school approach in combat,so that the outcome is heavily depended on Stats. As it is also in most J-RPGs. But other players,prefer a more real-time,dynamic and skill based combat. A combat that is more heavily depended on the player choosing to do the right moves on the right time,as it is usual on more action adventure games I would say,like in Zelda or Dark Souls.

 

My opinion is just that combat should be more depended on player's skill than to his character's stats. Don't get me wrong,when I level up my skill,I want it to have some meaning,and feel like I've accomplished something. But it breaks my immersion somewhat that I can just stay without armor and without blocking enemy's attacks at all to survive heavy hits,or seeing the enemies never block or dodge my attacks and surviving for that long,just because their level is higher. And it's not just an immersion issue,its also that heavily stat depended combat becomes dull after a while,and challenge is lost after you have leveled up some times,which makes battles somewhat less exciting and more boring after some time.

But each player has his likes of his own. Some prefer a more standard (RPG COMBAT), others prefer a more (ACTION COMBAT). I understand that for many players that are used on,or like more to rely on their character's stats and level,Skyrim's combat system is more convenient and enjoyable than Oblivion's. But there are also players who prefer to rely on their reflexes and timing to survive and win in battles. I respect both preferences. I just happen to be with the side of players who prefer a combat system that is relying more on reflexes than your character's level.

The best thing of course would be Bethesda to find a 'sweet spot' between these 2 different systems so everyone is happy. But it seems they can't.

Edited December 28, 2012 by Alithinos

[Lachdonin]

I don't understand how people can say Combat is dumbed down...[snip]

 

I agree completely.

The thing is that it changed in a way so now it is much more player character's skill important (e.g. what perks you have) than player's skill (timing when to attack or block).

 

Your way to success in Skyrim is to apply perks to the weapon you are using and raise your health,and from there and on just get close to an enemy and start mindlessly spamming the attack button.

 

Your way to success in Oblivion though was to block enemy's attacks and attack him the right time that he is vulnerable. You had to decide the right time to attack or to block and play more tactical,or else you could even get seriously harmed from any enemy. That was against enemies that use weapon and shield combo of course. If you had a scamp in the distance though throwing you fireballs, you had to maneuver and strafe sideways to avoid its fireballs,because if you didn't they would harm you enough,even with your shield on.

 

See how things changed ?

 

Honestly? No, i don't. By and large the combat perks (in vanilla) are rubbish. A little extra damage here, a new cinematic finish there. It's still more dependant on knowing when to interupt an enemy attack with a stagger (usually with a shield) knowing how long you have before they recover, your attack speed, and getting in the 2-3 hits you can before they recover. The biggest differance is that you can't backpeddle and jsut wail on them anymore.

 

I personally find myself thinking a lot more about fights in Skyrim (particularly on higher difficulties, without using exploits) than i ever did in Oblivion, even when i wasn't just backpeddling to avoid damage.

[GoodfellowGoodspring]

Just to clear up any confuserings, i was comparing to my experience with Oblivion AND what my expectations were from 'the new era' of Elder scroll games. Edited December 28, 2012 by GoodfellowGoodspring

[luzburg]

Honestly, a lot of this post is why I quit playing skyrim about a month after release. The game just felt so dead to me. Yet, here I am trying to see if it is worth coming back to, and it sadly looks as if these issues have not been addressed.

 

Honestly, Skyrim has been the biggest letdown in a long time.

 

You must have an awesome life if Skyrim is your biggest complaint :O Skyrim has kept me playing just as long as Oblivion by now. The Oblivion combat was such a drag, the levelling system irritating yet I loved it to bits. Skyrim has its flaws and I do think Oblivion was an all round better game. If Oblivion was remade using skyrim combat, and levelling system but with the same magic system I would be in heaven.