Neravarine = Champion of Cyrodiil = Dragonborn?

[zyg0tic]

I also have a theory about the Falmer actually being what the Dwemer became but I dont know enough about Elder Scrolls lore to know any information that would rule out the possibility.

[Tzontlimixtli]

I also have a theory about the Falmer actually being what the Dwemer became but I dont know enough about Elder Scrolls lore to know any information that would rule out the possibility.

 

From the various bits of lore I've read and heard recited, the Dwemer essentially unmade themselves. They attempted to create a god or become gods themselves, but upon activating their creation they reverted back to a pre-mortal state. Essentially immortal because they had gone back to what they would have been before mortals had been created.

 

I THINK.

 

I know that their plans included exploring Aetherius. In other words, they wanted to attempt space-travel.

[WatchMeGoing]

And what's the point of this theory anyway? It does not explain any questions that we currently have about the protags. The "mystery" of why CoC was in that cell is really not so much of a mystry if you understand that bethesda didn't want to force a backstory on the player. And why would that cell not be used? On the extreme rare occasion that the emperor might need to use it, there are guards that can simply subdue the prisoner to ensure the emperor's safety.

 

Instead, all this theory does is create questions and doubts and plot holes that have to be filled with dragonbreaks (worst plot hole filling device ever, I'll get to that) and even "the gods reset his skills". Skills are just a game mechanic. Resetting the skills is not as easy as rolling back the numbers. It would involve very delicate mind and body manipulation on a level that the Aedra and Daedra are not shown to be capable of as far as we know. As you said yourself, they are not omnipotent and for your theory to work, you are giving them new powers that they never had before. Plot hole filling device.

 

Why not simply accept that they are three different people? Do you have anything solid to doubt this? Something that is not for gameplay purposes like the lack of explenation for the CoC's imprisonment.

 

Why are dragonbreaks such a terrible plot hole filling device you ask? "It all happened, yet none of it happened. He is every person, yet he is none of those persons, etc" are sentences that do not make any sense and will never make any sense. Yes, you can put the words on paper (or online), but that does not mean they form a coherent sentence. I was very dissapointed in Bethesda when I first heard of dragonbreaks.

 

So quick recap:

1. Theory doesn't explain anything, just creates things that need explaining

2. You explain those things through ridiculous plot hole filling devices

3. There is nothing that needs to be explained in the first place. The way it is, them being 3 different people, makes perfect sense.

 

So, what do I think of your theory?

0/10, see me after class and I'm telling your mom about your skooma usage.

[Lachdonin]

Why are dragonbreaks such a terrible plot hole filling device you ask? "It all happened, yet none of it happened. He is every person, yet he is none of those persons, etc" are sentences that do not make any sense and will never make any sense. Yes, you can put the words on paper (or online), but that does not mean they form a coherent sentence. I was very dissapointed in Bethesda when I first heard of dragonbreaks.

 

You clearly misunderstand what a Dragonbreak is. They are periods of non-linear time in which all possible realities play out and the laws of causaility don't apply. When time is reestablished, the overtly contradictory events (such as a woman giving birth to her own mother) are canceled out, leaving all remaining timelines to be merged. There is actually a branch of theoretical physics dedicated to the idea of nonlinear time, so the idea is hardly as absurd as you make it sound. Painfully confusing, yes, but not absurd.

 

I do agree, however, that they should be used sparingly. The fact that one has not been used since Daggerfall is reassuring, and i hope they continue the trend.

[fremaochris]

Even though the actual Elder Scrolls have played very littlehttp://www.usbmakeup.com/song9-4.jpghttp://www.dvxs.info/a11.jpghttp://www.usbmakeup.com/18.jpghttp://www.usbmakeup.com/19.jpghttp://www.usbmakeup.com/20.jpghttp://www.usbmakeup.com/21.jpghttp://www.hgniw.info/uk.jpg

[WatchMeGoing]

Why are dragonbreaks such a terrible plot hole filling device you ask? "It all happened, yet none of it happened. He is every person, yet he is none of those persons, etc" are sentences that do not make any sense and will never make any sense. Yes, you can put the words on paper (or online), but that does not mean they form a coherent sentence. I was very dissapointed in Bethesda when I first heard of dragonbreaks.

 

You clearly misunderstand what a Dragonbreak is. They are periods of non-linear time in which all possible realities play out and the laws of causaility don't apply. When time is reestablished, the overtly contradictory events (such as a woman giving birth to her own mother) are canceled out, leaving all remaining timelines to be merged. There is actually a branch of theoretical physics dedicated to the idea of nonlinear time, so the idea is hardly as absurd as you make it sound. Painfully confusing, yes, but not absurd.

 

I do agree, however, that they should be used sparingly. The fact that one has not been used since Daggerfall is reassuring, and i hope they continue the trend.

 

That may be true, although I still think it would cause too many contradictions to make any sense. The fact that a bunch of physicists came up with it, doesn't mean they were right. Scientists have come up with more than one outlandish theories before.

 

But regardless of whether it theoretically makes any sense, my point about dragonbreaks just being a terrible plot hole filling device still stands.

[Tank0123]

And what's the point of this theory anyway? It does not explain any questions that we currently have about the protags. The "mystery" of why CoC was in that cell is really not so much of a mystry if you understand that bethesda didn't want to force a backstory on the player. And why would that cell not be used? On the extreme rare occasion that the emperor might need to use it, there are guards that can simply subdue the prisoner to ensure the emperor's safety.

 

Instead, all this theory does is create questions and doubts and plot holes that have to be filled with dragonbreaks (worst plot hole filling device ever, I'll get to that) and even "the gods reset his skills". Skills are just a game mechanic. Resetting the skills is not as easy as rolling back the numbers. It would involve very delicate mind and body manipulation on a level that the Aedra and Daedra are not shown to be capable of as far as we know. As you said yourself, they are not omnipotent and for your theory to work, you are giving them new powers that they never had before. Plot hole filling device.

 

Why not simply accept that they are three different people? Do you have anything solid to doubt this? Something that is not for gameplay purposes like the lack of explenation for the CoC's imprisonment.

 

Why are dragonbreaks such a terrible plot hole filling device you ask? "It all happened, yet none of it happened. He is every person, yet he is none of those persons, etc" are sentences that do not make any sense and will never make any sense. Yes, you can put the words on paper (or online), but that does not mean they form a coherent sentence. I was very dissapointed in Bethesda when I first heard of dragonbreaks.

 

So quick recap:

1. Theory doesn't explain anything, just creates things that need explaining

2. You explain those things through ridiculous plot hole filling devices

3. There is nothing that needs to be explained in the first place. The way it is, them being 3 different people, makes perfect sense.

 

So, what do I think of your theory?

0/10, see me after class and I'm telling your mom about your skooma usage.

 

There's always going to be questions, mate. Answer one question, you'll find yourself with another.

 

Anyway, I didn't come into this forums just saying outright that the theory MUST be true. It was just an idea -- not even, it's just the basis for a whole plethora of other ideas. I'm quite aware that there's a ton of plot holes -- but all I'm doing is imagining. Anything can true -- as can this.

 

Also, I don't believe I said it was the Aedra or Daedra that "reset" the character's skills. If I did, then let me change that opinion. Could it not be something beyond the Aedra/Daedra, something incomprehensible even to those divine beings? Whatever, it's not the point.

 

Sure, I believe they are three different people. I have no reason to refute it. But I thought it might be an interesting idea for them to all be one person.

 

And the fact is, Dragonbreaks, whether you like them or not, are a part of TES lore. And whether you like it or not, they occur in every game, mentioned or not. That is, while it may not be on the level of Daggerfall's Warp in the West, the fact that your character can choose to become the leader of this guild or that, join one Great House or another -- in the end, the fact that there can be an infinite number of outcomes means that a Dragonbreak, no matter how small, is going to occur. Of course, with your logic, perhaps we should establish a canon storyline where the main character, regardless of the player's actions, HAD to do whatever was mentioned in canon; every other possibility is discounted.

 

It's kind of like taking Fallout: New Vegas, and saying one of the four endings is canon, not regarding the other possible endings. Just saying. But I digress.

 

This theory is intended for people with an open mind. You said yourself:

The "mystery" of why CoC was in that cell is really not so much of a mystry if you understand that bethesda didn't want to force a backstory on the player.

. Yes, I understand that Bethesda didn't want to force a backstory. They didn't. Which is why, in my view, the CoC could just as easily be the Neravarine. That's a view I may choose for myself, and you don't have to agree. It's just one of many possible theories that you could give as to the backstory of the player character.

 

Tl;dr: To each his own. I never said it was true, only that it was a possibility.

 

So, what do I think of your theory?

0/10, see me after class and I'm telling your mom about your skooma usage.

 

Skooma? Pfft. You have no idea. I've been hitting that greenmote with a hint of Sleeping Tree Sap.

Edited January 4, 2013 by Tank0123

[WatchMeGoing]

There's always going to be questions, mate. Answer one question, you'll find yourself with another.

 

Anyway, I didn't come into this forums just saying outright that the theory MUST be true. It was just an idea -- not even, it's just the basis for a whole plethora of other ideas. I'm quite aware that there's a ton of plot holes -- but all I'm doing is imagining. Anything can true -- as can this.

 

Also, I don't believe I said it was the Aedra or Daedra that "reset" the character's skills. If I did, then let me change that opinion. Could it not be something beyond the Aedra/Daedra, something incomprehensible even to those divine beings? Whatever, it's not the point.

 

Sure, I believe they are three different people. I have no reason to refute it. But I thought it might be an interesting idea for them to all be one person.

 

And the fact is, Dragonbreaks, whether you like them or not, are a part of TES lore. And whether you like it or not, they occur in every game, mentioned or not. That is, while it may not be on the level of Daggerfall's Warp in the West, the fact that your character can choose to become the leader of this guild or that, join one Great House or another -- in the end, the fact that there can be an infinite number of outcomes means that a Dragonbreak, no matter how small, is going to occur. Of course, with your logic, perhaps we should establish a canon storyline where the main character, regardless of the player's actions, HAD to do whatever was mentioned in canon; every other possibility is discounted.

 

It's kind of like taking Fallout: New Vegas, and saying one of the four endings is canon, not regarding the other possible endings. Just saying. But I digress.

 

This theory is intended for people with an open mind. You said yourself:

The "mystery" of why CoC was in that cell is really not so much of a mystry if you understand that bethesda didn't want to force a backstory on the player.

. Yes, I understand that Bethesda didn't want to force a backstory. They didn't. Which is why, in my view, the CoC could just as easily be the Neravarine. That's a view I may choose for myself, and you don't have to agree. It's just one of many possible theories that you could give as to the backstory of the player character.

 

Tl;dr: To each his own. I never said it was true, only that it was a possibility.

 

So, what do I think of your theory?

0/10, see me after class and I'm telling your mom about your skooma usage.

 

Skooma? Pfft. You have no idea. I've been hitting that greenmote with a hint of Sleeping Tree Sap.

 

I never meant to imply that you are not allowed to believe this theory for yourself. I was simply giving my personal opinion on your theory, which I thought was the point of this thread. If I misunderstood that, then I apologise.

[Tank0123]

There's always going to be questions, mate. Answer one question, you'll find yourself with another.

 

Anyway, I didn't come into this forums just saying outright that the theory MUST be true. It was just an idea -- not even, it's just the basis for a whole plethora of other ideas. I'm quite aware that there's a ton of plot holes -- but all I'm doing is imagining. Anything can true -- as can this.

 

Also, I don't believe I said it was the Aedra or Daedra that "reset" the character's skills. If I did, then let me change that opinion. Could it not be something beyond the Aedra/Daedra, something incomprehensible even to those divine beings? Whatever, it's not the point.

 

Sure, I believe they are three different people. I have no reason to refute it. But I thought it might be an interesting idea for them to all be one person.

 

And the fact is, Dragonbreaks, whether you like them or not, are a part of TES lore. And whether you like it or not, they occur in every game, mentioned or not. That is, while it may not be on the level of Daggerfall's Warp in the West, the fact that your character can choose to become the leader of this guild or that, join one Great House or another -- in the end, the fact that there can be an infinite number of outcomes means that a Dragonbreak, no matter how small, is going to occur. Of course, with your logic, perhaps we should establish a canon storyline where the main character, regardless of the player's actions, HAD to do whatever was mentioned in canon; every other possibility is discounted.

 

It's kind of like taking Fallout: New Vegas, and saying one of the four endings is canon, not regarding the other possible endings. Just saying. But I digress.

 

This theory is intended for people with an open mind. You said yourself:

The "mystery" of why CoC was in that cell is really not so much of a mystry if you understand that bethesda didn't want to force a backstory on the player.

. Yes, I understand that Bethesda didn't want to force a backstory. They didn't. Which is why, in my view, the CoC could just as easily be the Neravarine. That's a view I may choose for myself, and you don't have to agree. It's just one of many possible theories that you could give as to the backstory of the player character.

 

Tl;dr: To each his own. I never said it was true, only that it was a possibility.

 

So, what do I think of your theory?

0/10, see me after class and I'm telling your mom about your skooma usage.

 

Skooma? Pfft. You have no idea. I've been hitting that greenmote with a hint of Sleeping Tree Sap.

 

I never meant to imply that you are not allowed to believe this theory for yourself. I was simply giving my personal opinion on your theory, which I thought was the point of this thread. If I misunderstood that, then I apologise.

 

And I apologize as well, for assuming that you were making such an assertion. Your contribution to this thread is most valuable, and I would not like to scare away discussion by appearing to be dogmatic.

 

Just my idea, anyway. An idea with many holes, true, but one that does hold together slightly.

[RatcatcherOfKvatch]

Here's a zinger for you: just like Alduin screwed up and saved the Dragonborn by trying to kill him at Helgen, the Mythic Dawn likewise screwed up when they planted the wrong person -- Ann Marie, civilian expert on Oblivion -- instead of the agent that was supposed to be in that cell as part of the plot to kill the Emperor.

 

The evidence for Ann Marie being an Oblivion expert is pretty solid: who else knows how to turn Sigil Stones into usable equipment? (She knows this from Day 0; it must be part of her background story whatever that may be.) The only others I know of who can use Sigil Stones (besides Phinis Gestor who wasn't born yet) are Martin Septim, certain members of the Mythic Dawn including the Camoran Family ... and Ann Marie. This explains how the Dawn confused her with their agent.

 

It makes a later event a much closer call: just as the Blades [mistakenly] figure out you're the one sent to kill the Emperor, the Emperor saves you: "No, she can help us ..."

Edited January 22, 2014 by RatcatcherOfKvatch