Combat: Has this been done?

[RedDevilCG]

Something I've always thought should be included in modern "realistic" mods and games:

When you reload a weapon using a magazine (most automatic weapons) that still has bullets in it, you would lose those bullets from your total pool of bullets. Those un-expended bullets would essentially fall to the ground along with the weapon magazine. A 30 round magazine with 15 bullets left would mean 45 bullets total would be removed from your pool if you dropped it out and put in a full 30 round magazine again. This would make constant reloading of full automatic weapons a huge drain of your bullet pool. (Bang-Bang! Reload. Bang! Reload. 3 shots fired out of 60 bullets loaded)

 

If you need to conserve rounds, you would want to use every bullet in the magazine before dropping it on the ground and slapping in a new one. Heck for bonus points, remove the "bullets in clip" number, so you are never quite sure how many shots you have left till your rifle/pistol goes *CLICK* unless you are counting them (something you are taught to do in the military).

 

I think this would add a considerable amount of fear and adrenaline to the game, wondering if you're going to be left twisting in the breeze if your magazine only had 19 rounds in it when you could have sworn it had the full 30 rounds. I think I would be sweating bullets anyways! (hahaaha, funny? awww..... sorryness). Is there a Fallout 3 mod that has included this into a more realistic combat mod?

 

Having infinite magazines is similar and could also be removed as well, but god how would you implement that into a game? Some suggestions on how to do that would be cool! Maybe after 4 clips, you need to take cover, and hand reload them (10seconds per magazine?). Or switch to a backup weapon that already has it's magazines full and ready.

 

This would affect reloading shotguns, or revolvers as you would just be adding rounds to the clip/chamber when you reload.

 

RedDevil.

 

P.S. Yes I realize that there are also a million other things that are unrealistic, such as carrying multiple weapons, 1000s of weightless bullets etc. etc. But it's true that fun has to trump realism at some point. We don't want this game to turn into a logistics simulator.

[spineynorman]

if you're going to add clip reloading you might as well add tactical reloads so you don't have to rechamber your weapon if you leave a round unfired. But then again, I don't know if it would be fun. The distinction between most mods is adding fps functionality or adding roleplaying features; if you add too much of either the game stops being balanced and requires even more work to fix. The last games I played with this feature were the original Rainbow Six series, but you didn't have to manage an infinite inventory in that environment. I don't want to have to flip through an entire page of "smg clip 15 rounds" just to reload a weapon: the roleplay aspect assumes your character already is.

[sumoftwosins]

I think the only time having the magazine function, as you propose, would make the game harder is at the beginning when you don't have much. Later on in the game, you're going to have a stock pile of ammo and losing 3 rounds here or there, isn't going to do much. If we want to go that far to make it realistic, then we're going to need duct tape for our mags.

[jkruse05]

The problem with this is, it's not realistic. A soldier in the field may discard a few rounds, but if they reload after only a few shots they aren't going to discard, say, 23/30 rounds. To really be realistic you need a mod that makes you lose all rounds if below, say, 10, but if there are more it stores the amount, and when you run out of full mags you start loading partials. That would be realism taken to a new level for reloading. In any case, doing what you suggest really depends on the game. For some it works, for others it doesn't. With no ammo limits it wouldn't really have a huge effect in Fallout 3.

[ZableBlaze]

For people who don't understand;

 

You have 100 rounds.

You pull out your 10mm pistol, you lose 12.

100-12 = 88

If you don't shoot any, rounds go back to 100 (if you switch gun)

 

You shoot two rounds

88-2 = 86

You reload

86+10 = 96

This is the vanilla formla.

 

You shoot two rounds.

88-2 = 86

You reload

86 -+ 0 (adds or removes nothing)

86-12 = 74

This is the formula he wants (and I want too).

 

The one that he wants, is much more realistic and would add more strategy to the battlesystem for instance;

'I'm surrounded by three raiders, I have 10 rounds in my gun, and 15 rounds in my inventory. If I reload now, I will have a small amount of extra rounds to shoot - but at the cost of 10 whole rounds. But if I'm unable to kill them all in my ten shots, I'll have to reload, hence take cover. This will take around 1-2 seconds to reload, in which time they would have reached my cover and started shooting me. Or I could reload now, have an extra five rounds and hope that it's enough to finish them'

 

I'd -love- the hardcore version too, completely removing where it tells you how many rounds you have left. I'd absolotely love that (I already play with no 'sneak' message).

 

I'm not sure the realistic reload can be done, since reload is hardcoded (I don't believe there is an OnReload script command either).

[soulsquisher]

This would be a pretty cool mod, but I think you should be able to pick up your dropped magazines to reclaim rounds later.

[RedDevilCG]

ZableBlaze: Yes, you and I are thinking alike.

 

I just downloaded the GECK, and I am so far completely overwhelmed. I have never modded before, so I am feeling pretty timid thus far. If I can get this running though, I think it will be a cool little addition to the game. Some people have said that they feel the game is too easy because there is a plethora of gear and ammunition. The scrounging aspect of the game is not central enough for their tastes. There have already been a lot of solutions, such as mods that decrease the number of items in stash boxes, but this idea has been overlooked, and it would add a small amount care and thought put into weapon choice, and tactical use.

 

Right now, I think all my other suggestions are way over my head, so I am just going to see if I can get unspent rounds removed from your ammo pool when you initiate a reload, and nothing else.

 

Well, here's hoping I can put something together before 2010!

 

RD.

[sumoftwosins]

ZableBlaze: Yes, you and I are thinking alike.

 

I just downloaded the GECK, and I am so far completely overwhelmed. I have never modded before, so I am feeling pretty timid thus far. If I can get this running though, I think it will be a cool little addition to the game. Some people have said that they feel the game is too easy because there is a plethora of gear and ammunition. The scrounging aspect of the game is not central enough for their tastes. There have already been a lot of solutions, such as mods that decrease the number of items in stash boxes, but this idea has been overlooked, and it would add a small amount care and thought put into weapon choice, and tactical use.

 

Right now, I think all my other suggestions are way over my head, so I am just going to see if I can get unspent rounds removed from your ammo pool when you initiate a reload, and nothing else.

 

Well, here's hoping I can put something together before 2010!

 

RD.

 

 

Though I like the idea of not knowing how many bullets you have left without counting your shots, but you will not be able to get it to be like the "real" world. Such as popping the mag out and looking at the back of the mag to see how many you have left. Not to mention, being able to judge the weight of your magazine. For once I'd like to see a game where the bullets don't shoot straight.

 

I really like the idea of realism games, but for the most part people tend to not include some of the most important aspects of reality.

 

 

Regardless, you could probable look at the script that handles the reload message or the script for when you run out of ammo. There would have to be a built in function that checks your ammo count. Once you located that, you should be able to base your script from it. If I get a chance I will have a look see and if I find anything, I will let you know.

[Saurcastic]

if you're going to add clip reloading you might as well add tactical reloads so you don't have to rechamber your weapon if you leave a round unfired. But then again, I don't know if it would be fun. The distinction between most mods is adding fps functionality or adding roleplaying features; if you add too much of either the game stops being balanced and requires even more work to fix. The last games I played with this feature were the original Rainbow Six series, but you didn't have to manage an infinite inventory in that environment. I don't want to have to flip through an entire page of "smg clip 15 rounds" just to reload a weapon: the roleplay aspect assumes your character already is.

 

 

This.

 

I'd say that if you wanted to go ahead and implement something like it, then a tap of the reload button should execute an emergency reload (drop the mag, slap a fresh one in) and you lose the mag/rounds/whatever. If you hold the reload button down, then it executes a tactical reload and the rounds are saved, but at the expense of taking longer time.

 

There'll always be a scale of gameplay vs. realism to balance.

[RedDevilCG]

Not a bad idea. First I'll see if I get get the reload to do anything other than the norm, then I'll see about adding perks to it.