Insisting on Lore, your Mod is too weird for TES

[daventry]

Lore is what you make it in your game, otherwise why even bother giving folks a Creation Kit?

 

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-5vGEwDBmJRw/TdPVXAvVPrI/AAAAAAAAAF4/bOoBPDiioZ4/s1600/winner.gif

Edited June 28, 2013 by daventry

[rizon72]

Lore is what you make it in your game, otherwise why even bother giving folks a Creation Kit?

Exactly.

 

I've seen very well made mods that people say are not lore-friendly. The problem is even among the 'lore' group, they can't agree with what is actually lore and what isn't.

[Indigoblade]

Technically, anything we make here breaks lore, because the original game creators did not put our content in, we did. So ANYONE WHO FLAME ABOUT LORE BREAKING, YOUR BREAKING LORE BY USING MODS. "Oh I want to make this girl prettier" LORE BROKE! "I want to change the texture of this tree" LORE BROKE! "I want to..." BROKE! To tell you the truth, every mod is kinda a fanfiction that us lonely girls (modders) write about our saucy dreams about the neighbor boy (perfect Skyrim experience).

Edited June 29, 2013 by Indigoblade

[TehKaoZ]

Mods that are considered un-lore friendly or "silly" get flamed about that because it is a convenient way to flame them. Every mod has the occasional troll or "flamer" but one wouldnt flame a "lore friendly" mod by saying it isn't lore friendly (at least the ones who have any common sense). It's like making fun of a persons weight because you don't like the person and the weight simply becomes the convienient target to hurt the person. I bet anything those who flame non-lore friendly mods probably flame lore friendly ones but in a differen't manner. Point is, these people exist and it's why we have moderators.

[bben46]

The 'lore' in TES has changed with each game - Bethesda is not interested in lore but in making a game. Nothing in 'lore' is set in stone. Anything can (and will ) be changed if they need to change it to make the next game work the way they want it to work. As for mods, why do you care what someone else makes for their game? You are not required to use it in yours if you choose not to. So HOW can a mod that you are not going to use possibly affect your game?http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f351/charonn0/ohgeez-1.gif

[pheo3309]

The 'lore' in TES has changed with each game - Bethesda is not interested in lore but in making a game. Nothing in 'lore' is set in stone. Anything can (and will ) be changed if they need to change it to make the next game work the way they want it to work. As for mods, why do you care what someone else makes for their game? You are not required to use it in yours if you choose not to. So HOW can a mod that you are not going to use possibly affect your game?http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f351/charonn0/ohgeez-1.gif

 

 

It changes through time however, it doesn't just up and change to change (except game mechanics). It's like the book that blew up Red Mountain. It's canonical. But it's not a game either, however it adds to the lore of the mythos. Bethesda isn't just about making the game, they're about creating stories for us to play through, enjoy, and take something from it. Mainly enjoyment, but there are lessons, cognitive tests, and quests that require us to think outside the box in terms of puzzles (it may be easy for some, but it can be hard for others). I think the main thing that people have to remember is that additions in the game isn't necessarily lore breaking. Myself, yes, I'm a lore-buff. I want the game as close to the canon as possible, but that doesn't mean that certain mods cannot happen. For instance some of the quest mods, they could still happen. It's not a major event, and there's not a full on recorder of specific events unless it was extremely noticeable or so impacting that it travels from province to province. Now there can be time constraints and whatnot with certain aspects of something, but that's the beauty of the magic that is The Elder Scrolls. There's loads one can do with explanations. But if someone doesn't like it, they don't have to download it.

 

And as for someone saying that modding the game is breaking the lore, that's not necessarily true either. It only breaks lore when times are re-arranged or potentially mythos breaking; IE, the moons falling from the sky to destroy Nirn. It's an over the top example, but look at it this way, things like that would be recorded into the timeline as it's a major and quite noticeable event. So for instance, the Void Nights. That was noticeable. However such things as making a character to your liking, that isn't lore breaking. Now if the Dragonborn is using an AK57 Uzi Radar Laser Tripple Barreled Double Scoped Heat Seeking Shotgun, that I think would be lore breaking due to the fact that the technology just isn't there (I would even doubt the Dwemer could make it, they'd just use their ballistas for deer hunting) . Does it mean I'd hate it? Nah. People can make what they like. That's why we have the kit. To modify our personal tastes. I'd have a chuckle and look at the page, but would I use it? No. But I wouldn't sass or harass them. In fact quite the opposite. I'd rather encourage them to grow in their capabilities of modding.

 

All in all it's not about the quantity of mods, it's the quality of the mod and the modder. If a modder wants to express their ideas through a mod and it's not lore/canon, I'm not going to stop them and I won't complain. Why? Because the things that I've seen being pulled off is opening up doors for canon modders too. Look at EnaiSiaion's Apocalypse Spell Package. Then look at his Dwemerverse Spell Package. Not only did he open doors, he broke GROUND with them. Same with Xilver who made MidasMagic. He broke ground in Oblivion and carried it over to Skyrim. Do I think some spells in MidasMagic is non-lorefriendly? Yep. Due to the sheer power of some of them. Did I download for grins and giggles? Oh you bet your bottom I did! But did I hate them? No. There are some of us out there that are interested in lore, but we don't hate on mods or modders that aren't lore friendly. It's just as subjective as it is objective. It's all relative to the person and people are forgetting this. That or trolling. I'd think it's more trolling than forgetting though, to be quite honest.

 

For the TL; DR: Mods that are not lore friendly can still push the envelope for the ones that are lore friendly. If someone doesn't think it's lore friendly, don't download it. That's what I do. But I still encourage the mod author to grow in their capabilities of modding because I think it's important as a community to actually communicate.

Edited June 29, 2013 by pheo3309

[AfroGamerNinja]

Besides, if you love lore SO much, why don't you all go to the hellhole that is the official TES forums, where people spam civil war threads? I swear...

[pheo3309]

Besides, if you love lore SO much, why don't you all go to the hellhole that is the official TES forums, where people spam civil war threads? I swear...

 

Because there are those of us lore lovers that don't mind non-lore friendly mods. I personally don't download them, but I don't believe in harassing those that make them. They bought the game, they should make what they want, within legal reasons of course.

Edited June 30, 2013 by pheo3309

[daventry]

I wanted to start a New Thread, but i will ask here, why do People insist on telling Members to use the Console when they made a Mod, i mean can you sit through your Game without any Mods and just use the Console

[Lachdonin]

The 'lore' in TES has changed with each game - Bethesda is not interested in lore but in making a game.

 

I disagree with this. Bethesda is very much interested in their lore, which is why they go to lengths to tie in earlier references (Jyggalag, the Shor and Sovengarde) and concepts (the Voice, dragonblood) while trying to maintain the coherence of the world of Mundus. They don't just throw in random crap, they find ways to make it fit logically with the rules and laws of the universe they have created.

 

Yes, the lore changes, but as Pheo pointed out, it's not at random and for no reason. It evolves while maintaining it's own internal coherency. Claiming that the fact it changes and expands shows that Bethesda doesn't care about their background is like saying JRR Martin doesn't care about his Song of Fire and Ice because he keeps putting out new books. Since most of our information also comes from in-universe sources, it's also like claiming that WE (as humans in the real world) don't care anything about our lore because history is constantly changing.

 

 

As for lore-unfriendly mods... I don't mind their existence. Some of them boggle my mind as to why people even bother. All the Asian schoolgirl crap stuff for instance. Its indicative of some deeper social and ethical issues that may need addressing... Anyway, even that doesn't bother me, because I simply don't use it.

 

What bothers me, however, is when a mod claims to be lore friendly but isn't, and the maker(s) flatly reject all lore based arguments against it. An example of this would be the Musket Mod, which once upon a time had an extensive thread based on whether or not muskets could be integrated into the TES universe. The decision was made from the get-go, however, that reasoning was irrelevant, and it was going to be done anyway, and for a long time the mod still carried with it the totally fictitious claim of being 'Lore Friendly'.

 

I don't care if people want to run around in mini skirts, killing Pony-Dragons with inflatable dildos. It's their game, they are free to exercise their own brand of insanity however they want. I do care, however, when people are deceptive about the nature of their content, particularly when it claims to offer a lore friendly experience.