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What to make of a certain synth at the end of the game?

shaun synth son

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#11
Moraelin

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Well, maybe, but then by the same token you can't disprove that he's really Colin Moriarty. I mean, even the age fits. Moriarty is 50 in Fallout 3, so he'd be pretty much exactly the right age to be Father.

You can't disprove he's Dr Lesko. After all, both shared a passion for science -- and specifically BIOscience and DNA manipulation -- and a total lack of considering what could go wrong for others. Both cared more about saving the results of the research more than about repairing the damage or anything. And frankly Lesko looks a lot more like default Shaun if you put a beard on him, than James ever did. Look at the eyebrows for example.

You can't disprove that he's Mr Burke. After all, he too seems to survive enough to send the Talons after you after you reach a certain Karma point.

You can't disprove he's Cromwell. The age is about right, and not much about Cromwell or his life before arriving in Megaton were known.

Etc.

Basically, sure, everyone could be lying and everything, but at that point you have at best a big fat nothing and at worst an argument from ignorance to connect the two characters. But the same could apply to almost any FO3 character. I mean, even old man Wilks could just fake his death and high-tail it to the institute when the going gets tough.

Having it "proven" by just dismissing the counter-arguments is basically reversing the burden of proof, which is the definition of an argument from ignorance.

And, frankly, I like more meat than that on my conspiracy theories :tongue:

#12
CyrusAmell

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Well, I never meant ill by the suggestion nor did I say I proved it. It is completely upon Bethesda's initiative if they want to make such a connection.

 

Both characters have similar beard and hair style and reflect the choices that the player character makes in their creation. I always thought it odd that the VIP of the Institute never got around to having a family despite being the most eligible nerd bachelor ever. This connection would flush out the character's history significantly. Sure, Shaun could have been gay or asexual but he seems pretty alone at the top when we do meet him. Why were we the only one by his bedside when he was dying?

 

If we do not get any DLC on the subject matter then it is all moot, it's not true and even if it is it does not matter at all to the player. An open secret no one will uncover or confirm is a waste of time.

 

I just thought that it would be a great basis for a new DLC or even an expansion. I have not tried to see if synth Shaun can be killed before or after blowing up the Institute (This is a Bethesda game so probably not) which makes him a sort of constant for all players even if they leave him behind.  


Edited by CyrusAmell, 08 January 2016 - 04:26 AM.


#13
Moraelin

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Well, the simpler explanation is that someone at Bethesda wrote the same story twice, with a different twist. Is it really so hard to believe that someone would just reuse a template?

The longer version is that, well, a LOT of stories after 1970 or so are actually just mass produced by the same template. At some point the monomyth became the alpha and omega, to the point where Hollywood even has courses for writers on how to crap every story into the same mold, down to which twist happens at which percentage of the movie's length.

I wish I could even say it's the same story with different characters, but the characters too are basically just implementing a fixed set of archetypes. E.g., Father is bog standard Contagonist archetype, but so is Darth Vader for example.

The bad news is... well, once you've started to notice that you're being told the same story again and again, you're going to notice that lots. I'm sorry.

#14
CyrusAmell

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Welll... crud. 

 

Still don't know what to make of our synth kid. Guess I'll just keep bringing him hot pates and telephones until I find evidence he is building a robot army with the spare parts. 



#15
Moraelin

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Well, if you find him flying off in an Iron Man outfit, I guess it won't be a big surprise :wink:

#16
jcdenton2012

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Seems somewhat unlikely, especially since the only real resemblance is disappearing as soon as you edit the character and the wife.

 

Both characters disappear quickly when the game begins, both are the object of a long search before another part of the game begins, both seem to die right in front of you (in the case of Shaun more permanently) and, lastly, both try to leave the player character with a place to live underground where it is safe. There is a pattern, and it could all come together really easily. 

 

And this explains a possible purpose for the young synth Shaun, don't you think? And from the perspective of an F3 player, you are actually playing your own grandparent. 

 

And if the Courier from New Vegas is actually a synth, for which there is some evidence, then the characters in F3, New Vegas, and F4 are all related in some way. I know New Vegas was made by Obsidian while F3 and F4 were made by Bethesda Softworks but it's always possible that there is a connection.

 

Now if Bethesda does not give a flying mole-rat eyeball about any of this then fine, give us another dlc were we get abducted by aliens or have to settle a dispute between warring tribals. Then again, we can go north to Canada and fight mutant moose and crazed mounties amidst a permanent nuclear winter. 

 

If the Courier from New Vegas is a synth I for one would not be surprised at all. Just think of all the badass crap we did in that game. We were a literal one-man-army who single handily slaughtered our way across the Hoover Damn through a horde of Legion soldiers. That's Courser territory, on the scale of deadliness for the Fallout Universe. 



#17
CyrusAmell

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If the Courier from New Vegas is a synth I for one would not be surprised at all. Just think of all the badass crap we did in that game. We were a literal one-man-army who single handily slaughtered our way across the Hoover Damn through a horde of Legion soldiers. That's Courser territory, on the scale of deadliness for the Fallout Universe. 


 

 

My thoughts exactly. I mean, despite obviously being over-qualified for such a position we see the Courier take on a profession that does not let someone stay in one place and requires traveling vast distances.The Courier has at times been shown to have little recollection of his or her past, which could be signs of a quick mind-wipe to ensure safety. The Courier survived the initial blast that tore up the Divide, two shots to the head and having his or her brain removed and separated from the skull (meaning he or she is more than just durable). The Courier is not from the NCR, as this is something that would have come up when dealing with the Kings. Lastly, the Courier also seems to know enough Chinese to use  Chinese Army Manuals to increase the Sneak skill and can speak with the Dead Horse and Sorrow tribes of Honest Hearts which shows the Courier is remarkably intelligent.

 

So the Courier is quite elite, or at least ridiculously lucky. But of all the protagonists in the series, he or she is the most likely to be a synth. Especially a Courser given their affinity for combat. Doesn't matter much really, New Vegas is past and done.

 

I just still want to go to the Canadian border in Fallout 4 and fight mutant moose with an energy weapon powered with radioactive maple syrup. It could happen....


Edited by CyrusAmell, 13 January 2016 - 02:55 AM.


#18
Athanasa

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Regarding the kid (and not reading the rest of this thread), apparently Synth-Shaun can't age. At all. He will always be a child, physically and mentally (because he's been programmed as such).



#19
Moraelin

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Except for the fact that in both FO3 and FO4, that's not how a mind-wipe works. Those guys aren't left with an amnesia, but given someone else's memories. Harkness even states that now he has both sets of memories, if you use the memory recall code on him.

 

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with the idea of being a Courser. I mean even in FO4, you're actually even better than the actual coursers, and have attributes that are mentioned in the research notes. E.g., clearly you can aim more accurately with iron sights than any professional sniper, which is something that's specifically a recent courser upgrade.

 

Which now gives me a bit of an idea of why they gave me a synth kid too ;)

 

But having NO memories is not evidence for that. It's like the polar opposite of both Institute and Railroad standard procedure.



#20
CyrusAmell

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The science of memory wipes is not set in stone, and botched procedures have been known to happen. If a Courser did decide to make a run for it, they might have tried to jury rig something on their own to fix their memory.

 

Basically, excuses can be made. 







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