Yueviathan

What follower mod are you using? I use AFT and had this issue a few times but manage to fix it on my own. I hope you have a save that is right before you encounter her, because that will help. One way to fix it is to reload before encountering her and making sure Onmund is not following you. You can also use console click on her, type disable then type enable to see if the options change. and another way I fix it is well there was a mod I had installed that I didn't realize causes issues. The mod " To your face" or any mod that changes when an NPC talks to you can cause issues with shez. There are dialogs that need to trigger without interruption, and mods like To your face, interrupt the flow of some dialogs thus causing Onmund of ingv to not be responsive or to have missing dialog trees. So check your load order for any mods that may do these type of things. This is what helped me but if none of this helps, my apologies. Hope all the best.

How is progress going with this mod Anbee? And are there plans to have Onmund more intractable with other followers that have been released? I don't know what's going on, it has been a while, but I want to say thank you for your work, and I hope you are able to finish this project. I have been playing with other follower mods that have come out and or got massive updates, and I want to tell you. That even now, what you have done here with this mod, with Onmund is an example of truly bringing a character to life as a person and not just a companion to compliment the adventure or optional content to unlock. I find myself, when I don't have this mod installed (play with Mod organizer so some profiles don't have Shezz installed) missing reactions and opinions and or outlooks on the things I have done, the smaller quest the little things that often overlooked by other companions. I find myself missing the tension and urgency to what's happening around me that feels more alive just by Onmund being there. I also miss the genuine debates, I like being able to argue with my followers but not the disagreement part per say but more having my own reason to do something and my companion and or friend having a different reason for being apart of it or choosing not to be a part of it at all. You can agree to do the same task but have different reasons for doing so, or disagree but still work together, strength in resolve and knowing where people stand is a good thing. I like that level of attention because it is often a form of respect, not only for the character your playing but the follower that with you. A follower that is ok with everything you do I respect less because it feels like they have no respect for themselves. Just as I often dislike a follower that is not aware of the things you are doing or is only about their task and nothing more. I hate when it feels like the player has to mold themselves to the follower's narrative to the point it feels like who the player is and what they have done and why is ignored. Many followers I feel make the mistake of talking at you but not to you. I say all this because I find this mod to be one of very few to make these mistakes the least in most cases or not at all in others. I hope what I'm saying makes sense, but I just hope that you will be able to finish this project because I don't know if it's been said enough, but what your doing here really is a one of a kind and very well done. Thank you

I would very much like to second the last paragraph. I may not be that far along with his quests & dialogues, but it's pretty much apparent that while Onmund has the intention and the drive to make his world "perfect", the notion itself shows how naive he is. Of course he's willing to see that he himself is flawed, but after suffering vehement abuse from one group, then finding acceptance from that group's antithesis, his willingness to help made him easy to manipulate and be biased based on his experienced. One cannot help but base their worldview on the principles he received firsthand. He is not a conscious propaganda-spewing agent - he honestly believes that everyone from his branch of Thalmor, or at least their leader (a surrogate mother figure) would do and feel about his goals as he does (that's why they are in the same group, right?), even if he and they have to dirty their hands. He seems to recognize problems well enough in other factions, but it's easy to see issues everywhere, except within. :smile: I'd find it really intriguing if later chapters show some kind of character development for him regarding this. He's spending time with the Dragonborn (who may be a treasured friend or lover), away from the Thalmor. Will it make him to look at his views from a different perspective? Maybe I'm overthinking this, but I love roleplaying, and this mod gives me an opportunity to do just that. Especially with him, because I'm quite strict when it comes to my characters' personality, morals and integrity. If anything in this resembles a realistic take of how relationships work, a few spats and differences in opinion shouldn't have an irreparable influence, so I'm noe afraid to make my cgaracter give him a piece of his mind, whether he likes it or not. Kinda similar to the Dragon Age series Anbee menrioned: I used to play those in the same vein, telling companions if I thought they were wrong, or if my character's views differed. I was not adored by everyone, but lip-servicing them and choosing all the "right answers" is an easy trap to fall into, which I would avoid. I really do hope that I can complete this mod like this (even if I can't, I will, because I'm not compromising my character :tongue:), and it will bring a little drama or tension to this whole relationship. A few new dialogue options for a more rounded debate with him would be awesome, but I can understand that the plot in itself has to stand first, and the characters have a sort of a duty to move it forward to its desired course, needing some sacrifice. Headcanon always helps with the rough edges, but I hope we will not be too pigeon-holed later in the story (after the prologue). I'm not wishing to criticize, quite the opposite: I think most here can agree with me that we get so few opportunities to enjoy roleplaying with an in-depth, detailed and lifelike (especially compered to vanilla) companion & story that we desperately wish to squeeze the last drop of enjoyment out of it. Apart from a few moments where my character was a little forced into some of the answers, I love this mod, and find analising & testing it very fun. Thanks for listening to our ramblings. :D I couldn't agree more Nova. Thank you so much for the amazing mod Anbee and the continuing work. Look forward to the full package

Applause!!!! Yay, this is the type of discussion I was hoping would happen in this thread and thank you so much for the very in-depth answers from the both you ibraw and you Anbee.Anbee I fully respect this approach to a character well done and figured that maybe the intent. For me, this mod is challenging the moral of both myself and my character as you can see.As well as the choices in answers and actions provided which I'm aware is hard to cover.I find myself trying to reason with Onmund or feeling the need to provide a third option that can be a compromise to the options he sees or neutralize the hate he has. For my character right now, my bond with him is strong and I don't want to damage it. However at the same time wish to stand firm in my beliefs while meeting his, my character wants to save him from his hate. And help him see things from the ones he demonizes. I understand all well why Onmund has the feelings he does as would many, the problem is once you commit such an act of revenge, it tends to loop infinitely. I wouldn't compare magic in this game universe to technology or even how we handle it. Not to mention we do have a restriction on technology that does indeed work. Restriction on most weapons work, and well there's a reason people aren't dying from nukes and biothreats every day. Restrictions regulations do work, and while other forms of violence can take its place in other areas, but overall an attempt to stop the violence does work. Whereas in Tamriel where everyone and their grandmother has a weapon and or knows a spell. The justice isn't as well distributed in that universe, in fact, it very much a wild wild west in Tamriel. If the bandit attacks aren't an indication alone. I mean threw out the game your attack by everything and you witness every hold attack by everything, and well the attacks that do the most damage are vampire attacks, dragons, and if you lure a rogue mage near a hold. Lets not even talk about the damage the Dragonborn he/she can do on their own accord >.<. Personally, I like the concept of magic and technology used together and mages embraced and using magic to better the world. I agree with Onmund's dream here in that sense however without any rules or consequences when people do wrong and people are killed because it's definitely a when not if. This just sounds like an ultimatum for those who already lost so much, and yeah I just wish I can say that to him or show threw actions where I stand without it seeming like one side or another. Because that does bother me that we have to fall on one side or the other, and not be an entirely new concept or something that's in the middle of both ideals. However, that may also be the point, that no matter what you do Onmund may only see it one or two ways. Either way, I'm finding the mod to be morally challenging since my route is trying to keep Onmund at my side while also seeing more and more our views collide and I like that. For me I RP my character creating a universal peace for all of Tamriel eventually when becoming high king or ascending. Basically doing a tiber septom, but uniting everyone. Finding a peace among the different views or a compromise that's close enough and makes most of the people happy. So I find this mod to be a very realistic challenge to a Dragonborn that wishes to do this and I thank you for that.

Hmm, it might be legacy of the dragon born that added that npc, My apologies v.v

Alright, I don't like critiquing the writing that goes into a mod especially in this case as I adore a lot of it. However, I just finished or rather endured a monologue of a conversation with Onmund That irritated the hell out of me, not only for what felt to me to be short sidedness but lack of options for the player. The dialog in question is on the thalmar topic tree and you can ask why the thalmor despise the phijis. I found the flow of this conversation to be very one-sided and not thought threw. I choose two ways to approach this topic, the first time around I noted that magic indeed is something that should be treated with caution as to who has full access to it. Or rather the concept of everyone using magic as default I do not agree with and this was the closest choice to support that logic.Onmund's counter-arguments sounded very one dimensional or rather extremely bias to me. Dismissing the dangers of magic and comparing it to swords and politics, which I found absurd. I then choose the next dialog available to counter that view which brought up two magic users that caused great destruction, and again it was met with this logic that sounded like "There will always be evil people and if magic was not the means of there violence something else would be." I find this type of stance to have a huge flaw in its argument. It's not about whether bad people will do bad things. It's about not ignoring threats and removing severe consequences and preventing mass loss of life. Wars, you see coming, politics you see coming, swords you see coming, but magic can be hidden or invoked be on purpose or accidentally and can and HAS cause such chaos mass slaughter and destruction that can be hard fought let alone prepared for. Its impossible to stop every threat, but that doesn't mean add more numbers to the already poorly handled situation. Making a potential killer or destructive accident a needle in a haystack is not a good ideal. Not to mention not everyone is blessed with the ability to use magic in the first place. So right out of the gate, there are people with a disadvantage in protecting themselves from would-be abusers. Prioritizing the right to use magic over the loss of life is not a logic I can support. Ignoring the already mass loss of life due to magic without any means to address or even lessen the chances of such things happening again..I can not support such a logic. People need to know that there are consequences to mistreatment of magic, they need to know that there is a standard to what is ok and what is not.They need to know that they can be safe.They have that right to know those things and dismissing that is illogically and cold. I find Onmund's stance to bias and disregard the tragedies and catastrophic damages caused by those that abuse magic to be gross and ignorant. However, this surprises me not as he seems quite ok with the mass slaughter his sister does in their village, Putting their hate aside when his sister did what she did. The village labeled them demons from birth, considered them curses to the village and bringers of doom... Thanks to his sister's action....They were right. You can't wish for magic to be accepted then turn around and commit an act that justifies its restrictions. Then be outrage when people hate you when you ignore mass slaughter. The hypocrisy of it all is beyond damning and you have to find a middle ground. I wanted to say all this to Onmund, to paint a different perspective then thalmor good phijis bad that he seems fixed on.Onmund only seems to understand things from a magic user perspective and bias. This is ok to feel when it only applies to your life, but the moment your in a role that effects masses, you can't be biased like that.That's what creates tyrants, people that can't see things from another perspective aside from their own. I felt his dialog and my options in response to it did not provide room for a middle perspective and that annoyed me because that is where I stand. I want magic and magic users to be embraced, but not without consequences to those that abuse it, and certainly not ignore life already lose or prioritizing magic users over nonmagic users. Onmund says it's not black and white yet only offers a black and white answer.All or nothing is not the right answer...I can not agree. There was a dialog to just blow it over and say whatever, but I do not wish to be flimsy in my morals when challenged but instead to stand firm. I hear Onmund's stance and I have a firm stance on it. At the very least I would rather agree to disagree. Edit: I try and will continue to try and edit what I'm trying to say here, as I love this mod so far but wanted to challenge the logic behind some of the things Onmund says and what the player can say in term or what they can not. This comment is to provide a conversation and wish to apologize for entering real-life subject manner to the conversation as a reference. I do not wish to aggravate a political debate but more a critical thinking challenge due to my love for the dialog and deep meaning already displayed in the mod. So my apologies to any this may of offended.

Ok, so I killed Gredul and thus activated the dark brotherhood questline, and I have chosen to destroy the dark brotherhood. I have killed Astrid and onmund came to where I was and started asking about if I was going to join them...I found the choices to his question to be odd since I had already killed Astrid. The choices to his response were to ignore the invitation and the other two options were to join but in various phrasing. I have chosen to kill and had already done so as well as release the hostages, so I found this to be very jarring. I have now gone to the sanctuary to complete this task. I have done this before so I know who should be there and who should not be. I saw there was someone new called greigor and I spoke to him at first and he talked to me as if I had joined the brotherhood when I had killed everyone else already...Again jarring. I exit out of this dialog and decided to kill him which to my surprise he is essential. On the mod page, it seems noted that either or choices regarding the brotherhood are acceptable, so I'm not sure how to handle this. The quest does complete as normal regardless of the matter but yeah...I'm going to continue to post what is happening threw my playthrew, or rather the things that seem off. Please let me know if this is intentional or if bugs. Thank you again for the mod and hard work.

I also would like to see a tutorial or something on how this process is done. It is the reason I have not used body slide as I only want to convert female armors to male bodies for my own personal use or just so there are male and female options for all armors. I would like all the armors in my game to be wearable for both sexes with the same attachments and all. So please more information on how to do this would be appreciated.