moho25
-
Posts
413 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by moho25
-
-
Question : for mods with open permissions and no way to contact the author, do we reupload immediately, as we come across these, or do we wait for everything to be sorted out ?
Open is open. If the author says folks can distribute the mod at will, we should be good. There's no reason to bother them, and they likely don't want you to. Seems you should be fine to upload, but if you want to PM Dark0ne/SirSalami to be certain, it can't hurt.
-
@Inventoriers --
I've updated the Utilities page to the new format. The others will follow shortly.
A few comments:
1. We're going to keep the Project Owner listed here, as well, as not all owners will be contacted.
2. Permissions information stays mod-specific, since it's possible for authors to have different permissions for different mods.
3. Author Contacted fields stay listed, for the same reason as Project Owner. Also, "yes" is now a valid field. The specifics have been moved to the Contacted Mod Authors sheet.
Let me know if there are other questions, and the Contacted Mod Author sheet is still a WIP.
-
@Tarshana/@Creeper -- And I see the new page for a master list of contacted mod authors.
I was trying to avoid repeating data that's already on the sheets, but I guess it's unavoidable. I'll add yet another step to the instructions and then adjust the sheet formatting a bit.
I may end up removing some of the data in the game-specific sheets if we're now going to have this sheet.
-
@Tarshana, the hello was me :tongue:.
Lol.
@giftfish
"Projects without any downloads can be ignored and should not be placed in the inventory. Be careful, though. Some projects provide Mediafire downloads in the "Project Details", but no downloadable files."
This sentence is a bit confusing to me. Should we ignore projects without any downloadable files or projects that haven't been downloaded ? I suppose the latter is wrong ?
I meant this mostly in regards to projects that never actually get beyond the actual planning stage. As in never released. Some projects -- like ThaneMOD -- have been released and provide Nexus links due to the fact that the files were too big for BSN to host.
That clear things up? I can amend the column header instructions to be clearer.
Why only English sites ? There are many russian modders, and while some of the russian websites do steal mods, others are legit. It certainly is hard to tell, though.
English is the universal language. I realize not everyone speaks it, but it makes sense to stick to sites in English language, as most mods are available only in English.
Like you say, it can be hard to tell. I hate to stereotype (and realize that I am), but I suspect that Russian sites may also have a higher incidence of malware. Basically, if we're going to include links, we want to know those links are to sites that aren't going to distribute malware to folks. They need to be to sites that have a proven record of A/V scanning and policing their uploads. Many of the Russian sites I see are places that host pirated mods -- like copies of ThaneMOD that I haven't uploaded personally. These sites are almost certainly not scanning their uploads for malicious files. We don't want links to these sites on the spreadsheet. I'd rather be safe than sorry.
English language sites, only. Reputable sites, only.
A remark on the sample message. I've used 2 variations of it, depending on whether the modder has already uploaded to Nexus (or elsewhere), or not. Basically, I contact all authors, even if they already uploaded elsewhere. Useful in case they forgot something, for example. It may not be necessary, but you never know. Sometimes mods on Nexus aren't up to date.
If the author has *some* mods in other locations, but not all, then contacting them is fine. If they have all their projects already hosted -- just not on Nexus -- then I'd say not to contact them. We have too many other mods to work on, and if that author isn't hosting on Nexus, there is likely a reason. If so, then contacting them is only going to irritate them.
-
Yeah, definitely don't contact an author more than once -- that's the point of keeping track in the sheet.
I'd hesitate to contact them on more than one site, as well; we don't want to spam them. I'd go with the site they seem to frequent the most. If you get no reply in a week, then try another site.
I'll put something about that in the instructions.
-
I will be very blunt here: most people are Spreadsheet Challenged. I have included basic directions for how to edit the google sheets and how to look at what people are doing and accessing the project pages.
LOL.
Wow, I actually didn't consider that. I've been working with spreadsheets for 22 years now, so for me it's old hat. I do remember the very, very large learning curve when I was a freshmen in undergrad, though, so I understand :)
It really isn't hard, though, and let them know that's it's pretty hard to mess something up. There's "undo" buttons just like in any standard word processor. Plus, Google has document versioning, so if I actually need to backtrack the entire sheet, I can.
It would be a good learning experience for them. Lots of jobs involve some basic work with spreadsheets.
-
@Inventoriers --
Keep an eye out for comments in the data sheets. If they are not associated with column headers, then they are directed at one of you. Please read them, act accordingly, and click on "Resolve" to make them disappear. If you need further clarification, just ask here :)
-
@Tarshana - Looked at the reddit updates :)
Would you mind swapping the direct links for the Google Doc to the link to the new website? That's where we really want people to go,and reddit will help it get a bunch of traffic. The link to the Google Doc will be up on the new website soon (once I have the chance to work on the last article), and having a link to the site rather than the doc may help prevent casual lookers from reddit hopping on and being tempted to vandalize.
-
@Tarshana -- Stupid language barrier :) Also, I love that you call be "Mohofish", LOL!
--If you're still confused, take a look at all the other sheets. For example, entry 6 on the Utilities sheet is set up correctly. That might help things make more sense.
-- Please pop onto the new "Inventory Status" sheet and put your name next to the page numbers that you are currently working on. The page only appears in the URL, remember.
I'll start cleaning up the DAO sheet momentarily, starting at the top and working my way down. Feel free to revisit entries and edit as needed; it's easily to tell if someone is about to edit a cell, since they appear highlighted :)
-
Okay, going back over my work so far. So in the contacted I put Yes via Nexus and added my name as to who I contacted.
Someone typed hello in a box... I do not know who but you scared me. I deleted it. But hello just the same?
Tarshana, please read the column header comments. They tell you what data is valid for the fields. Just "Nexus" is fine.
"Hello". Yeah, this is a concern, especially since Creeper just posted on Reddit. Google has built in versioning, but if we get problems with people making bad changes I'm going to have to lock down the sheet and only allow specific people to edit. That will slow things considerably.
-
FYI, I posted information for this project on Reddit. Edits to existing posts go generally unseen there, better to make new ones. Upvote them if you can, so they stay longer at the top and can reach more people.
@gift
1. I didn't insert links, I just copy pasted the author name from the project page, and the links were automatically copied with it. Didn't lose any time with that, trust me :smile:.
2. You're right, it's a pain, but more importantly, it takes time. Why not do the cleanup afterwards ?
3. Oooh, my bad. I'll edit that, we definitely need a new column for this info though. In case someone else needs to contact the author, and the original person who contacted him/her is not available.
4. What if there are multiple websites ? Do I just use the same order, like "website1, website2" / "username1, username2" ?
Very few mod authors leave permission details in their description (none so far), permissions are something relatively new in modding, it would seem. Will keep screenshots though.
Edit : I'll let you do the edits you need to do gift, I'll make mine in an hour or so, to make sure I'm not interfering.
Good call on reddit. Thanks :)
1. Oh, well that's sweet about the links. Come later October we can just remove the links, then.
2. Yes, I realize it takes time. But leaving things for clean up like that usually means that: A-it will never get done, or B- the work will fall to someone else to do. I can tell you there's no way I'm cleaning up 4K entries of links at the end, lol. A good compromise for workflow will be to copy/paste all the links directly during your work session, and then at the end before you wrap up, go back and clean it up yourself.
3. If you contact them on multiple websites, list all the sites and all the usernames. I've hopefully clarified the column instructions, but let me know if you need further guidance. Also you don't need to use links, though you can. Just Nexus=giftfish is good enough, and faster. All we need is a breadcrumb, just in case :)
Yeah, I'm aware about the lack of permissions overall. They are nowhere to be found for the most part. Pst, Dark0ne!
I'm done cleaning up all sheets except DAO, so take a look, fill in the new holes, and let me know what other questions you have :)
-
@Tarsh -- Refresh the page; I made a ninjaedit.
I'm going to go ahead and add a new column to differentiate between "inventoried by", and "Contacted by". Folks are still getting confused about this.
Also, Tarsh, be sure to read my post 145 above :)
-
And... do we want a new column with the sites used to contact the author?
Derp. The site name used to contact the author should go in the "Author Contacted" field, as per the column directions. Will update my previous post on this momentarily :) -
@Creeper -- Also, I'd say go ahead and keep screen grabs of authors who grant permissions via mod descriptions, or those that do it via direct communication with you. Ideally we want the latter into handling the re-hosting themselves, but if we can't convince them and the contacter is willing to do the uploading, we'll need a record of the permission being granted.
-
@Creeper --
Answers should be put into the Permissions column, using the valid data formats for those fields. So, just put "closed" and then if you want to pop in a note, you can. Once he's put them up on his site, then the External host link needs to be inserted. I'll clarify this in the instructions tab.
Also, looks like there's some confusion about valid data in the fields. Please read the comment directions in the column headers carefully.
Here's the errors and other random bits that I'm seeing:
1. Owner --
- Inserting links isn't necessary, and really, it isn't worth the time. All will be broken in two months time. It's easy enough to look up a specific author on BSN, if necessary.
- This should be the BSN username, not the username on any other site. User handles for other sites go under author aliases.
2. External Host -- I know it's a bit of a pain, but please follow the example and take the time to type in the site name and then add the link to that. It'll keep the spreadsheet looking cleaner. Unlike the owner links, these won't be broken in two months.
3. Editor -- This is you. The person who contacts the mod author. I worded the column title in this way, as it's possible we could have situations where the person entering the data for the mod isn't the one who contacts the author directly. We need accountability for who does the contacting and what the permissions are assessed to be.
4. Author Contacted -- Once an author is contacted, the site used for contact should be listed here. "Yes" is not valid data, as per the directions in the column header.
5. Author Aliases -- Please follow the specified format of site=name. If you'd rather insert the name and then a link to their site profile or something, that's also fine. I'll put that into the comment header.
Thanks for all the work you've done on this so far, Creeper. Looking great, overall.
Will get to the planning sheet momentarily.
-
@Dark0ne -- Thanks for keeping an eye on the thread; we appreciate it.
--------
@Creeper --
1. Whoops, I forgot DA2. Thanks for that. I'll get the content headers protected in just a bit.
2. I did page 1 as I set up the examples. For games with no projects on this page, I just arrowed to their first project in the list. I was a bit lazy with NWN, lol.
3. Good search tips. I'll add them to the instructions tab.
4. I'll take look at the planning tab.
--------
@Everyone -- Important.
1. Please fully read the new website and check the content for accuracy. I need to know if anything is wrong or if I've missed information.
2. Not looking for comments on general edits short of typos.
3. I'll get the final blog article up this morning, which will be about the project preservation effort in this thread.
One thing I need to be very clear about. The BSN Project Inventory is a community project. If the community wants to preserve this content, then the community has to do the work. It's not something that's going to get done based upon the efforts of only one or two (or three) people. And those people should not have to work tirelessly for the next two months in an attempt to compensate for the lack of effort by others. We need a decently large group of folks for this, or we won't make the deadline. Judging by the 300K unique downloads for DA Redesigned, there are plenty of people who use mods for these games. If 200 people inventoried 2 pages each, this entire project would be almost done.
So, those of you with tumblrs, facebook, and twitters, please work on getting the word out. Please register on some of these new forum communities and let the users know what we're doing. I've hit up the main BSN threads, but if folks are already gone, they won't see it.
I've spent a lot of time getting the ball rolling for this, but I won't be putting much time into the inventorying process. I have commitments to the toolset as well as work on my own mods (which have been repeatedly neglected due to the toolset and now due to this), and I have only so much free time. I'll be here to monitor progress, update the website, make any necessary edits to the spreadsheets, and other random stuff.
Let's find some more folks to help :)
-
FYI, I figured out the discrepency in project numbers.
You must be *logged in* to see all projects. Once I did that, the number went from 3964 to 4170. I'll note that on the spreadsheet in the morning.
-
Okay folks, here's the WIP WordPress:
https://whereisbioware.wordpress.com/
Info:
--So far, two posts are up. I haven't started on Projects or Blogs yet.
--I've basically copied all the forum info directly from Lady Artifice's post on the BW Forums. If folks want me to add more, just let me know, or make a comment on the blog.
--PLEASE start linking this everywhere so folks know about it before the closure. That way we can build up page views for when the forum actually is taken down.
-
Okay, sheet has been updated.
I'll be working on the WP for a bit. Will check in periodically :)
-
@Creeper -- Please stop editing your post :) I keep seeing new comments.
1. Sorting by downloads is as close as we're going to get for a decent system of priority. I'm not saying it's perfect, but it's better than going alphabetically. If folks want to do "Most Viewed" that's fine, too.
2. No idea what the mod discrepancy is about. Not my fault.
3. "Open" mods: see #19 in the instructions. It's probably good to wait for clarification from Thandal/SirSalami/Dark0ne about the mods I'm assuming are open based upon supplied source code, however. Also, if someone is going to upload any of the ones I put up as examples, please verify them yourself, as well. I don't want to be responsible for my mistake getting someone banned. Ack.
Ultimately whomever uploads takes ultimate responsibility... and hopefully Nexus will bear with us a bit as we figure this stuff out. We're doing our best.
-
@Creeper --
1. I will definitely insert that URL shortcut.
2. I'll add a column for project number, but it will be different from the # column. We need a "count", as well as the project ID.
3. I considered putting everything on the same sheet, with a game column. Problem with that is it's harder for multiple editors working at the same time, as everyone will end up trying to jump all over each other as they work on a per-page basis. We'll keep it like this for now and see how it goes. Data is easy to move between sheets.
@Tarshana -- Don't worry about order. We can sort periodically, by whichever column we want, as needed.
-
@Everyone -- Okay, Google Sheet is ready.
Wait!
Lol. Currently, anyone can edit the sheet. Certain sections are protected to prevent tampering. If we have problems with vandalism, we'll have to resort to giving permissions only to folks who explicitly ask for it.
It is IMPERATIVE that you fully read and understand all instructions before editing. The goal of this is to not only help us know who to contact, but to have a reference, in perpetuity, of all BSN Projects. Accuracy and completion are very important.
ALSO. The real pain in the ass is due to how Projects are organized. There are 397 pages of projects and we cannot access specific pages. Instead, you must start at the beginning and click the arrows repeatedly to cycle through. This means it's especially important for folks to not jump around. Work one page at a time and don't start a page unless you can finish it. We need to do this quickly, so it's important folks don't have to search the spreadsheet for each individual mod to ensure it's not already catalogued. Instead, they should be able to jump ahead a few (dozen, lol) pages, search the mod name at the bottom of the page, see if that's in the inventory, etc. Then move forward or back depending on whether that mod is in the sheet. We can also communicate on here to know what project range (not page range!) is currently being catalogued.
I think I've covered everything necessary in the spreadsheet, but if folks can think of something else, let me know. All sheets except NWN have examples set up to follow, in addition to the instructions. These examples, however, are NOT a substitute for the instructions.
NOTE: I'll be working on the WordPress this afternoon, so if I'm slow to respond, bear with me. It's important that it is up as soon as possible so we can start spreading the link around.
Also, if someone can post the link for the sheet on Felexea's forum and in our BSN thread (the Archiving one), that would be great. @Creeper, can you post it in the ME3Exp thread? I'll post it in the ThaneMOD thread, as well.
----
@Thandal -- Do you mind reading through the directions and making sure everything is on the "up and up" as far as Nexus is concerned? Also, I have a question about projects that specifically provide source code, and if that essentially means it's open source and can be uploaded to Nexus, despite no explicit permissions in the read me. You'll see it :smile:
-
Okay, here's the plan:
--I'm going to first get up the Google Doc and make it publically editable. I'm concerned about vandalism, though, so I need to check on how they handle versioning. If we end up with problems, then I'll have to revert to providing separate editing permissions, which will require a Google/Gmail account.
--With the doc will be instructions, as well as a standardized message to include when contacting authors. PLEASE USE THEM.
--This doc will be important. Very important. It will essentially be an inventory of BSN Projects. Accuracy will be paramount, and it's obviously imperative that it's complete prior to the end of October when the site will be taken down.
--The doc will be linked to the ME3Explorer account, which all ME3Explorer admins have access to, so it isn't reliant upon me, personally.
Once the Google doc is up I'll get started on the WP. We can also then link the doc in the WP so folks know where to get the information.
Google Doc shouldn't take long. Give me an hour or two :)
-
STATUS REVIEW
Since this is supposed to be the "HQ" thread, let's review where things are at:
1. Tarshana has downloaded the full BSN, DAO Toolset Wiki, and original Mass Effect sites.
2. Felexea has downloaded and ported the entire current BioWare Forum.... I think. My understanding is that this will go live on 8/25 when the existing forum goes read-only.
I know Creeper and Shades were also working on downloads. What are the status of those?
Is anyone else working on downloads? It would be very good to have at least 1 redundant copy of all 4 sites: BSN, DAO Toolset/wiki, original ME site, and current BioWare forum.
Tarshana, am I forgetting anything?
---
Some things right now warrant additional discussion:
1. How do folks get directed to the new forum sites and locations of project downloads?
I know folks are wanting BW to help us out with stickies, but frankly, I don't think we can count on them for much at this point. Also, there's the problem of once the forums actually come down in October.
We need good ways to ensure continuity for the future. What if someone went AFK in July and ends up coming back in November? They'll have missed everything. We need good ways to communicate this info.- One thing I can do is post a sticky on ME3Explorer. This will reach the bulk of the Mass Effect modding and mod-user community.
- This thread already exists here on Nexus. Tarshana can amend her OP with a message and links to sites, if necessary.
- Nwnvault has copies of all NWN BSN Projects. It would be good if there was a forum sticky there.
- Looks like Tarshana already has a post at DAOmods on reddit.
All these are good.
One other thing we could do is pop up a free WordPress that's only goal is to provide thorough direction on this situation. Give it a name like "Resource on BioWare Forum and BSN Closure". Then include the following:- Link to BW's blog post (or screenshot it, probably)
- Lay out the details of what happened to the new forums and old BSN
- Put a list of links and a brief overview of all the fan forums that have been created where folks can continue to engage in discussions
- Put a list of known download locations for Projects
- Explain the current difficulties with permissions and re-hosting projects
- Explain the difficulties with private blogs
- Explain how folks can continue to access game patch and DLC downloads
- Update the WP as needed
There's a stickied thread on the forums that currently does this (in part) but again, once the forums are removed, that sticky is gone. If folks think this is a good idea, I'll go ahead and work on the WP this weekend. Won't take long.
2. Contacting Mod Authors.
Tarshana has contacted some mod authors on BSN with the following results:- Some authors already have their mods hosted on Nexus and other sites.
- Some authors haven't responded.
- Some mod authors don't want their mods on Nexus.
If a mod is already hosted elsewhere, then it's a non-issue. If a mod author specifically tells us they don't want their mod on Nexus, then I'd say these mods are no longer our concern. These authors are now aware of the closure; it's up to them to port their mod to a new site of their preference. It's not up to us to preserve their content.
It's the authors who haven't responded and the authors who haven't yet been contacted that are the most problematic. Contacting mod authors is a large project and it should be handled by more than one person. It would be great if we could get some help with this so it doesn't continue to fall to Tarshana. My plate is very full with my toolset responsibilities.
Tarshana, I know you mentioned a spreadsheet. Can we get this up on Google Docs? That way we can have a bunch of people contacting authors and everyone will know what's what. If you want to send me the sheet, I'm happy to get it uploaded and set up for us. I'll put it up using the ME3Explorer account.
3. Project Hosting.
Right now, Nexus's position is still the following:- A bulk transfer of BSN Projects isn't possible since some mods already exist here.
- Mod author permission would need to be explicitly given.
This situation may or may not change.
Assuming we can get permission from some authors to upload here, then that's something we should work into the spreadsheet above. That way we have a record of the mod author name, permission status, what's been uploaded, etc.
Some mod authors are apparently very anti-Nexus. I don't understand why, but that's their prerogative. Again, I want to reiterate that these mods are not our concern. If an author doesn't want their mod on Nexus, it's only on BSN, and they know about the closure, it's up to them to preserve their own mods.
One thing I want to reiterate to everyone reading this is that tumblr is NOT a mod hosting platform. I realize that some folks use tumblr for this, but it's a horrible idea. ME3Explorer gets questions all the time from users of tumblr mods. Why do these folks come to us? Because they are essentially at the mercy of the mod author, who hasn't responded to their question. Tumblr mods are essentially unsupported unless the author chooses to engage the commenter. Not to mention there's no versioning system, no good way to report bugs, and no community. In addition, blog article comments are not a proper place to troubleshoot issues -- and there *is* no good place to troubleshoot issues. Tumblr is a blog. It's not meant to host mods.
Hopefully, the mod authors we continue to contact will re-upload their mods themselves, and hopefully, they will do so to Nexus. Nexus already has the largest amount of DAO and ME mods on any website. Far more than ModDB. The closure of BW/BSN is already fracturing the community. It would be nice to fracture projects less by putting them all here on Nexus.
BSN is shutting down; files there could be lost.
in Site Support
Posted
Don't worry about this Tarshana. It's easy to click the entire column and "remove links". Just do it when you're done entering data for the day :)