SpartanA128

@Spartan But assuming you brought it up, Vulpes would likely be the next in line.

But not to get too heavily into a history debate here. I assume what you are proposing is that the aggresive expansion of the NCR as a parody to the beurocratical and industrial expansion west by the Union. Which it fits fairly well, both ironicly in direction and railway development and in their eagerness to use force against smaller factions like the BoS. Exactly. Their eyes are on the horizon, not the ground. As a result, they step on things they shouldn't. But in the case of the Brotherhood, the aggression was already on both sides. They disagreed with the NCR's use of technology, and as a result, their narcissistic beliefs propelled them into action and the Republic reacted the best way it knew. Hardly. There are instances where, in the NCR's favor, you hear soldiers tell you if you were enlisted you'd likely be halfway to the position of General. But that's about as far as it's taken. Depending on one's own character, their taking of leadership in the NCR might be beneficial, temporarily. But in the end it won't solve the long term problem in the NCR; Democracy. Edward put it rather well: Tandi's form of hereditary dictatorship worked better for the society at large than democracy ever did. Even if you managed to make the NCR a dictatorship, who's to say it won't revert when the next ruler comes around? Or if the people revolt against your rule? They hold their democracy sacrosanct, as evidenced by the NCR motivational posters and you ruling it with an iron fist might not go over well. Alternatively, we have Edward's faux-Roman tribe. Assuming the Legion took Hoover Dam due to your actions, it's likely Caesar/Edward would give you a position of strength within the Legion, sure. Perhaps as another Legatus. Or, if he considers your prowess a threat, he might try to kill you, unlikely as this sounds. But you would never become the leader of the Legion. He has a line of successors already in place if Boone's words are to be believed. You might lead the Legion into battle, but you will never lead the Legion.

Can I get a tl;dr? Anyone?

I believe he meant it figuratively. The Enclave survivors mostly integrated into NCR and/or went into hiding. Assuming they are sufficiently motivated, we might find there are more of them than was originally believed. Just throwing that out there. :P

My apologies.

I'll agree to that. I was quite disturbed by the idea that people think it's necessarily to kill each other to survive in post-apocalyptia instead of unifying in the face of extinction. I'm also quite amused by the fact that many inwardly think they would be better off in such a world as "Heroes Of The Wastes," when, barring porn withdrawal coming first, most would drop dead by getting *censored* slapped by a giant Ant.

This is a place to discuss, theorize, and debate the possible future of the Legion following the Second Battle For Hoover Dam, be it the ending for NCR, House, or Independent/Wild Card. Respect the beliefs of one another, if possible. Scenarios in which Edward dies or lives are allowed. Scenarios in which Vulpes or Lanius take up leadership following are also fair game, along with a total decapitation of immediate leadership in which all three are killed. Ought to make for interesting and/or amusing chatter.

No need to dismiss his input simply because you disagree with his modus operandi. It's unbecoming. Whether or not he is "right,"(A term I used loosely in topics like this) is irrelevant. This is all speculation about a largely unlikely outcome of events not even in motion. Everyone is entitled their own opinion, and none is more correct than another.

Wait, why am I dead? I didn't even list a plan.(Because I'd be, well, DEAD.) Or are you referring to the scenario I described?

The bottom line is that likely none of the posters in this topic would survive for longer than a week before dying from lack of Wi-Fi and porn.

Within the context of the E.S universe, being either is generally befitting of the title: Cursed. Vampires, in true classic form, must feast on the blood of humans to live and keep fit, along with being cursed to avoid the sun for fear of death or weakness, in Oblivion and Skyrim respectively. As their symptoms become apparent they can no longer hide being the falsehood of being human and are generally shunned and hated for something that is more or less beyond their control. Assuming, that is, that the contraction of the disease was unintended. Once they are full blooded vampires, their only way of staying amongst the living is through hypnosis/charming those who see them. Lycanthropes are better off in general. The transformation can be more or less controlled, as can the actions of the transformed person. The only real downside is, again, being shunned by those who know the secret, and the forcing of your afterlife to be an eternity of hunting with your God of sorts and nothing else. To some, this is a boon, but to others it is an unwanted fine print in the contract. Gameplay-wise, being a Lycan is superior to being a Vampire, but it is ultimately up to opinion.

Fairly certain this is advertisement. Perhaps I am mistaken.

The Enclave is dead. There may be Remnants such as Arcade and Co. but they are never going to be a regional power again like they were in F2, or that bulls*** F3. Twice they've had their forces and main base of operations decimated, and twice they've had their leadership killed off. Hell, once Eden is dead, the highest ranking official is a Colonel for God's sake. Still, assuming that Outpost in Chicago is still functioning, there's a possibility of them appearing in another game. Enclave Vs the Mid-Western Brotherhood is something I'd pay to see.

These threads on factions are pointless. It's all perspective and subjective anyways. I should note to all the Legion lovers that the Legion is not built at all for long term stability, nor is the NCR. The Legion's entire society is built around his leadership: When he dies, there will be little wait before it starts devouring itself. Lanius is in no way capable of effectively leading them the way Caesar did, nor is Vulpes. Alternatively, the NCR is a bloated, festering mass of bureaucratic bulls*** that has over stretched it's grasp and is a cruel parody of 1800s America.

Now you stop insulting us, whoever you are, got it? Kids... Talkin' ta me, chomes? I am a scientist, just to let you know, and a good one in my branch. 25 years of experience and a rock-solid relationship with my surrounding as a helping fellow teacher. Quite an arrogance for your first post, chomes. Oh, and if you wanna argue, or quarrel, just go ahead and PM me as much as ya like, but leave this thread alone, if your intentions are to insult.. Have a nice one... stranger. Lolz. Perhaps if you ceased with the blatant fanboyism and presented your argument in a logical, coherent fashion, I wouldn't have mistaken you for the toddler you were acting like. Bon Voyage~ "And yes, if the NCR had any brains, they'd sign a Treaty of Cooperation or something with the BoS and what happens next - the combined force of BoS's power armor and training and NCR's numbers would make them masters of North America. Am I right?" Wrong. The Brotherhood would never sign such a treaty, so deep in their dogma and techno fetishism. They couldn't stand the idea of someone else playing with Old World tech. It's like the equivalent of the stereotypical highschool bully. They want what the other person has, even if they don't know what to do with it anyways. They want it, so, in their view, they are entitled to it.

This whole mess of confusion with the Brotherhood of Steel and Lyon's groups is getting ridicoulous. Kids, if you're going to post here, atleast try to make it so you only seem halfas stupid as you are. Really, grow up and stop thinking using all caps will get your point across better. It just makes you more the fool. :P The Brotherhood of Steel is not in anyway, shape, or form something worth preserving. It used to be. Back in Fallout, the original, their goal was to preserve technology to save mankind from themselves. An admirable, but futile goal. They even accepted outsiders, in very rare cases. This Brotherhood might've survived, especially when they seemed to have allied themselves with the fledgling NCR and lauched a crusade against the then-evil Super Mutants. Then the Enclave showed up, NCR became corrupt, and everything went to hell. The Brotherhood was forced to fight a losing battle against the far superior Enclave in Fallout 2, a battle, which, while rarely seen, is easily one sided. They enlist your help in stealing vertibird plans from Navarro to try and gain some sort of edge, but this appearently fails considering they are never seen using them. The Brotherhood becomes less and less noble as they start hoarding technology, not for the sake of humanity, but so that they can fulfill their increasing sense of entitlement. Then came the Schism; a group of dissident BoS members, sent out on a mission to Chicago, goes rogue. They become the MidWestern Brotherhood of Steel; a post nuclear Nazi Germany. This new faction survives the war against a supercomputer and accepts new members, swelling in size. They survive for at least a century. Then comes the next split: Lyon's BoS. elder Lyons breaks away from the oppresive and ultimately lethal creed of the Brotherhood and he and his subjects set upon themselves, whether out of idealism or clever thinking(having the good graces of the people of the Capitol Wastes and new members pouring in) to eradicate the nearby mutant threat. This pisses off some of the direhard Codex lovers, who split off from the main group and set up shop at Fort independance, ironically enough. They plan on making the trip back to California, but they don't know exactly what's happening back West. The NCR and Brotherhood, having been snarling and biting at each other's throats for years over the rights of who gets what, go to war. It is bloody. The Brotherhood is overwhelmed by the Republic's sheer numbers and is forced into hiding in small, underground bases. Splintered. These remaining few, unless they go the way of the MidWesterner's or Lyons, will stagnate as inbreeding and/or lack of resources kicks in, and they will die off. They lack the numbers they once had from all the splinter groups and the NCR-BoS War. Nothing the Courier can do will stop them from dying, not while they are so attached to their Code to see that it is killing them.. Veronica was right in her thinking; even MacNamara relized that much. the difference was he didn't have the courage, or belief, to try and stop it. Bottom line: No matter what you do, the original Brotherhood, this includes the Mojave chapter, will die off within a few decades anyways. All you Lyons BoS lovers, don't worry about them, they're sticking around. Same for the MidWesterners. Rant done. :P