LE Bastard swords

[KaptenN]

For those who don't know what a bastard sword is it's a middle thing between a longsword and a greatsword. A one and a half hand sword, some say. It's a little harder to use than other swords but is more flexible in that it can be used with either one or both hands. (At least that'd how they work in Dungeons and Dragons)

 

This will probably require some scripting, but here's how I'd like to see bastard swords implemented:

 

1. When you have equipped a bastard sword and nothing else you will...

1.1. ...wield it with both hands like a greatsword.

1.2. ...deal more damage than when wielding it with one hand.

1.3. ...level the two hand skill.

1.4. ...swing faster than greatswords, but...

1.5. ...have shorter reach than greatswords.

2. When you have equipped a bastard sword and a shield you will...

2.1. ...wield it with one hand like a longsword.

2.2. ...deal less damage than when wielding it with both hands.

2.3. ...level the one hand skill.

2.4. ...have longer reach than longswords, but...

2.5. ...swing slower than longswords.

3. You can't...

3.1. ...dual wield bastard swords.

3.2. ...wield a bastard sword in one hand and another weapon in the other. (Or maybe you can? I haven't decided on this point yet.)

4. There should be a bastard sword for every material, like steel, dwarven, dragonbone, ect. (Don't worry about this part. If someone starts off by implementing a bastard sword category I'm sure that a modeller will come around and make the necessary meshes.)

 

I looked around for other bastard sword mods but they're either just a two hand sword, greatswords changed to be wielded with one hand instead of two or two identical swords, one one hand and one two hand sword, that you can reforge between.

There was one that looked promising where you switched between using one hand and both hands by pressing a button: Longclaw - A Bastard Sword Mod. However, it is a unique sword that have to be smithed in a special way and stuff. It's not what I'm looking for.

 

 

EDIT: I just had a new idea!

What if instead of determining whether to use one hand or both hands by whether or not a shield is equipped it is done by pressing a button, like with Longclaw? At the same time we make the sword usable with two hands without unequipping the shield. Instead, when the sword is switched to two hand use, the shield is placed on your back. This would require a compatible skeleton, like XP32, but it would make switching to and from using the shield much more awesome.

Just something to think about. Whoever implements this may do it whichever way they prefer.

Edited July 11, 2013 by KaptenN

[ZachW2752]

I also have been looking for a mod like this. And as for dual wield, you could use a dagger. Irl, bastard swords sometimes are wielded with a hand-and-a-half dagger.

[73North]

Its a nice idea and one I've looked for before. As you say the Longclaw mod is the closest - I suppose the hard work was done in creating the mechanic, so it should be possible to replicate for other categories (not that I am advocating someone stealing the author's work - merely learning from it). If I had one criticism, I always felt the switching between 1h and 2h was a bit clunky, as it sheathed and drew in between switching (but suppose you'd have to have a new animation for that?). Would be nice to have something like that for all the vanilla swords

[KaptenN]

I didn't know anyone actually dual wielded at all in real life, Zach. At least not with such heavy swords. I would have thought it was too clumbsy to be useful and thus only was a fantasy thing.

[ventus360]

You should include some animation like this that would be epic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5WV5SgF9hI

[BleydThePirate]

Just to clear a few things up, a longsword and a bastard sword are essentially the same thing - both with handles long enough to use two hands for faster and more powerful strikes, but balanced well enough to be held in a single hand. Also, dual wielding almost never happened historically outside of the rapier + parrying dagger combination or novelty fencing stunts.

 

On the subject of in-game bastard swords, it might be difficult to make a weapon in the way you describe. There would need to be custom scripts that allowed it to switch between wielding stances while changing the damage, as well as disabling duel wielding but still allowing a shield. I'm just learning the basics of scripting so it might seem worse to me, but that's some pretty complicated stuff, even more so if you want to avoid SKSE. I haven't tested the Longclaw mod so I have no idea what kind of scripting the author uses.

 

That being said, you could drastically simplify all this by playing in a slightly different way. Using a regular sword in one hand and nothing in the other allows you to use it in somewhat of a bastard style, as the blocking stance and some killcam animations utilize both hands while attacks happen with only one. There are also some mods under the "duelist" search tag that increase weapon damage when your left hand is empty, which effectively does the same thing you described. Not perfectly what you are looking for, but with a little imagination and the right tools it might work well.

[KaptenN]

You should include some animation like this that would be epic

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5WV5SgF9hI

That's just silly, Ventus.

 

Just to clear a few things up, a longsword and a bastard sword are essentially the same thing - both with handles long enough to use two hands for faster and more powerful strikes, but balanced well enough to be held in a single hand. Also, dual wielding almost never happened historically outside of the rapier + parrying dagger combination or novelty fencing stunts.

 

On the subject of in-game bastard swords, it might be difficult to make a weapon in the way you describe. There would need to be custom scripts that allowed it to switch between wielding stances while changing the damage, as well as disabling duel wielding but still allowing a shield. I'm just learning the basics of scripting so it might seem worse to me, but that's some pretty complicated stuff, even more so if you want to avoid SKSE. I haven't tested the Longclaw mod so I have no idea what kind of scripting the author uses.

 

That being said, you could drastically simplify all this by playing in a slightly different way. Using a regular sword in one hand and nothing in the other allows you to use it in somewhat of a bastard style, as the blocking stance and some killcam animations utilize both hands while attacks happen with only one. There are also some mods under the "duelist" search tag that increase weapon damage when your left hand is empty, which effectively does the same thing you described. Not perfectly what you are looking for, but with a little imagination and the right tools it might work well.

Your input is appreciated, Bleyd, but I shall non-the-less continue the search for a skilled scripter who is willing to take on this task.

...and by "search" I mean that I will continue to watch this topic.

[Frank2368]

I didn't know anyone actually dual wielded at all in real life, Zach. At least not with such heavy swords. I would have thought it was too clumbsy to be useful and thus only was a fantasy thing.

 

The greatest swordsman of Japan wielded a Katana in each hand. Katanas were meant to be held with both hands, but evidently dual wielding isn't clumsy and was proven to be extremely effective by him.

Edited February 2, 2014 by Frank2368

[puffer761]

i guess you could download the longclaw mod and use that as a basis and use the scripting from that on the new weapons, right? just like using dragonborn armor as a base, you need dragonborn.

[Elegost75]

Hello. Such a mod would be my wettest of dreams. That said, the Longclaw script, while cool, is cumbersome in combat, as it plays the sheath/unsheathe animation. I suppose though, this is the closest we are going to get to functional bastard swords.

Also, regarding the models, there already is a wonderful mod called Lost Longswords. It contains a longsword of each material and, in my humble opinion, they are the most beautiful swords on the Nexus.

Edited February 4, 2014 by Elegost75