FO3Edit MasterUpdate

[BrainFever]

I see suggested in many old mods description or readme pages that Masterupdating through FO3Edit is required. Now I wonder what this is and what it does(I know how to do it) and why I should do it, since I 've read somewhere that nowdays masterupdating through these kind of programs -like FNVEdit / TES5Edit- is really really not wise and might break a modded game. My knowledge of FO3Edit reaches to the point of cleaning an .esp (if advised by BOSS to do so) and creating a merge patch, so I would really like someone experienced to explain me what Masterupdate does and if I should do it, at least with mods that it is suggested by their own creators.

[Aonghus]

This can help point you in the right direction: http://fallout3.nexusmods.com/mods/8629/?.

 

What the Master Update does is convert all mod files in your game from .esp (mod) files to .esm (master) files. There is indeed a problem with the Master Update function in New Vegas, (It does wonky things to some scripts.) but it is harmless and in fact very beneficial in FO3.

[blove]

I can not think of a single current Fallout 3 mod that requires MasterUpdating. If the mod is that old you should really take another hard look at it before installing.

[BlackRampage]

There's actually a few mods out there that really should not be master-updated under any circumstance.

 

Master-updating the Broken Steel plugin from the Unofficial Fallout 3 patch, for example, will cause a serious problem inside the utility tunnel that leads to the presidential metro.

 

Basically, don't use the master-update function with Fallout 3. Before Bethesda's official 1.7 patch it used to be beneficial, but since then it's become redundant.

[pkleiss]

I can't think of any circumstance that a user would apply master update to a mod they downloaded at this point. Master update, as you probably already know, converts an ESP into an ESM. This is something the mod creator will do if necessary before releasing their mod to the community. There are certain inherit bugs that occur with ESPs that do not manifest once the mod has been turned into a master. The mismatched head/body texture and looping navmesh bug are two prime examples. There other reasons, of course, that some mods are released as masters; expansive mods that offer their own plugins are a prime example of this.

[BrainFever]

Ok this mod for example: http://fallout3.nexusmods.com/mods/12466/?

 

From description page: Use FO3edit's MasterUpdate function after installing this mod. This will update your game with your new mod load order and prevent potential crashes.

 

Now my question is, if I prefer to not masterupdate will I face any "potential crashes" as the creator states?

[pkleiss]

Well, I checked out the mod you referenced. IMO, the author is only suggesting you follow the steps of mater updating your mods as an option IF you are experiencing conflicts. Again, IMO, this is a poor use of FO3Edit's master update feature. The mod author is basically saying: "My mod might cause conflicts with other mods, so make all my files masters so they load first and can then be overwritten by other plugins."

 

Once again, IMO, if that mod is causing consistent conflicts with other mods, perhaps it is poorly written.

 

And so, to answer your question...

 

You may indeed face conflicts which may or may not manifest as CTDs, but that is entirely dependent on which other mods you have loaded along with this one. You may also experience no ill side effects whatsoever. Only playing it will tell. If the mod author expects conflicts, my advice would be to skip this mod. It is possible to write mods that have no conflicts, but not every mod author takes the time or has the knowhow to do so. Even some of the more popular mods are written such that they cause conflicts, but overhaul mods like FWE and FOOK are designed that way. If you use these mods, you will undoubtedly experience conflicts at some point with other smaller mods.

 

Basically, what it comes down to is modification of original (vanilla) assets. Good modding technique dictates that a mod creator NEVER do this, but create original replicas instead. If a mod author does overwrite a vanilla asset and another mod references that original version, a conflict is born.

Edited September 13, 2013 by pkleiss

[Aonghus]

The advice about not Master updating is not, as such, correct. I first became aware of the problem some mods were having with MU over on the New Vegas side of things where one of the most popular mods, New Vegas Bounties would not work with MU. When the problem first appeared, it was assumed that somehow Master Update was breaking scripts, at least on the Vegas version of the Gamebro engine. What turned out to be actually going on was an issue with Quest Items/Persistent Reference flags. (Reference post here: http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/263415-new-vegas-bounties-i/page-174&do=findComment&comment=6245932)

 

The issue is not with Master Update breaking mods, it is with a design error in the mods that Master Update brings out. Master update is necessary to run a merged patch, and a merged patch is necessary to run any but the most lightly modded games.

[M48A5]

 

 

The issue is not with Master Update breaking mods, it is with a design error in the mods that Master Update brings out. Master update is necessary to run a merged patch, and a merged patch is necessary to run any but the most lightly modded games.

I must heartily disagree with your statement. Master Update is not necessary to make a merged patch. It is recommended by the FO3Edit developers but not necessary. I have never used Master Update but I have always used a merged patch and then resolved any conflicts. I currently have 109 files in my load list and this does not count the texture files that are loaded directly when the game is launched.

 

There are some mods that you cannot Master Update. Two that come to mind are "Fallout Remastered" and "Blackened".

Edited September 16, 2013 by M48A5

[Aonghus]

 

 

 

The issue is not with Master Update breaking mods, it is with a design error in the mods that Master Update brings out. Master update is necessary to run a merged patch, and a merged patch is necessary to run any but the most lightly modded games.

I must heartily disagree with your statement. Master Update is not necessary to make a merged patch. It is recommended by the FO3Edit developers but not necessary. I have never used Master Update but I have always used a merged patch and then resolved any conflicts. I currently have 109 files in my load list and this does not count the texture files that are loaded directly when the game is launched.

 

There are some mods that you cannot Master Update. Two that come to mind are "Fallout Remastered" and "Blackened".

 

Then we must agree to disagree. In my experience, A merged patch that is not masterupdated causes a host of issues, from severe FPS drop all the way up to CTDs. In my personal lexicon, the mods you mentioned are in the category of "does not play well with others." They might have interesting ideas, but if they end up killing functionality on mods I consider to be "must have" then they are not worth it.