Do schools focus too much on Literature?

[jaosals42]

What do you think?

 

I personally, as a high-school junior (living in the US at least) do believe that the focus on literature in the U.S English classes is far too heavy. Whereas, the grammar emphasis is not nearly enough.

 

Last year, as a sophomore in English, I had to read 9 books in class, 4 books out of class and lots of crap related to them, but only for two weeks (and only the first two weeks of the school year btw) did we focus on anything that was actually related to grammar.

 

So here I was supposed to be, the last three years of English classes to take almost no grammar whatsoever and have to read more than two dozen novels throughout the course of that time and write many vast research papers on them without any emphasis on grammar? Really?

 

And (no offense to anyone in particular) I have seen many fellow highschoolers with horrible grammar issues, (namely a school friend of mine who has syntax and spelling issues), horrible grades on essays due to having forgotten grammar, and yet, the schools continued to put countless focus on solely literature and not grammar.

 

I understand literature can help people understand the times of which said books were written, but do we really have to spend the whole year doing nothing but? How about dedicating one semester to literary analysis and one to grammar? That would probably fix a lot of issues that we students face in terms of grammar.

 

Is the problem worldwide or what?

[Quetzlsacatanango]

I would argue that books, especially those that have been deemed "literature', are generally full of good grammar. If you are reading these books, how are you not learning grammar? That's what books are made of.

[jaosals42]

That however, is reading grammar. We are not practicing how to duplicate said grammar (and that's completely different as the English language has many "exceptions to the rule" in grammar). Reading is not what we have difficulty with (at least not in the schools I've been to).

[Herculine]

I would argue that books, especially those that have been deemed "literature', are generally full of good grammar. If you are reading these books, how are you not learning grammar? That's what books are made of.

 

I agree. I've won a spelling bee or two in my younger days and today consider myself to be quite literate. I enjoy reading and doing some of my own writing, and (perhaps arrogantly so) believe that I am quite skilled with the written word (when I take the time to be). I believe I have gained this skill and knowledge from reading many books in the course of my ongoing education. I can't quote rules of grammar and diction from the textbooks and still I'm not sure what a participle is or what would cause it to dangle, but I simply have an instinct for knowing what sounds correct. I'm not always right, mind you, but I think I do well enough that I sound like I know what I'm talking about. Good grammar, diction and vocabulary are all benefits of reading LITERATURE.

[jaosals42]

Hmm... Well I'd like if I could find why exactly, some fellow students who are good at reading have terrible grammar issues...

 

Turns out the English teacher I have this year for a change is focusing on more grammar and herself says that grammar is not being taught enough at our high-school level.

 

Just us though.

 

The only reason I believe that my grammar is good is merely because I make a habit of writing constantly, so therefore I always have to be aware of syntax, spelling, punctuation, etc.

[Herculine]

In all honesty I don't believe there should be a debate here. Both grammar and literature should be taught in our schools, and if they are not then we (whether we be students, parents or teachers) have a responsibility to change that.

[Vagrant0]

The bottom line is pretty much;

 

1) Grammar should already be something students are familiar enough with in highschool. Students take placement tests for it (or atleast I did way back when), so rehashing that in a non-remedial class is often seen as unnecessary.

 

2) Grammar, isn't a particularly interesting subject, and not something which students can really engage in learning. Either it's too simplistic, or it's using alot of complicated words to describe parts of a sentence they should already be familiar with. Books and reading, in contrast, are much easier to make interesting, and tend to be much easier to teach.

 

3) Grammar is one of those subjects which is not taught particularly well on any level. Many of your English teachers probably don't know the more advanced nuances well enough to really teach it themselves, and would probably be just teaching out of a book themselves.

 

4) Grammar is often taught in higher level English classes, atleast to a better point, when it comes to writing several page compositions. I've had teachers deduct a whole letter grade because of poor grammar. At that point, either you know it, you learn it on your own, or you fail. This is probably the best way to teach it.

 

5) Grammar, aside from the more obvious faults that people make, is really more of an archaic subject. Grammar in English in particular isn't that difficult so long as you follow some simple rules. The reason why it is taught less in highschool is because it isn't seen as important since most people by that point already know how to speak the language well enough to not make those more serious errors.

 

6) There are already enough Grammar Nazis online. Either people learn, or they never get acknowledged as having anything important worth reading... Again, best way to learn it.

 

On that note, there isn't a lack of grammar really, just a lack of caring when it comes to less formal speech or communication. Like it or not, this sort of language with loose grammar is still just as valid a form of communication as language with grammar. So long as the message is understood, the form of communication is valid. The unfortunate part is that this form of communication is easier, lazier, and is being established by the less educated masses, so will probably one day become the main method of communicating.

 

 

If anything, the real problem is that certain works... A Raisin in The Sun, To Kill a Mockingbird, The Great Gatsby, to name a few, are often over stressed (or atleast were for me) to where students are being forced to read them about every year from middle school on. This leads to a sort of stagnation and lack of interest in reading since students who keep getting the same book year after year usually only read it once, then just flip through when it comes time for a quiz. Maybe the selection of books teachers can assign has improved over the years, but wouldn't be surprised if this sort of thing still happens because teachers like to teach the books they had to learn when they were students.

[jaosals42]

They do overstress literature, but too much grammar is boring. Even if they just added really a few weeks (4-5) per year of grammar (maybe I should lessen from a semester) that would be sufficient. But spending a whole month on a single book and having to write a paper for it and repeating that process for 9 months is too much (which was my case last year in English). At least take one of those months off for grammar. Maybe even at the beginning, so they have a refresher for the papers later in the year - and a second one in the middle of the year or start of the next semester.

 

I think now that'd be a better way to deal with the grammar issue.

 

Yes, however, some people (at least for sure on the net) write with poor or lazy grammar, but in truth may actually be very smart with grammar. They just may be lazy (no offense intended to anyone).

[Vagrant0]

They do overstress literature, but too much grammar is boring. Even if they just added really a few weeks (4-5) per year of grammar (maybe I should lessen from a semester) that would be sufficient. But spending a whole month on a single book and having to write a paper for it and repeating that process for 9 months is too much (which was my case last year in English). At least take one of those months off for grammar. Maybe even at the beginning, so they have a refresher for the papers later in the year - and a second one in the middle of the year or start of the next semester.

 

I think now that'd be a better way to deal with the grammar issue.

 

Yes, however, some people (at least for sure on the net) write with poor or lazy grammar, but in truth may actually be very smart with grammar. They just may be lazy (no offense intended to anyone).

But what you're missing is that when you're writing those papers, you're also being checked for things like grammar, punctuation, and spelling, not just content. For a highschool or before paper... Usually 5 paragraph essay garbage*, most of what the teacher is probably looking at is just the grammar, punctuation, and spelling. Afterall, you can't expect a person to read through 80-90 papers on a single book (20-40 people per class, 3-4 class sizes) and not just be bored sick, or go crazy and start just tearing apart a paper for having concepts which are poorly constructed. There's only so many topics that people can write about for any given book.

 

* a quick word about 5 paragraph essays... They aren't garbage because they're a pain to write, they're garbage because the whole structure only works when you're dealing with a subject that you don't need to go into too much depth about, and only need to discuss 3 points which refer to the thesis. The 5 paragraph essay is designed more so that teachers can quickly look through it, find what they feel is important, and move on. When you start dealing with 10+ page term papers, you still need a solid thesis, you still need to be concise with how you support that thesis, but often have to devote pages just to clarify, describe, and support (with resources) those supporting concepts which tie back to the thesis. At that point, the content and how the concepts are arranged and illustrated are of greater importance... But you're also not as likely to be writing on a topic that anyone else has written on or constructed, so is much more bearable for a teacher to deal with. Remember to thank your 5th and 6th grade teachers for putting up with all that substandard writing if you should ever run into them.

[Maharg67]

I like to have less emphasis on grammer in dialogue but more in other aspects of writing such as narrative or description. Less face it, most people do not speak with correct grammer especially if in a hurry, under stress, poorly educated etc.......

 

I have been told off by Grammer Nazis for making an ignorant peasant speak with out proper grammer.

 

Creative writing is not just about grammer, it is about good story telling, good communications and strong believability (the ability to suspend disbelief).