LordEmm Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 I recently upgraded my computer to a real beast and thought "Wouldn't it be neat to see what it can do with Oblivion now?". After killing Crysis and Call of Duty (two other perfomance hoggers), i reinstalled Oblivion including all DLC (except Battlespire). First test: well around 60fps (which makes sense as a max since my LCD monitor has a 60hz refresh rate). After reinstalling most of the mods i liked and some new ones, fps dropped to around 30 (in the starting cell area). Around flickering light sources it drops sometimes to around 20. It is definitely NOT the hirez textures (i installed those first, then still got 60fps). What really stumps me is that even if i have ALL esp unchecked (except for the DLC), it does not change at all. Also hi rez textures or not makes no difference at all either. I am suspecting some rogue scripts, but how can i find them? I am really wondering what is going wrong here... I am sure i should not see much of a drop at all considering my specs. Before any of you says anything, yes i did spend hours even days to read various performance tweaks and guides. Time to give you specs (and a load list after): Windows7 Ultimate64 AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition at 3.6Ghz8GB DDR3 ramATI radeon 5870 with 1GB VRAM compared to how i ran Oblivion heavily modded about a year ago: WindowsVista Ultimate64 AMD Athlon X2 5200+ at 2.6Ghz8GB DDR2 ramATi radeon 4850 with 512MB VRAM ---------No the load order (yes it is very long, please forgive me): Oblivion.esmCM Partners.esmIceElfRace.esmSC_Drow Race.esmOblivion Sexualized Monsters.esmBathingMod_Base.esmCobl Main.esmBetter Cities Resources.esmbookplacing.esmUnnecessaryViolence.esmJoinable Riverview.espUnofficial Oblivion Patch.espBEER_Inebriation.espLeviathan Soulgems.espSalmo the Baker, Cobl.espCLS-Sailboats-COBL.espReal Hunger, Cobl.espX.Races.Comp.espFF_Real_Thirst.espHidden_Elves.espFF_Real_Thirst, Cobl.espAncient Elven Sorceress - EV.espSC_Drow Race Addon - Magic & Armor.espCuteElf11.espMuffin Display Rooms.espKB - House of Wonders.espCM Partners.espDLCShiveringIsles.espUnofficial Shivering Isles Patch.espKendoGirl_Final.espDLCHorseArmor.espDLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.espDLCOrrery.espDLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.espDLCFrostcrag.espDLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.espKyoma's Spell Renamer.espDLCThievesDen.espDLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.espDLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch - SSSB.espDLCMehrunesRazor.espDLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.espDLCVileLair.espDLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.espDLCSpellTomes.espPrincessImperialCityApartment-COBL.espBisquits01.espElves Of Lineage II.espDemonRace.espNec Mystic High Elf-Remake.espNec Mystic Dark Elf-Remake.espThe Sexy BeastV1.2.espAsharasSirensAndTritons.espAbriael_Human.espAdvanced Magecraft.espVows and Covenants.espsun_&_night_elves.espChocolate Elves.espOonas_Outfitters.espApachii_Goddess_Store.espElves Of Lineage II Female Anime Voice.espxGG_Lolita_Revived.espAtropa.espUOP Vampire Aging & Face Fix.espOblivion Citadel Door Fix.espArrows of Channeling.espKnights.espKnights - Unofficial Patch.espReznod_Mannequin_HD[Eng].espShadowcrest_Vineyard_COBL.espmymerged Hair and Eyes.espZmergedClothArmor.espz2MergedArmor.espzArmor3.espYoungerNPCs.espSlof's Oblivion Robe Trader.espWitch's Throne.espNo psychic guards v1.2.espsycHearNoEvil.espMyArmortest.espColourwheels Sexy Stock Armor & Clothing Replacer.espColourwheels Sexy Female NPCs.espColourwheels Sexy Imperial Legion.espKnyghts.espMolagBalTreasury.espEY_AoD.espDemon_Consort.espSonia.espBHC_Expanded.espzzEDialog.espbartholm.espHarvest [Flora].espHarvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.espmoDem's City Life.espBlood Is Everything.espOrder of the Virtuous Blood Expanded v0.3.espSpreadingVampirism_NoSecondaryInfection.espHealer.espeyja.espCoverYourself.espBookTrackerOBSE.espGuard Sex.espsexdarkness_Eng_only_last.espDamsels_In_Distress.espPoses.espCMAllXenius.espPotiondesign.espSM Bounty.espStealthOverhaul.espStealthOverhaul, Cobl.espNaughty_Joana_01.espGet Wet - just droplets.espexhDual_Wield_Complete.espSC_Drow Race Addon - Plus Pack.espBasicInstinct.espsexycompanion.espOblivion Gate Map Marker Remover.espPoseidon_ii_s Super Sexy CM Companion Pack NoMartialArt.espEVE_StockEquipmentReplacer.espEVE_ShiveringIslesEasterEggs.espEVE_KnightsoftheNine.espOlivia01.espDibella_priestess.espBathingMod_Bathrooms.espSupremeMagicka.espSM_EnchantStaff.espSM_ShiveringIsles.espEnchantmentMastery.espP1DseeYouSleep.espP1DseeYouSleep - DLCVileLair.espSeductiveIdles.espOSM-All Genders.esppersonality_idles_custom.espCrowded Cities 15.espMap Marker Overhaul.espMap Marker Overhaul - SI additions.esproad+bridges.espNRB4 Standard Road Record.espWindowLightingSystem.espxulAncientRedwoods.espxulAncientYews.espxulArriusCreek.espxulAspenWood.espxulBlackwoodForest.espxulBravilBarrowfields.espxulBrenaRiverRavine.espxulCheydinhalFalls.espxulCloudtopMountains.espxulColovianHighlands_EV.espXulEntiusGorge.espxulFallenleafEverglade.espxulImperialIsle.espxulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.espxulLushWoodlands.espxulPantherRiver.espBartholm-Panther River Patch.espxulRiverEthe.espxulSkingradOutskirts.espxulStendarrValley.espxuldarkforest.espxulTheHeath.espxulRollingHills_EV.espxulPatch_AY_AC.espxulChorrolHinterland.espBetter Cities .espBetter Cities - Full City Defences.espBetter Cities Full.espBetter Cities - Unique Landscape Cheydinhal Falls.espBetter Cities - Unique Landscape Barrowfields.espBetter Imperial City.espBetter Cities - COBL.espBetter Cities - Unique Landscape Chorrol Hinterland.espBetter Cities - Unique Landscape Skingrad Outskirts.espBetter Cities - VWD of the IC.espBetter Cities - No LEYAWIIN Flooding.espSB IC Palace Tower Light Mod v1.1 - Modified Version.espNibenRiverFix.espRAEVWD New Sheoth.espLetThePeopleDrink.espArthur_Natural_Weather_HDR_by_Max_Tael.espEnhanced Water v2.0 HD.espNatural_Vegetation_by_Max_Tael.espNatural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.espBCSkingrad-SkingradOutskirts patch.espBCCheydinhalFULL-CheydinhalFalls patch.espBCChorrol-ChorrolHinterland fix.espBCBravilFULL-Barrowfields patch.espNRB4+Vineyard Patch.espNRB4+UL-II+LtPD Patch.espDropLitTorchOBSE.espColourwheels Sexy Female NPCs Vwalk UOS.espBetter Cities Full Vwalk.espBetter Imperial City Vwalk.espkuerteeCrimeHasWitnesses.espP-Froggys Wall Climbing EV.espkuerteeNPCsYield.espkuerteeSittableRocks.espRealSleepExtended.espkuerteeCustomisableHUDComponents.espEnhanced Economy.espEnhanced Economy - House prices.espBetter Cities - House price patch.espbartholm - EE patch.espFishing in Cyrodiil.espUnnecessaryViolence.espEnhanced Grabbing.espEnhanced Grabbing - Unnecessary Violence Liaison.espkuerteeClothingMatters.espDS Companion Wardrobe Manager.espStarX Vampire Deaths.espCobl Silent Equip Misc.espCobl Si.espCobl Glue.espRefScope.espSetBody.espFriends&Lovers.espBashed Patch, 0.espLCD MDMix.esp There are several files in there merged carefully by myself (using TES4Edit, copying entries to a new mod, making sure they work). They are mostly CM Companions and armors/clothing (e.g. all the "zmerged armor" or "myarmortest" ones, also CMall and CMXeniusall). I also merged some single global editing files like "Brighter Torches", or "Joinable Riverview" into other esps, so as to reduce the total number of ESPs. "Poses.esp" is pretty much all the pose mods i could find (CTAddpose whatitsname, Estrus, Chain it, etc..) Obviously because of the HUD and Cobl mods i use PLUGGY v132. Also OBSE in it's latest beta (i think 18v6). There is HGEC as the model replacer (and BBB by Coronerra along with his skeleton) with Ozmos hi rez texures. Also as mentioned QARLs TP3. Now keep in mind ALL these work together as they are, no crashes (at least not more than usual for Oblivion). But i have a feeling i am missing something and i SHOULD get much more FPS out of my system. I did notice that when i took out the Oblivion Crash Prevention System for OBSE i got about 4-5 FPS. Also as said before flickering lights give it a huge hit. When i look at the blank wall in start dungeon cell i get 60fps even looking up into the window. But as i turn to the torch, it goes to around 20-30. Just staring at it sometimes goes into the mid 10s sometimes low 30s. I already resinstalled the complete Oblivion to test and clean any unwanted textures/meshes. As i said a clean install with no mods only DLC will give me 60fps. I do not have the nerve to again try to install mod by mod (especially since so many are interdependant)... Does the sheer amount of files in the Data folder matter? Amount of esps? How about how many of the esps have masters or are masters themselves? I still think it is the number of scripts running, but then again why would it not go up again when i deselect all mods? It is not that it is unplayabale (and it looks awesome. If Oblivion came out looking like this today, it would win best graphics awards again i believe). I just have a feeling i am losing performance when i shouldn't. Oh, forgot settings for graphics: 1920x1200resHDR lighting and AA x8 (via Catalyst not via Oblivion). High detail on everything. (but makes no difference if off or low). Shadows off/on makes no difference.Everything else on default. Hope somebody out there with some experience can give me some ideas... Cheers,Emm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fonger Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 What really stumps me is that even if i have ALL esp unchecked (except for the DLC), it does not change at all. sounds like its texture or settings related. or perchance one of the non-esp mods are you using: "oblivion stutter remover" (it has unusual settings and strives {by default} for a very different low FPS) QTP3 - "designed to bring strong systems to their knees" in any case, that load order doesn't look like you've used BOSS (found on Tesnexus) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEmm Posted April 20, 2010 Author Share Posted April 20, 2010 HI Fonger, thanks for the quick reply... Yeah i did use Oblivion Stutter Remover, and removing the remover actually gave me around 3-4 fps in the most intense segments (like flickering torches). I am a little afraid to test the game even outside the dungeon, because if one torch can have that effect (60fps while looking at the cell wall, 24 while looking at the torch) i wouldn't want to know what the animated window lighting system will do... I did try BOSS once before and it completely destroyed my game (i had forgotten to backup my load order beforehand). I sort load order by hand (especially since i modified several of the mods and checked what is supposed to overrule what). If i understood Wrye Bash better, like it's BALO feature i might try that. But can load order really make a difference to how fast a game performs? And shouldn't the Bash Patch from Wrye Bash solve any leftover conflicts anyway? Especially when looked at in TES4Edit it seems that way. What gets me though is that i read posts from even years back that use QTP3 and several other high res texture mods and claim to be getting 45fps and much much worse systems than mine. I mean mine is really high end and it should have no problems with textures at all. It is not that the game is running badly, i am just wondering if it shouldn't run much better than it is. Can anybody give me a list of mods (espless or not) which are KNOWN to be performance hinderances? Maybe because of bad scripts and all that. I do think it has to do with that in my case. Well, i will try some things, but i am always grateful for any more advice and hints. Maybe somebody else with a similar load list (and hi res textures) could post their system specs and framerates, so i can compare a little. Also maybe some could post the "Oblivion.ini" so i could compare that with mine. Maybe there are some settings i overlooked. And just to reiterate, yes i did read all the tweak guides and scoured the forums. And that is what frustrates me so, because my comp seems to have much more power than others that say they get much higher framerates. Thanks in advance,Emm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bben46 Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 I am seeing a series of this kind of post. Supposedly super systems with dismal performance on a 4 year old game. I have been looking for a common factor, but haven't found it yet. If you find something , let me know so I can pass it on to others with this kind of problem. Here are my Slow Game suggestions so farhttp://tesnexus.com/articles/article.php?id=255 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEmm Posted April 21, 2010 Author Share Posted April 21, 2010 Thanks for the suggestions, i did look at them but none made any noticable difference. The weird thing is, i have added MORE hi res textures and now my fps around the torch is up by 11fps on average. Could broken Textures and Meshes also be a problem here? I still suspect scripts, but that is hard to test because so many mods need each other and disabling them all would simply mean a pure Oblivion with higher res textures and that ran at constant max 60fps before i added any ESP/ESM mods. Well more testing less playing, or was it the other way around ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEmm Posted April 27, 2010 Author Share Posted April 27, 2010 Okay, found something new today. Compared a fresh resinstall of Oblivion with one having only hi res texture packs installed with another one with my mod list above (but no hi res textures) and a 4th one with ALL of the above. Here is what i found. The SAME problems and exact same FPS (on average) on all 4 configurations. In fact putting in new textures actually seems to help more than hinder. On the new install i first thought, great it works, but then i played until the King comes into your cell and as soon as the extra NPC appeared my FPS dropped from the max (V-sync) 60 to under 20. That happened in every configuration. I think that is extremely weird, but i think it proves that Oblivion actually has a problem with high end hardware (or rather new high end hardware, as guess it runs fine on 2 year old machines, or so i read). I am really frustrated with this, and a little bit confused as Fallout 3, which i thought uses the same engine, runs absolutely smooth (actually did on my previous PC as well). And it is only Oblivion which has this problem. Every other game has increased performance from the new hardware. Damn, i thought i could finally use all these nice mods, only to find it's the hardware that limits it. And not in the way it was when the game came out first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakuvendell Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 (edited) UPDATE I have TWO HD 5850's in crossfire, 8 gb ddr3 1600, core i7 860 3.53 ghz. The issue is definitely the cards! I had a pair of GTX 285's in sli, which are older and weaker, and had great performance near torches. and it IS the torches conflicting with the new card, because everywhere else in oblivion ran BETTER! My Oblivion install was left intact when I upgraded, and the upgrade from the GTX 285's to the HD 5850's was the only change to hardware! Edited February 7, 2011 by shakuvendell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFact Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 UPDATE I have TWO HD 5850's in crossfire, 8 gb ddr3 1600, core i7 860 3.53 ghz. The issue is definitely the cards! I had a pair of GTX 285's in sli, which are older and weaker, and had great performance near torches. and it IS the torches conflicting with the new card, because everywhere else in oblivion ran BETTER! My Oblivion install was left intact when I upgraded, and the upgrade from the GTX 285's to the HD 5850's was the only change to hardware! Having SLi or Crossfire won't make Oblivion running better. And make sure you deleted Oblivion.ini(then regenerate it, configure graphic options) when you changed hardware and driver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakuvendell Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 (edited) Update: I dropped settings to low in the launcher. 24 fps near the two torch-wielding guards in market district, near Green Emperor Way, and then up to 70 fps as soon as they were off screen! Oblivion is listed as both SLI and CrossfireX optimized all over the internet, and in general I do notice performance improvements with both sli and crossfire configurations. It's just near torches held by npcs. torches on walls, and player held torches aren't a problem. Deleting and regenerating the .ini did not help. I have seen several other people dealing with this problem with newer Radeon cards. hopefully it will be remedied by future drivers... for now, I will keep trying. Edited February 8, 2011 by shakuvendell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEmm Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 I also have to say that crossfire does in fact increase performance, so whoever said it didn't simply is wrong. I notice a very stable 30-50% gain depending on the surroundings, but especially in NPC heavy areas the gains are the most. I haven't been able to do much in game testing lately because i am sorting out a problem between Kyomas "Menu Que" and the Obja.dll needed to play the game with japanese language support. However since i first wrote my problem, i have found out that one of my crossfire bridges had been broken and seriously slowed down my computer. Since i replaced that every single game i benchmarked doubled their performance, so i am holding out hope for Oblivion as well :) Maybe it also newer drivers, as the OpenCL drivers provided by ATI are definitely giving me a boost. I will write more about my experience once i can actually game again and not just mod and merge and edit ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts