The Greatest Miltary Commander

[DariusMoranda]

At the express request of a friend whose intellect and Irish wit I respect I am going to advocate for her candidates 'in suus absentis'. One of the individuals in question is Arthur Wellesley the 1st Duke of Wellington for the Tactical Category.

 

Wellesley rose to prominence as a general during the Peninsular War campaigns of the Napoleonic Wars. He was the only commander of the period to have exceeded the lessons that Napoleon innovated.

 

Wellington saw active service for the first time between June 1794 and April 1795 when his regiment was posted to the Netherlands in the early stages of the French Wars. His next experience of warfare was in India during the fourth Mysore War where he was involved in the fighting against Tippoo Sultan. The campaign culminated in the siege and fall of Seringapatam in May 1799. In 1803, and by then a Major-General, Wellington fought in the second Mahratta War against Scindiah of Gwalior; his successful campaigns included victories at Assaye and Argaum.

 

By October 1807 the Peninsular Campaign was under way after the French declared war on Portugal. The French occupied Spain in May 1808, which led to a Spanish and Portuguese revolt. A British expeditionary force under the temporary command of Wellington was sent to Iberia on 1 August by Lord Grenville's ministry; in its first campaign the British defeated the French at the Battle of Rolica and at Vimeiro. In January 1809, Wellington resumed command of the army in Iberia. From then until 1815, Wellington was occupied with leading the British army in the defeat of the French. Wellington's use of small highly trained rifle companies that were dispersed over Spain was the precursor of the modern Special Operations Groups such as the SAS. He was the only English or Allied general who drew lessons from the American Revolutionary War and applied them on a European battlefield.

 

In the Battle of Waterloo(1815) forces of the French Empire under Napoleon Bonaparte and Field Marshall Michel Ney were defeated by those of the Seventh Coalition, including a Prussian army under the command of Gebhard von Blücher and an Anglo-Allied army under the command of the Duke of Wellington. It was the decisive battle of the Waterloo Campaign and Bonaparte's last. The defeat at Waterloo put an end to Napoleon's rule as the French emperor, and marked the end of Napoleon's Hundred Days of return from exile.

 

Two large forces under Wellington and von Blücher assembled close to the northeastern border of France. Napoleon chose to attack in the hope of destroying them before they could join in a coordinated invasion of France with other members of the Coalition. The decisive engagement of this three day Waterloo Campaign (June 16-19, 1815) occurred at the Battle of Waterloo. According to Wellington, the battle was "the nearest-run thing you ever saw in your life." Wellington's positioning of weak Belgian troops in the center of his line drew the French cavalry in to be slaughtered by massed English squares deployed on the reverse slope was a master stroke that Napoleon and Ney never saw coming. Wellington had scouted the terrain in 1814 and "kept it in his pocket" for future use.

Napoleon delayed giving battle until noon on 18 June to allow the ground to dry. Wellington's army, positioned across the Brussels road on the Mont St Jean escarpment, withstood repeated attacks by the French, until, in the evening, the Prussians arrived in force and broke through Napoleon's right flank. At that moment, the British counter-attacked and drove the French army in disorder from the field. Pursuing Coalition forces entered France and restored Louis XVIII to the French throne.

 

Wellington was the only general in the Napoleonic Wars that defeated a French Army with Napoleon in direct command and hence a worthy candidate for tactical genius.

 

Great work on the Duke,my friend.I never knew much about sir Arthur,but I remember from the history classes about his famous Battle Of Assaye in India,against Marathans.More the perfect 'signing in' as a military commander,as he defeated and outmatched his opponents being outnumbered,but much more skilled in the art of war.Great battle and his biggest accomplishment along with his stoppage for Bonaparta.He had his own ways how to deal with a stronger enemy like Napoleon Grande Armee,with pretty custom solutions,like long-line formations placed on a higher position towards the enemy,known as 'slop defence in reverse' for a complete 'tie' and which were a proof of how genius this man was in his craft.That solved all the problems that Grande Armee gave with their artillery and defence positions.

 

Excellent man he was,the state funeral he recieved was a proof of it,as he is one a few who recieved such an honor,without having royal blood.One to pair with Admiral Horatio Nelson

 

The first and the last real Duke Of Wellington.

 

Moranda

[UK47]

it would have to be Ghengis Khan since he had the largest empire the world had ever known.

Actually the British Empire was the largest formal empire that the world had ever known.

[Surenas]

Unfortunately, strategy and tactics of the British Crown are focussed on marriages of the peers - their Rose Wars aren't part of the thread...

[Dark0ne]

Unfortunately, strategy and tactics of the British Crown are focussed on marriages of the peers - their Rose Wars aren't part of the thread...

 

Read the title; it says "The greatest military commander" not "The greatest military country". If you have your doubts about Wellington then air them else move along.

[Aurielius]

I seem to be doing another avocation 'in absentia' ,this time for an American friend who feels that I might do a passable job at it. His candidate is General George C. Patton.

 

North African Campaign

In 1942, Major General Patton commanded the 1st U.S. Armored Corps of the U.S. Army, which landed on the coast of Morocco in Operation Torch. Following the defeat of the U.S. Army by the German Afrika Korps at the Battle of Kasserine Pass in 1943, Patton was made lieutenant general and placed in command of II Corps. In March, he launched a counteroffensive and pushed the Germans east while British troops commanded by Gen. Bernard Montgomery in Egypt were simultaneously pushed the Germans west, effectively squeezing the Germans out of North Africa.

 

Sicilian Campaign

Patton was charged with liberating the western half of the island, while Gen. Montgomery's 8th British Army was to liberate the east. Patton exceeded his mandate and liberated Palermo and then almost beat Montgomery to Messina. even by going the long way around the island. Patton was temporarily relieved of his duty at the end of the Sicilian campaign.

 

Normandy Campaign

Following the Normandy invasion, Patton was placed in command of the Third Army, which was on the extreme right (west) of the Allied land forces. He led this army during Operation Cobra, leading the breakout from earlier slow fighting in the Normandy ' bocage hedge rows' country. General Patton besieged Cherbourg, and then assisting in trapping several hundred thousand German soldiers in Falaise. Patton used Germany's own blitzkrieg tactics against them, transiting 600 miles in just two weeks. Patton's offensive, however, came to a halt as the army simply ran out of gasoline on the Meuse river just outside of Metz., By Nov, Metz had fallen to the 3rd Army, the first time the city had fallen since the Franco-Prussian War.

 

Ardennes Offensive

The Ardennes Offensive ( Battle of the Bulge), was the final offensive of the German army in World War II. On Dec16, 1944, the German army threw 29 divisions (totalling some 600,000 men) at a weak point in the Allied lines and made massive headway towards the Meuse river during one of the worst winters in Europe in years. Patton abruptly turned the Third Army north (a considerable tactical and logistical achievement), disengaging from the front line to relieve the surrounded and besieged 101st Airborne Division trapped in Bastogne. By February, the Germans were once again in full retreat. Patton subsequently moved into the Saar Basin of Germany. Patton was planning to take Prague, Czechoslovakia, when the forward movement of American forces was halted due to the division's of military zones agreed to prior at Yalta. Patton's army group liberated Pilsen and most of West Bohemia before war's end

 

Patton should be thought of in the same light as Rommel, both superb armoured tactical commanders. General Patton has been considered the greatest American tank commander to have ever served in the field. Patton's 3rd army had inferior tanks and anti-tank artillery to his Axis counterparts but his use of mobility and close air support easily made up that disparity in the field. The Germans feared him more than any other Allied general (at least according to Field Marshall von Rundstedt -OB West Chief of Staff). General George C. Patton was easily the equal if not superior to Field Marshall Rommel and hence a worthy candidate for Tactical consideration.

[UK47]

Don't respost things when I've deleted them. -Dark0ne

Well I didn't mean to, but I thought I forgot to post it, so ? why did you deleted my post exactly ?

 

I'd already told him to move along if he can't add anything worthwhile to the content, no need to derail the thread down a flame route.

[DariusMoranda]

I seem to be doing another avocation 'in absentia' ,this time for an American friend who feels that I might do a passable job at it. His candidate is General George C. Patton.

 

North African Campaign

In 1942, Major General Patton commanded the 1st U.S. Armored Corps of the U.S. Army, which landed on the coast of Morocco in Operation Torch. Following the defeat of the U.S. Army by the German Afrika Korps at the Battle of Kasserine Pass in 1943, Patton was made lieutenant general and placed in command of II Corps. In March, he launched a counteroffensive and pushed the Germans east while British troops commanded by Gen. Bernard Montgomery in Egypt were simultaneously pushed the Germans west, effectively squeezing the Germans out of North Africa.

 

Sicilian Campaign

Patton was charged with liberating the western half of the island, while Gen. Montgomery's 8th British Army was to liberate the east. Patton exceeded his mandate and liberated Palermo and then almost beat Montgomery to Messina. even by going the long way around the island. Patton was temporarily relieved of his duty at the end of the Sicilian campaign.

 

Normandy Campaign

Following the Normandy invasion, Patton was placed in command of the Third Army, which was on the extreme right (west) of the Allied land forces. He led this army during Operation Cobra, leading the breakout from earlier slow fighting in the Normandy ' bocage hedge rows' country. General Patton besieged Cherbourg, and then assisting in trapping several hundred thousand German soldiers in Falaise. Patton used Germany's own blitzkrieg tactics against them, transiting 600 miles in just two weeks. Patton's offensive, however, came to a halt as the army simply ran out of gasoline on the Meuse river just outside of Metz., By Nov, Metz had fallen to the 3rd Army, the first time the city had fallen since the Franco-Prussian War.

 

Ardennes Offensive

The Ardennes Offensive ( Battle of the Bulge), was the final offensive of the German army in World War II. On Dec16, 1944, the German army threw 29 divisions (totalling some 600,000 men) at a weak point in the Allied lines and made massive headway towards the Meuse river during one of the worst winters in Europe in years. Patton abruptly turned the Third Army north (a considerable tactical and logistical achievement), disengaging from the front line to relieve the surrounded and besieged 101st Airborne Division trapped in Bastogne. By February, the Germans were once again in full retreat. Patton subsequently moved into the Saar Basin of Germany. Patton was planning to take Prague, Czechoslovakia, when the forward movement of American forces was halted due to the division's of military zones agreed to prior at Yalta. Patton's army group liberated Pilsen and most of West Bohemia before war's end

 

Patton should be thought of in the same light as Rommel, both superb armoured tactical commanders. General Patton has been considered the greatest American tank commander to have ever served in the field. Patton's 3rd army had inferior tanks and anti-tank artillery to his Axis counterparts but his use of mobility and close air support easily made up that disparity in the field. The Germans feared him more than any other Allied general (at least according to Field Marshall von Rundstedt -OB West Chief of Staff). General George C. Patton was easily the equal if not superior to Field Marshall Rommel and hence a worthy candidate for Tactical consideration.

 

Good job (as always) on general Patton.:thumbsup:

 

Unlike his colleague Douglas MacArthur who was more of a diplomat and politician,often clumsy with his decisions,posing in front of the camera and talking more then doing,general George Patton actually performed everything he said,and he was a loud son of a gun.Pure and simple,real soldier,to the bone.He was one to pair with Desert Fox and Montgomery

 

One of the main things I admire this man is that he brought almost german discipline among his men.You just couldn't go out on the flag in the morning with your shirt unzipped and 3 days old beard.That was a no-no with this guy,and starting from that fix he made,it brought bigger positive results on the battlefield.His Third Army was the most successful individual force in the WW2 of the US side,being involved in many fronts,as well as some key battles against Wehrmacht.Most notable,Battle Of The Bulge,nothing to add on that,it is a text book for all who wants to learn how the thing should be done.

 

North Africa was brilliant on both sides,and it was the 'cleanest' campaign of both allies and axis.No camps,no death labor,no massacres,just pure,good ol' fair fight.Even Italian Royal Army showed gust there ( though,Rodolfo Graziani did threw some mustard gas here and there,Italo Gariboldi haven't had luck with Rommel as a cooperator,and Etore Bastico came at the very end of the Royal Army in the North Africa campaign,which was almost utterly destroyed by US and British troops by the end of 1943)

 

General Patton was in Africa,France and Germany and wherever he stood with his boot,he put a flag along.It was too bad that he wasn't a supreme commander of the allied forces,instead of Douglas(with all due respect) ,it would saved more lives that way and Hirohito's Imperial Army would fall more quickly,but Patton was kinda dangerous to put on a higher place,as he had some extreme visions of his possible further accomplishments.

 

Nonethless,he was a great soldier and a great man.Sad thing how he died,after a very productive military career.

 

Salutes and compliments

 

Moranda

[Rlburgendy]

BUSH WAS THE BEST!

 

If theres any one who could do better GLEN BECK!

[Aurielius]

BUSH WAS THE BEST!

 

If theres any one who could do better GLEN BECK!

 

Just curious, did you even read the parameters for submission of an candidate?

The polite version is: No supporting argument, so not viable for consideration.

 

@ All Participants

I am collecting the additional candidates for final inclusion in the poll, just wanted to allow enough time for all opinions to be expressed. I will post it in the next few days....sort of a last call from the publican so to speak.

[UK47]

What about Alexander the great? Horatio nelson?