how much is 'script heavy'?

[Mattiewagg]

Well, I thought it would be unreasonable to ask for a consistent answer, which is why I didn't ask for one. I didn't think it was unreasonable to ask for a number of opinions, which is what I did ask for.

 

Surely there's a ballpark number that you could guess without looking that there's some unjustifiable script use going on. If there's a metric other than script count that you would use to measure a mod's overhead, then describe it. I don't expect that to be objective either, so feel free to give your opinion and explain your reasons.

 

There's not really, though. While you can probably guess that maybe, just maybe, certain mods might utilize a type of script that would be termed damaging, there are so many ways to do things and many, many clever workarounds that people can discover using Papyrus so you can't necessarily tell if that "damaging" type of script is really being used.

 

For example, I can say that while I can't think of any categories off the top of my head, there may be certain types of mods that constantly "poll" often, which can cause save game bloating and other such issues. But like I said, especially now that so many modders know that polling is bad, the mod might not necessarily use that method. I try to avoid judging the mod based on the fact that, just because it is a certain type of mod, it may have too many scripts, or bad ones.

 

I know this probably wasn't the answer you were looking for, but somebody else might give you a stronger opinion. There are some people who look at a mod and say - oh, scripts, I can't use that! It'll ruin everything! But that's not really true. Just look at the massive amount of scripts that are used in the base game. It's really about what sorts of functions and methods you use within the script, rather than the amount. Though certainly, having 20, 000 scripts is bound to do some damage.

[Oraclesoldier]

So if I'm understanding what I've read so far. It's okay to have a decent amount of scripted mods as long as you don't have 1,000 scripted mods running at the same time constantly? For example, I use:

 

Realistic Needs and Diseases

Wet and Cold

Frostfall

 

 

[Mattiewagg]

So if I'm understanding what I've read so far. It's okay to have a decent amount of scripted mods as long as you don't have 1,000 scripted mods running at the same time constantly? For example, I use:

 

Realistic Needs and Diseases

Wet and Cold

Frostfall

 

 

That's fine. Wet and Cold uses scripts, but it's a great mod and as far as I know it doesn't "misuse" them. Just check the latest file to see when it was last updated (anything in 2012 or before you should probably avoid), and the comments. If a bunch of people say it's unstable in the comments, don't use it.

[enkephalin07]

What is 'polling'?

 

I'm looking at my latest save file with Save tool, and see only 56 active scripts, 6.9k scripts in total, but 63k instantiated. That last number seems pretty excessive to me. How would that be justified?

 

I haven't done a mod since Morrowind, up until the guy who developed Morrowind Script Extender got hired by Bethesda, and support kind of vanished because there wasn't a clear successor to the project.

[Mattiewagg]

What is 'polling'?

 

I'm looking at my latest save file with Save tool, and see only 56 active scripts, 6.9k scripts in total, but 63k instantiated. That last number seems pretty excessive to me. How would that be justified?

 

I haven't done a mod since Morrowind, up until the guy who developed Morrowind Script Extender got hired by Bethesda, and support kind of vanished because there wasn't a clear successor to the project.

 

I intend to write an article on polling on my site, but here's the short version:

 

Polling is when a script constantly checks for something, and continues to do so until that thing is found. It's basically doing this:

 

Has [insert something to look for here] happened yet?

 

If yes, do something.

 

If no, in one second (or something like that), go back to the beginning.

 

This results in constantly having a script running, which is bad. It also means that if you try to uninstall the mod residual scripts will be left.

[Ceruulean]

I consider a script heavy mod a mod that has scripts running often. That includes Frostfall, Wet and Cold, even Convenient Horses can be script heavy at times. The more scripted mods you accumulate, the higher chance that all the scripts will be incompatible or start fighting for memory. Then you've got vanilla scripts competing with mod scripts, and the game's engine cannot handle all of them, resulting in lag. As the modder, you have to discern which mods to use because you cannot throw in a bunch of heavily scripted mods and expect them to work seamlessly. it's not always the mod author's fault; no matter how well done the scripting is, it's simply the engine that's limited.

 

As long as you can get your game working without unusual delays in quests and other scripted events, you should be fine.

Edited August 17, 2014 by Ceruulean

[enkephalin07]

I'm not sure how scripting works now, but in Morrowind's engine, every script looped unless specifically terminated, and it became common convention to let them keep cycling perpetually. Or slightly better, let it loop until it becomes relevant, then execute its instructions before self-deleting. Now you have AI packages to handle recurring conditions more efficiently, and use stationary NPCs to handle scripting functions that used to have to run in objects.