Aliens

[marharth]

Only a mile away from the quarries? That's nothing. The bluestones for Stonehenge came from a lot further than that, from the Preseli area of Wales to be precise. As jim_uk says, the workers on the pyramids numbered many thousands at any one time. They were not aliens but highly skilled, and by the standards of the day, very well paid and well fed - excavations around the pyramids and the royal necropolis near Luxor prove that. In fact there was a stele that was found documenting the fact that they would go on strike if they didn't get their pay and rations on time. Thus, great feat of engineering though the pyramids may be, built by aliens...nah, by a well organized workforce.

 

For myself I am a little sceptical about the existence of aliens...mostly. Then I look at some of the oddballs in politics and showbiz and I begin to wonder.

Its not mathematically possible for 10,000 constant working people with rope and stone to build such a massive structure in 20 years.

 

Once again, regardless of the skill or numbers you would have to travel 5 miles in 5 minutes just to get a block of stone to the building site in order to build it in 20 years.

[TheCalliton]

it appears some do not believe i exist...

 

KIDDING! i dont believe in aliens, they would have contacted us by now

[bben46]

Aliens? Probably do exist. Here? Probably not

 

As to building huge structures, for years all of the speculation was done by archeologists - who are not trained in construction techniques. Then someone thought to ask an engineer who did have training and experience in construction with large blocks how he would do it.

 

He demonstrated his technique using his wife, daughter, teenage son and a neighbor boy to help him lift a 2 ton block 30 inches and place it on top of another 2 ton block.

 

No fancy machinery and nothing that would not have been readily available to the ancients. They used levers to move one side up a few inches, placed cribbing under it, then reset the levers and did it again on the other side. Reset, repeat. It took his completely untrained fork crew less than 5 minutes to raise the block 30 inches and slide it into the other one. The hardest part was sliding it onto the other one - it took all five of them to shove it with no lubrication at all. So, slightly larger work crews, and lots of them - but no where near the hundred thousand predicted by the archeologists.

 

The engineer predicted that using his technique it would take a crew of about 2500 three to five years to set the stone for the basic pyramid as we know it. another 3 to 5 years or so to do the finish work. But the cutting and shaping would have taken the longest, about 10 years total so he believed they started cuttting stone long before starting construction.

[marharth]

Aliens? Probably do exist. Here? Probably not

 

As to building huge structures, for years all of the speculation was done by archeologists - who are not trained in construction techniques. Then someone thought to ask an engineer who did have training and experience in construction with large blocks how he would do it.

 

He demonstrated his technique using his wife, daughter, teenage son and a neighbor boy to help him lift a 2 ton block 30 inches and place it on top of another 2 ton block.

 

No fancy machinery and nothing that would not have been readily available to the ancients. They used levers to move one side up a few inches, placed cribbing under it, then reset the levers and did it again on the other side. Reset, repeat. It took his completely untrained fork crew less than 5 minutes to raise the block 30 inches and slide it into the other one. The hardest part was sliding it onto the other one - it took all five of them to shove it with no lubrication at all. So, slightly larger work crews, and lots of them - but no where near the hundred thousand predicted by the archeologists.

 

The engineer predicted that using his technique it would take a crew of about 2500 three to five years to set the stone for the basic pyramid as we know it. another 3 to 5 years or so to do the finish work. But the cutting and shaping would have taken the longest, about 10 years total so he believed they started cuttting stone long before starting construction.

 

Your forgetting the part about moving it over a mile distance, and how they were able to do the mathematics. If they had such advanced knowledge of mathematics they should of been able to build better machines then rope and stone.

 

it appears some do not believe i exist...

 

KIDDING! i dont believe in aliens, they would have contacted us by now

Your acting like you think humans are important, why would aliens contact us? Would you walk up to a ant hill and say "Oh hi ants, how are you doing. Show me how your society works!"

Edited December 29, 2010 by marharth

[ginnyfizz]

Marharth, using your argument that would mean almost all of our ancient and medieval buildings (and we have rather a lot of them where I live)must have been built by the aliens, since most of them were a lot more than a mile from the stone quarries from whence their building blocks came. I can't think of any of our medieval English cathedrals built on top of a quarry. Bben46 has explained how they probably would have done the building of the pyramids. I have mentioned Stonehenge - some of the stones were found on site, but most came from quarries about 25 miles away and there is debate about whether the bluestones came from Preseli or from a glacial deposit, but certainly most of the stuff came from much more than a mile away. Ancient man, whether Egyptian or otherwise, was more sophisticated than you give them credit for. Between man and animals, they could have done it.

[marharth]

Marharth, using your argument that would mean almost all of our ancient and medieval buildings (and we have rather a lot of them where I live)must have been built by the aliens, since most of them were a lot more than a mile from the stone quarries from whence their building blocks came. I can't think of any of our medieval English cathedrals built on top of a quarry. Bben46 has explained how they probably would have done the building of the pyramids. I have mentioned Stonehenge - some of the stones were found on site, but most came from quarries about 25 miles away and there is debate about whether the bluestones came from Preseli or from a glacial deposit, but certainly most of the stuff came from much more than a mile away. Ancient man, whether Egyptian or otherwise, was more sophisticated than you give them credit for. Between man and animals, they could have done it.

I didn't say that aliens did it... I said that I think ancient Egyptians had similar technology to what we have today.

 

Medieval cathedrals were smaller and took a lot less time to build. The stone henge was much easier to build.

 

Comparing the Stonehenge to the great pyramid is like comparing a wooden shack to a castle.

 

The only thing the Stonehenge is, is a bunch of cut out stones in a pattern that got turned over. The great pyramid is much more complex then that.

 

My argument is that the great pyramid could not have been built within a pharaohs rule (let alone a mere 20 years).

 

100,000 men worked on the pyramid at once. It took 10,512,000 minutes to complete. 2.3 million stones are in the pyramid.

 

If you were using the method described above, it would be going rather slow. Max 3 miles per hour. The quarries were a mile away. At a high speed it would take around 20 minutes to transfer a stone from the qaurry to the pyramid. It would take about 20 minutes to cut out a single stone I am being extremely generous also... Once you have the stone there ill say 10 minutes for putting it in place. That's a total of 50 minutes to move and place a stone, with me changing the times to things that are very unlikely.

 

Now to multiply 2.3 million blocks and 50 minutes you get 115,000,000 which is clearly bigger then the time limit. With 20 minutes its still 46,000,000. Even if it took just 5 minutes to cut and move the blocks you would still be over the 20 year mark at 11,500,000.

[RZ1029]

Firstly, and most obviously, there have supposedly been physical encounters, UFO sightings and crop circles. This isn't the most compelling evidence to me.

 

Secondly, there are buildings, for example the great pyramid(s), which are built with near impossible precision for people of that time.

The Great Pyramid of Giza stands 450 feet tall (137 meters) and consists of two million blocks of stone, weighing from 2.5 tons up to 50 tons. How would they move and stack these stones?

The three pyramids there are also is similar positions to 'Orion's belt'.

The Great Pyramid is also located at the centre of the Earth's landmass - from what I've heard.

 

Thirdly, there are similar buildings and structures around the world which have the same high quality of work on them which date back to the ancient era. Builders at the time couldn't have constructed anything with the precision shown.

These buildings also have references to positions of things in space, such as significant planets and constellations.

 

And lastly, do you think that governments are trying to hide the facts? That they are covering up evidence for these things?

 

First point:

I'll definitely agree with you there, while interesting and sometimes amusing, I discredit 98% of all UFO sightings as being alien craft of any sort. Many of them resemble things used by the military today, and just aren't very well known.

 

Second point:

Here, I'm going to have to argue a lot. They could be built, with time, using multi-tiered ramps and a series of pulley systems and counter-weights. I watched something the other day where a guy went through a pyramid and showed his theory and the markings and evidence behind it where a complex system of pulleys was set on a pulley that was shifted further up the pyramid as it was built, allowing them to build these massive constructs. Moving them is, logistically, a bit nuts. Impossible? No. A feat of epic proportions for pencil pushers everywhere? Indeed.

 

The location I can explain every easily. Astrology. Not astronomy, astrology. The ancient Egyptians had a massive part of their belief/superstition in the stars and their signs. So, logically, they would choose something of significance. Perhaps Orions belt was of great religious importance during that time. Center of the landmass... uhm... well, if that's true... I've got no explanation. Coincidence, possibly, or perhaps they knew/believed/understood something we have lost through the ages.

 

Third point:

Like I said, astrology was a massive part of almost any religion at that point because we as a race didn't know much about space. The precision is possible, because despite the fact that we've got much more technology now, much of it is still the same basic concept, just digitized and such.

 

Fourth/Final point:

Covering up something? Probably. Alien visitation? Unlikely. More probably some sort of new prototype aircraft/spacecraft.

 

As a note, I doubt humans are interesting enough to study. We're petty squabblers who don't live all that long, and assuming there is a sentient life out there somewhere that is more advanced than us, I'm pretty sure they're not interested.

 

That being said, I believe there is life out there. Perhaps not something as 'intelligent' as a human, but life nonetheless.

[marharth]

Firstly, and most obviously, there have supposedly been physical encounters, UFO sightings and crop circles. This isn't the most compelling evidence to me.

 

Secondly, there are buildings, for example the great pyramid(s), which are built with near impossible precision for people of that time.

The Great Pyramid of Giza stands 450 feet tall (137 meters) and consists of two million blocks of stone, weighing from 2.5 tons up to 50 tons. How would they move and stack these stones?

The three pyramids there are also is similar positions to 'Orion's belt'.

The Great Pyramid is also located at the centre of the Earth's landmass - from what I've heard.

 

Thirdly, there are similar buildings and structures around the world which have the same high quality of work on them which date back to the ancient era. Builders at the time couldn't have constructed anything with the precision shown.

These buildings also have references to positions of things in space, such as significant planets and constellations.

 

And lastly, do you think that governments are trying to hide the facts? That they are covering up evidence for these things?

 

First point:

I'll definitely agree with you there, while interesting and sometimes amusing, I discredit 98% of all UFO sightings as being alien craft of any sort. Many of them resemble things used by the military today, and just aren't very well known.

 

Second point:

Here, I'm going to have to argue a lot. They could be built, with time, using multi-tiered ramps and a series of pulley systems and counter-weights. I watched something the other day where a guy went through a pyramid and showed his theory and the markings and evidence behind it where a complex system of pulleys was set on a pulley that was shifted further up the pyramid as it was built, allowing them to build these massive constructs. Moving them is, logistically, a bit nuts. Impossible? No. A feat of epic proportions for pencil pushers everywhere? Indeed.

 

The location I can explain every easily. Astrology. Not astronomy, astrology. The ancient Egyptians had a massive part of their belief/superstition in the stars and their signs. So, logically, they would choose something of significance. Perhaps Orions belt was of great religious importance during that time. Center of the landmass... uhm... well, if that's true... I've got no explanation. Coincidence, possibly, or perhaps they knew/believed/understood something we have lost through the ages.

 

Third point:

Like I said, astrology was a massive part of almost any religion at that point because we as a race didn't know much about space. The precision is possible, because despite the fact that we've got much more technology now, much of it is still the same basic concept, just digitized and such.

 

Fourth/Final point:

Covering up something? Probably. Alien visitation? Unlikely. More probably some sort of new prototype aircraft/spacecraft.

 

As a note, I doubt humans are interesting enough to study. We're petty squabblers who don't live all that long, and assuming there is a sentient life out there somewhere that is more advanced than us, I'm pretty sure they're not interested.

 

That being said, I believe there is life out there. Perhaps not something as 'intelligent' as a human, but life nonetheless.

 

Read the post above yours, it explains how a pulley system with rope and stone would not work.

[ginnyfizz]

 

Comparing the Stonehenge to the great pyramid is like comparing a wooden shack to a castle.

 

The only thing the Stonehenge is, is a bunch of cut out stones in a pattern that got turned over. The great pyramid is much more complex then that.

 

 

You obviously don't know much about Stonehenge if you think that, you are just making statements without back up. There is rather a lot more to Stonehenge and its surrounding area than that - try Wikipedia or even a history/archaeology book. The Great Pyramid of Khufu has remained intact, so looks bigger. The point is that for structures from Stonehenge right through the ages, the building blocks were frequently moved a LOT more than a mile. However they did it, they did it, and you can make as many mathematical hypotheses as you like, yours are only hypotheses. It happened, and man did it. Not the aliens.

 

And this beggars belief

 

"Medieval cathedrals were smaller and took a lot less time to build"

 

Oh REALLY? Ever been in, for example, somewhere like Winchester Cathedral, the largest Norman/Gothic church in Europe? York Minster? Notre Dame de Paris? Chartres? Not only are they all huge, they also took many years to build, certainly not less than the Great Pyramid, and they are assuredly very complex structures, and miles from the quarries too. By way of comparison, when Buckfast Abbey was rebuilt by eight monks at the beginning of the 20th century, with modern-ish transport and machinery and a quarry a mere three miles away, it still took them twenty years.

[BlackBaron2]

Are there aliens?

Sure, I think it would be silly to believe this blue dot was the only planet with intelligent life.

 

Have they ever been here?

Well, I don't know, and I don't trust the nutty magazines with the stories about "Indigo Children", "Crystal Children", cattle mutilations, and stories from drunk men about Bigfoot. If there was something in a major news source, other than Faux News, about an alien encounter, or if I saw an alien, I'd believe it, I guess.

 

What would they do here?

Probably not probe us and kill our farm animals. They might want to eat us, colonise our planet, or make friends. Who knows? Truthfully, though, I can't see any reason for an alien to want to be here.