The situation in Egypt

[JimboUK]

I wonder how far this will spread? there's already been trouble in Algeria and Yemen. The Arab world seems to be having its own 1989.

 

I honestly hope the people don't just accept military rule and a rigged vote...

 

If this turns into another Iran I am going to be seriously pissed.

 

I don't think they'll put up with it, they know now just how powerful the will of the people can be.

[Vindekarr]

Power to the people baby!

 

Honestly, sitting down the other day, seeing the news headline "Egypt in uproar as Mubarek steps down" left me happier than a month of icecream sundayes. Doubly so since it was done with relatively little bloodshed, i'd been increasingly afraid that this was going to be simply smashed by the military, it wasnt, and for that we cana ll be thankful.

 

Beyond the initial, wonderful deposing of that creepy tyrant, and the message of "guys, if you dont like your local tyrant, you can knock him down if you do enough" it's sent to the rest of Africa and the region, I am also pleased that we've had promises of democracy already.

 

I dont think we need to worry about a rigged vote, the military are in power for the moment, and many political groups will attempt to use this to gain extra power or influence, but it's unlikely the people will accept a corrupt or invalid result. They didnt accept Mubarek, they wont accept the next guy if they prove to be even worse.

Edited February 13, 2011 by Vindekarr

[SpellAndShield]

I really hope we can find another puppet dictator for our government to pay off so we can continue our plots and ploys in the Middle East.... :rolleyes:

[ginnyfizz]

I think we should be careful what we wish for, because let's be honest, it isn't in Western interests for the Middle East to turn into a powder keg again. The Egyptian people interviewed, at least in the British media, also seemed apprehensive about what will replace Mubarak, and not necessarily alarmed at military rule at least for a time. They have grown used to peace with Israel and very few have the desire to return to hostilities. This has a lot to do with compulsory military service and the certainty that in the event of hostilities the young men WOULD be cannon fodder. Many, particularly women, and also the large Christian population to be found in Egypt, are alarmed at the suggestion that the Muslim Brotherhood might get into power and impose a theocracy. (They have probably seen some of the disgusting footage of stonings and hangings from Afghanistan and Iran that I have.)

 

It was certainly put a smile on my face to hear that the delightful (not) Mr Ahmedinajad in Iran is so worried by events in Egypt that he is having the BBC World Service Farsi language broadcasts jammed, just in case the Iranian people get any ideas. I suspect that he severely underestimates a great nation, which with a bit of luck, will be to his extreme disadvantage.

[SpellAndShield]

I think we should be careful what we wish for, because let's be honest, it isn't in Western interests for the Middle East to turn into a powder keg again. The Egyptian people interviewed, at least in the British media, also seemed apprehensive about what will replace Mubarak, and not necessarily alarmed at military rule at least for a time. They have grown used to peace with Israel and very few have the desire to return to hostilities. This has a lot to do with compulsory military service and the certainty that in the event of hostilities the young men WOULD be cannon fodder. Many, particularly women, and also the large Christian population to be found in Egypt, are alarmed at the suggestion that the Muslim Brotherhood might get into power and impose a theocracy. (They have probably seen some of the disgusting footage of stonings and hangings from Afghanistan and Iran that I have.)

 

It was certainly put a smile on my face to hear that the delightful (not) Mr Ahmedinajad in Iran is so worried by events in Egypt that he is having the BBC World Service Farsi language broadcasts jammed, just in case the Iranian people get any ideas. I suspect that he severely underestimates a great nation, which with a bit of luck, will be to his extreme disadvantage.

 

Most of what is unfolding in Egypt is our fault; we have a large number of puppet dictators in the Middle East, Mubarak was just one of them. We need to stop getting involved in the internal affairs of other nations; it would be better for us and the rest of the world. Most polls show that Arabs see the US as the major blocking power towards democracy in the Middle East. As long as our puppets can keep peace (at the cost of crushing their own populations to dust) we are happy.

[Nadimos]

Yes, we (still) actively support this regimes with technology. Many firms sell survailance technology there and the people get intruded upon (and then sent into prison to be tortured, if they dont listen) or vodafone who send propaganda messages and switch of the internet on command. Edited February 13, 2011 by Nadimos

[SpellAndShield]

NOAM CHOMSKY:

 

Well, in 1958, Eisenhower—this is in internal discussions, since declassified—Eisenhower expressed his concern for what he called the "campaign of hatred against us" in the Arab world, not by the governments, but by the people. Remember, 1958, this was a rather striking moment. Just two years before, Eisenhower had intervened forcefully to compel Israel, Britain and France to withdraw from their invasion of Egyptian territory. And you would have expected enormous enthusiasm and support for the United States at that moment, and there was, briefly, but it didn’t last, because policies returned to the norm. So when he was speaking two years later, there was, as he said, a "campaign of hatred against us." And he was naturally concerned why. Well, the National Security Council, the highest planning body, had in fact just come out with a report on exactly this issue. They concluded that, yes, indeed, there’s a campaign of hatred. They said there’s a perception in the Arab world that the United States supports harsh and brutal dictators and blocks democracy and development, and does so because we’re interested in—we’re concerned to control their energy resources.

[marharth]

Not sure if anyone brought up the Muslim Brotherhood...

 

Ill go ahead and post on that.

 

1. THEY ARE NOT TERRORISTS IN ANYWAY!

 

2. I do not think they even want to be part of elections.

 

3. Al Qeuda does not like them, no terrorist group likes them. (they are somewhat neutral with Hamas though.)

 

4. Anything that is said about them being violent/starting the protests is entirely propaganda and nothing more.

 

5. They believe in spreading Islam through peaceful means.

 

Saying the Muslim Brotherhood is going to take over Egypt and be violent is petty equal to saying that the catholic church will take over Italy and be violent.

 

Honestly I m starting to lose hope it will turn out good. I can't believe anyone in the USA could say democratic protests are evil...

[SpellAndShield]

Not sure if anyone brought up the Muslim Brotherhood...

 

Ill go ahead and post on that.

 

1. THEY ARE NOT TERRORISTS IN ANYWAY!

 

2. I do not think they even want to be part of elections.

 

3. Al Qeuda does not like them, no terrorist group likes them. (they are somewhat neutral with Hamas though.)

 

4. Anything that is said about them being violent/starting the protests is entirely propaganda and nothing more.

 

5. They believe in spreading Islam through peaceful means.

 

Saying the Muslim Brotherhood is going to take over Egypt and be violent is petty equal to saying that the catholic church will take over Italy and be violent.

 

Honestly I m starting to lose hope it will turn out good. I can't believe anyone in the USA could say democratic protests are evil...

 

Of course it won't turn out well; we (the USA) are addicting to being the world tyrant/policeman; we have to have our hands involved in everything that happens, so no, it won't turn out well. Egypt now is a major loss for our policy makers since we have lost a valuable puppet who 'kept the peace'. If we are 'lucky' we can find a new dictator and bribe him to cow the people into obedience again.

[ginnyfizz]

Not sure if anyone brought up the Muslim Brotherhood...

 

I did actually, try reading my post...

 

Ill go ahead and post on that.

 

1. THEY ARE NOT TERRORISTS IN ANYWAY!

 

That's highly debatable, try reading this Wikipedia article on The Muslim Brotherhod

 

2. I do not think they even want to be part of elections.

 

Then you think wrong

 

3. Al Qeuda does not like them, no terrorist group likes them. (they are somewhat neutral with Hamas though.)

 

Hamas is actually an offshoot of the Brotherhood

 

4. Anything that is said about them being violent/starting the protests is entirely propaganda and nothing more.

 

No-one said they started the protests

 

5. They believe in spreading Islam through peaceful means.

 

Oh no they don't. They believe in spreading it by any means possible including Jihad - ""The process of settlement is a 'Civilization-Jihadist Process' with all the word means. The Ikhwan must understand that their work in America is a kind of grand Jihad in eliminating and destroying the Western civilization from within and "sabotaging" its miserable house by their hands and the hands of the believers so that it is eliminated and God's religion is made victorious over all other religions."

 

Saying the Muslim Brotherhood is going to take over Egypt and be violent is petty equal to saying that the catholic church will take over Italy and be violent.

 

Honestly I m starting to lose hope it will turn out good. I can't believe anyone in the USA could say democratic protests are evil...

 

No-one said that democratic protests are evil, oh and by the way (a) we are not all in the USA and (b) we still have some democracies in Europe, the efforts of the EU notwithstanding.

 

Let us not pretend that the Muslim Brotherhood are benign, they wish for Sharia law and a theocracy.

 

Once more, we are being very naive in expecting the US and other Western Governments to keep out of it. We would not like the results if they did, of that I am quite sure.