A trend I suggest avoiding...

[Fatalmasterpiece]

I don't see the point of taking down a mod just because your not into modding anymore. It takes more effort to actually go and delete the files than just leave it where it is and move on with your life. It's as if the moder wants people to know he left and thus seeks the attention he gets from the deletion.

 

So you don't make mods anymore, just leave your stuff sitting there as it is for those who want it. It's not hurting anyone and it's silly to just delete the files because then no one can enjoy them.

[evilneko]

How can I steal something that was freely given to me? It's stealing for me to freely give to others something that was also freely given to me?

 

Were sin a US resident could he file a criminal or even civil complaint against me for providing Tailor Maid to someone who asked for it?

[Ferryt]

evilneko, we're getting into a rather grey area with regard to legal issues, as well as ethical issues. At least in the U.S., Oblivion mods are protected by existing copyright laws, even if no copyright is actually registered. This means it's illegal to redistribute a mod, for profit or otherwise, without the express permission of the owner of the mod (who would be considered to be the developer or his authorized representative). Of course, you have to get caught and the owner of the mod has to have the means to pursue the case in court, and we know that's not going to happen -- at least in fair majority of mods which exist.

 

However, I, too, am opposed to modders removing their work from this site merely because they're "moving on". If they aren't interested in their mods anymore then they should expressly release them into the public domain if they can't find someone else to take them over. We've seen some popular and useful mods disappear over the years. As has been pointed out, though, if the mods were good they'll eventually re-emerge, either through private file-sharing or networks that use such technology as BitTorrent. It's inevitable, and the modder has, basically, ensured that the very thing he didn't want to happen will happen.

 

I would also like this site to adopt a policy that I know it will never adopt. Namely, that when a modder just disappears (say, no site access for a year) then all of his mods are automatically placed into the Caretaker account so that someone would be able to pick up where the modder left off. As it stands, there are a number of very promising mods on this site which are in limbo because the modder hasn't responded to questions in years. If anyone modded the mod and released it, and was reported for "pirating" the mod, then he'd get into trouble, just as if the original modder were still around to report him to the admins. Absence does not make up for a lack of general permission to "use and modify and/or release/re-release my mod any way you see fit", but that should be part of the package deal of using the Nexus as a file repository. I know that if I created a popular mod and something happened that I was no longer able to support it, that I'd be delighted if it lived on, and even got updated and improved, long after I was gone.

[Maigrets]

As Savage says, people leave places for a reason. What people tend to forget it's that (most) modders create mods and choose to share their own work. It's (usually) not the sole purpose to create it for downloaders and as they didn't get involved in the process of hours, days or months of work, they don't really have the claim to be able to download the mods just because they liked them. You'd be surprised how many modders already keep the majority of their mods to their own in the first place (small or big). If an author feels secure enough they know perfectly well how to change permissions or to leave it to someone else. There's already a service to put your own mods under an account called the 'Caretaker account'.

 

Most modders retract their mod as either someone has been trolling them too often or because they are unable to support them for a particular reason. As they are the authors they usually know well enough what trash is to be expected if they don't update their mods. Especially when certain patches of the game or other mods would make their own incompatible. Others just don't feel the old trash they got would deserve anyone to play their mods. Some modders stop playing a game and thus stop supporting their mods, as most people that respond to a filepage haven't read the readme or similar. It'd be unfair for the people with genuine issues not to be helped properly by the one that knows exactly how their mods fits together. Another thing is that even how much you can trust someone, they will never have the same vision as you and might turn your mod into something you don't like, the same accounts for anyone that'd be able to download your mod in the first place. People don't forever 'have' to contribute to the community, they usually gave more than they received (if any) so why should they?

 

I understand and support the appeal to think about it, but it's not the way anyone owns anything to anyone here. It's appreciated, not permitted :).

 

This reflects exactly my thoughts.

 

Now, someone will come along and say all assets used actually belong to Bethsoft in the end which is true of actual game files and resources. However, that is not true of models, textures, written texts and other original work made by the modder. These are things that belong to the author of the mod and can be freely given or revoked as they see fit.

 

Good thread, ziitch. It's very true: although the modder has every right to remove mods if they want to, an inevitable side effect by doing such is people uploading your mod elsewhere without your permission. People start asking, sharing links privately, and before you know it, there's a whole network of people exploiting your hard work, just because you decided to take down your own link. It's usually better to know your mods are in good hands than in the hands of people blatantly going against your wishes, y'know?

 

I'm going to disagree with your statement, Eiries. How does a mod author save themselves from all of the above just by having their file available at all times? Private sharing, unauthorized re-uploads, etc, etc go on whether or not the original creator (besides Bethsoft) has a working link to their mod and instructions for it's use.

 

Take certain international forums...if anyone thinks their mods are safe on this, or any other site they choose to host them on, they are very much mistaken. On a particular Chinese forum they even have a thread with links and instructions to download the actual Oblivion game (and probably others) via a well know torrent site. Mods that are hosted here are also hidden on these forums behind heavy posting.restrictions. This doesn't only apply to the Chinese either.

 

I don't think they or anyone else who wants something badly enough will have second thoughts just because the original version of a mod is hosted on and maintained on a mainstream site. Writing a Readme with instructions for use whether that be free to use or restricted, is really a waste of time in most cases as it will be ignored by the people who would take it anyway. All it does is tell the people who would already respect it what they already know.

[Fatalmasterpiece]

Legality has nothing to do with it. It is the Nexus' policy to not share files or mods without the original authors consent. Since the author removed his mod, his consent is evidently not given in the most broad and general sense.

[Ferryt]

Maigrets, while you're certainly correct that any good mod is going to be re-distributed, regardless of the author's desires, I also believe that yanking your mod from public access is going to increase the rate of piracy dramatically. The reason is quite simple and requires only a very fundamental understanding of human nature. If your mod is good then people will want it. If you quit supplying a source for it then people who would have relied upon you as that source will seek it elsewhere and other people will make it available for them. You therefore have the original pirate network, plus an additional one that you created, yourself, by the very act of withholding the release of your mod. x + y > x

 

Fatalmasterpiece, I beg to disagree with you. Legality has everything to do with the potential consequences of re-distributing a mod without the owner's permission. This is very clearly delineated in U.S. Copyright Law and precedence has been set in U.S. courts on according "shareware" and "freeware" copyright status which would obviously include under Common Law. Mods which are distributed on Nexus for which the author has not explicitly given up certain rights are protected under U.S. Copyright Law as "freeware" and are not in the public domain. You can, therefore, be taken to court and sued for re-distributing a mod without the author's specific permission. Nexus' policy has nothing to do with my statement because I wasn't addressing it. You're talking about the apples in the barrel. I'm talking about the oranges in the same barrel. The policies of this site regarding the distribution/re-distribution of content posted here is a different issue, altogether, however valid they may be. All Nexus can do is ban you from the site. The author of a mod can, theoretically, hurt you in your pocket book. We're both right. We're just talking about two entirely different things that apply to the same situation.

[Zaldir]

Fatalmasterpiece, I beg to disagree with you. Legality has everything to do with the potential consequences of re-distributing a mod without the owner's permission. This is very clearly delineated in U.S. Copyright Law and precedence has been set in U.S. courts on according "shareware" and "freeware" copyright status which would obviously include under Common Law. Mods which are distributed on Nexus for which the author has not explicitly given up certain rights are protected under U.S. Copyright Law as "freeware" and are not in the public domain. You can, therefore, be taken to court and sued for re-distributing a mod without the author's specific permission. Nexus' policy has nothing to do with my statement because I wasn't addressing it. You're talking about the apples in the barrel. I'm talking about the oranges in the same barrel. The policies of this site regarding the distribution/re-distribution of content posted here is a different issue, altogether, however valid they may be. All Nexus can do is ban you from the site. The author of a mod can, theoretically, hurt you in your pocket book. We're both right. We're just talking about two entirely different things that apply to the same situation.

 

You do realize not everyone on the Nexus are from the US, right? Even Robin Scott is from the UK.

So it wouldn't go under US Laws, it would go under the laws of the country the developer of the mod lives in.

But yes, it is a legality issue, but it's more a issue of morality, as in very few cases it would be brought up to legality instances, but rather taken on a personal level.

I freely share my mods, and only request a heads-up when people want to edit and redistribute it, but I understand people not wanting to let anyone edit it. It is their work, and they wouldn't want people messing around with it.

 

I think it's sad that people take down their mods, but it is after all, their decisions...

[Fatalmasterpiece]

@Ferryt

 

In regards to this forum, the Nexus policy is what matters, first and foremost, about soliciting links to alternative methods of downloading withdrawn mod content. What you do on your own time is beyond anyone here's notice, business or probably caring.

[Ferryt]

Zaldir, I'm quite aware that this is an international community. However, I'm only familiar with U.S. Copyright Law and to a lesser extent International Copyright Law, so I was only addressing the former. That in no way invalidates my comments, since most countries do abide by copyright laws which are similar, in general principle, to those of the United States, although it's possible that some may not yet have a precedent in their own courts with regard to the status of "freeware". Note, however, that any time a copyright infringement crosses International borders that the laws of the next country can play a part, so it's not just the country of origin that matters. That's why many pirate websites are located in countries like Russia, which don't really care about copyright laws of other countries, in spite of the the fact that they may have been signatories to the Bern Convention (which may or may not protect a mod -- that is probably still something which needs to be tested in court).

 

Again, Fatalmasterpiece, you missed my point completely. I'm not talking about this forum or anything related to it. My comments in no way touched upon the right of the staff, here, to run this place however they see fit. Other people had already covered that angle quite adequately. My comments were totally about the potential[ i]legal[/i] repercussions of redistributing software without an author's permission, even if you did get it free. I was merely pointing out an issue that seemed to have been ignored in the discussion, and that there is a potential legal aspect to this. Would it ever actually get to a court? I seriously doubt it, but you never know for certain.

[ziitch]

Well, I was never thinking about the legality of redistribution. Although, if you do try to take someone to court just because they re-distributed your mod, maybe you're taking modding a little too seriously? With the EULA, mods aren't supposed to make a profit anyways, so if you win the case, wouldn't you make a "profit" off of it and break EULA?

 

However some modders do try to make very specific instructions on what they can do with their mod, but there's not many who actually do this - Mostly those who don't understand English. Personally my advice on this is this it's just best not to add such instructions and instead just enjoy the simple fact that people are using your mod, give or take those who have modified it to their own liking.