Final dialogue with companions won't trigger

[mcgoy]

For files installed with dazips, the folder stays in Addins, but any portions of the mod in Addins aren't used.

 

any files in packages/core/override have to be removed manually

[Katarsi]

There's one interesting thing as well :) Somehow I had managed to make White Teeth and Dragon Age Redesigned work together without conflict. I had tested this while I still had those saves. Just to be clear, I had installed White Teeth after the whole mess with the missing dialogue. It worked like a charm.

[Katarsi]

  On 1/15/2016 at 12:15 PM, mcgoy said:

For files installed with dazips, the folder stays in Addins, but any portions of the mod in Addins aren't used.

 

any files in packages/core/override have to be removed manually

I know - about the manual removal from override :smile: I thought that I was being careful with placing them properly so the files wouldn't conflict. However, I'm convinced that some dazip file had caused the problem, since my override folder was properly arranged. Everything is clean now, so the problem shouldn't repeat... I hope :blush:

 

As for dazips, their files in AddIns probably are used, since in the Qunari Update mod it's specified that files from AddIns and data folders must be deleted manually after uninstalling the dazip, so it could be uninstalled properly. Some mods obviously inflict the game more profoundly than others.

Edited January 15, 2016 by Katarsi

[MagdalenaDwojniak]

Let's start with the basics.

 

ZRS and ZDF are not compatible and will never be. They affect the same files and there is no way to change them on your own. I talked with Cmessaz about it. Sorry. It just cannot be done.

 

As per ZDF's readme, GateKisses are to be installed after (and overwrite any files). The readme is actually rather good with explaining what to delete. ZevRing, ZDF, GateKisses, Extra Dog Slot, MRP and Rory by Immortality all work together. I have all these running without a hiccup, albeit Extra Dog Slot must be disabled when breaking out of Fort Drakon if you want to have a double heist. I did not do that and Zevran came alone, pulling his single trick, then when he joined the Warden Shartan (the mabari) came running and drooling happily as if he had been following Zev. But otherwise it is all good and well. Certainly not affecting the last farewells. I even took the dog to the Archdemon with no problem through the mod and choosing the final party went without a slip. You might want to use the whistle to call him off before choosing the three companions and then summon him once more. The cutscenes work correctly too.

 

I have Alistair's Dark Ritual and the nightmare mod too with the aforementioned mods. No conflicts. The ritual did not trigger due to my "fault" only. I did not realise it required to romance Al. Just use the .override file provided later and it should trigger.

 

Basically try a clean install, start with appearance mods, then equipment and the more important files like fixes. DAModder is useful to keep it tidy. With dialogue mods, read their readmes twice or more. This is crucial. ZDF, ZevRing, GateKisses, MRP and Rory can all be made to work together if you install them in the correct order by following the instructions. For ZRS, you have to choose one over the other. Naturally it requires ZevRing. Alistair's counterpart to ZRS is not my thing so I cannot tell you how to fix this part. Cmessaz told be LRS will work alongside ZRS. And the dog mod should be fine to matter what.

[Thandal]

I want to clarify one point about what MagdelenaDwojniak said above:

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

In DAO and DA2, the "Load Order" works very differently from the way Bethesda game players think of it. The way the Eclipse (Aurora, for DA2) game engine works to install mods is based on strict searching in alphanumeric-by-file-and-folder-name order. The engine starts by looking in the folders under the game's installation ("\Program Files...") then the ones under the player's profile ("\Documents\BIoware\Dragon Age...") The LAST major location examined is: "\Documents\BIoware\Dragon Age\packages\core\override". And it does the exact same searching within each of the folders in each of the locations.

 

Which means that you and I could have the exact same collection of mods we're trying to use in our games, but because I dumped them as "loose" files into my "\packages\core\override" folder, and you created separate subfolders for each mods, (which is a best practice) we get those mods working differently in our games.

 

In my case, if two or more mods contain a file with the exact same name then whichever mod I copy into my "\override" folder LAST is going to overwrite any files with the same names already there. ('Course Windows will ask me to confirm the overwrite, so I should know that happened!)

 

But in your case, both sets of files will exist, but the one(s) with a deeper position in terms of subfolder, or if at the same level, a later/higher position alphanumerically, will be used and the other one(s) ignored.

 

Example:

 

Two mods changing spell animations; Quickcast and Bettercast, each containing the files "spell1_ani" and "spell2_ani".

 

1. If I dump the loose files into my "\override" folder, the result is obvious: Last one copied wins.

 

2.. If I make two subfolders; "\override\quickcast" and "\override\bettercast", and put the files for each mod in its own one, then only Quickcast will be used because the engine will find the contents of that folder last.

 

3. But... If I place the files for Bettercast in a deeper subfolder; "\override\animations\bettercast", then those will be used instead. This is because the engine will have searched the "\override" folder and found neither, then searched "\override\quickcast" and "\override\animations" and found the files for Quickcast, then searched the next level of subfolders, found the ones in "\override\animations\bettercast", and so will use those.

 

Now imagine this situation with several complicated mods, each with many files, with only some of the their files having duplicate names, and add in the fact that naming the subfolders, (and how many levels to create) is totally up to each player! The results can be a mess of mods partially working, partially not.

 

The key is to examine the FILENAMES and search for any duplicates. If found, you have to decide which mod you want to use and delete the duplicate file(s) from the other. If that breaks the second mod, then you can only use the first one. If the rest of the second mod is still functioning, you can keep both. (NOTE: If you determine that you want to use all the duplicated files found in just one of the mods, you can use appropriate folder naming to ensure the "right" one is found last. This lets you keep both mods intact so that if later you remove the one, the other would still work.)

 

 

Good Luck!

 

 

TL;DR: The last file found when searching alphanumerically though all your mod folders is the one that will be used in-game.

[sapphim]

This is my understanding, which may or may not be entirely correct: load order is alphabetical within packages\core\override but it's different (and stupidly complicated) with dazip addins. Those sort by priority (but most addins are just set to 100 by default) and then by installation order, where I believe mods installed later override mods installed earlier. BUT the game also processes everything in addins\[module]\module BEFORE everything in addins\[module]core (so core overrides module), THEN everything in packages\core\override. So an addin could overwrite and be overwritten by the same module at the same time depending on their installation order, priority, and whether their files are in module or core (or packages\core\data......)

 

Addins would work better for compatibility if nobody overrode core if they didn't need to, or if everybody just made standalone modules that don't affect Single Player. But since this is absolutely not the case, the definite easiest way (though not easy by any means) to assure inter-mod compatibility for SP (but potentially mess with standalone campaigns) is to just manually install everything as loose files in packages\core\override and sort out load order by hand. (But then this won't work for any mod that needs its own talktable.......)

Edited January 17, 2016 by starrarte

[mcgoy]

First - yes, it would be better not to change Core/Single Player resources. I try to avoid it whenever possible.

 

I think we all agree that the order is always:

1. DAO/Bioware code

2. Addins

3. Packages

with addins overriding DAO/Bioware and Packages overriding both (if the same files are present)

 

For dazip files/addins, the toolset creates the folder structure within the addin folder for that mod. A modder would have to manually agree to have two versions of a file in the dazip for the file to be located in a dazip in two places. Not that it can't happen, but it is more likely to be a bug than a feature :D

 

Processing Addins before Packages is established as the order, but within Addins and within Packages, it seems to be ... random. I'm not going to repeat the testing, but here is the reason that I say that:

 

Party Pickers - three mods with party pickers use the prefixes

dt_

kc_

mer_

for file names and within the names of the dazip/folder. Based on the 'alphanumeric' theory, if I use zzz_ for my mod/file prefix, my partypicker will be used and I won't have to create override versions for each of the other partypickers. Experience tells me that this is FAR from true. It just gets hideously worse if both the appearance and the Companions that appear on the partypicker were modded. The appearance of the partypicker can be from one mod while the Companions that appear are from another. This causes the ever popular Companions embedded in (or under) the floor!

 

This is true both within the Addins folder and within the Packages folder. As anyone who has had to release compatible partypickers can verify, you have to tell players MAKE SURE YOU HAVE ONLY ONE VERSION IN YOUR OVERRIDE. That doesn't usually help, but it makes the mod author feel better.

 

~~~~~

The same is true of modifying Core/SP resources within the Addin folder. If multiple mods modify the same resource, the mod that is actually used doesn't appear to have anything to do with the order based on the name of the mod. I would suspect that it has more to do with the "StringID Begin", but I'm not going to spend time trying to test that theory.

 

Modifying Core/SP resources within Packages folder, I suspect that the folder names aren't that important or every modder would be naming their folders aaa_ or zzz_ to make sure that THEIR variation is the one that is used.

 

~~~~~~~

Order of installation is absolutely meaningless to the game. It may matter to the various mod managers or it may make it easier for the mod author to explain which files to remove for compatibility, but the game engine couldn't care less.

[sapphim]

edit: ah, never mind

Edited January 17, 2016 by starrarte

[Thandal]

@Katarsi; If you (or the mods you're tweaking) are making changes to things in the "C:\Program Files (x86)\Origin Games\Dragon Age\modules\single player" folder, you're waaaaay beyond my DAO modding skilz. :laugh:

 

 

@mcgoy; I can't believe that the search order for files in "\addins" is random, but absolutely agree that it's not worth all the re-testing to figure it out. (Yet. Well... Maybe. Damn this OCD! :tongue: )

 

 

Side Note: In checking things for this topic I noticed that I have two sets of some of the official DLC in the "\addins" folders. One set under "\Program Files...", and the other under my user profile. I believe this is a leftover from when I had the original retail disc install -plus- all the DLC as it was released, then did a complete re-install when I got the retail disc of the UE, then did another complete re-install to have all my BioWare games via EA/Origin.

 

Any mods packaged as .dazip files put themselves in the "\addins" folder under my profile, but I *think* EA/Origin put the official ones under "\Program Files". So my first set of tests will be to remove what look like BioWare's .dazips from the set under my profile and see if I can still load LS, GoA, WH, and "The DLC Which Must Not Be Named".

 

 

Wish me luck as I head down the rabbit hole! :thumbsup:

[mcgoy]

  Quote

 

@mcgoy; I can't believe that the search order for files in "\addins" is random, but absolutely agree that it's not worth all the re-testing to figure it out. (Yet. Well... Maybe. Damn this OCD! :tongue: )

That was what I was told when I started creating Companion mods and based on the weird results if I forgot a Companion mod when I was creating partypickers.... It may not be RANDOM, but it isn't something that a human can determine just by looking! Now if you find out that it is alphabetical order with the last mod being the 'winner', let me know! I have a mod idea that.....

 

  Quote

 

Side Note: In checking things for this topic I noticed that I have two sets of some of the official DLC in the "\addins" folders. One set under "\Program Files...", and the other under my user profile. I believe this is a leftover from when I had the original retail disc install -plus- all the DLC as it was released, then did a complete re-install when I got the retail disc of the UE, then did another complete re-install to have all my BioWare games via EA/Origin.

The UE version has the official DLC only under \Program Files....

If it helps.

 

I have carrots if you want to leave a trail to get out!